bolshy teens & a single mum

[teentorm]

Anyone know of a really good book which might help? We're getting to the stage of 2 teens (boy & girl) constantly fighting between themselves and recently refusing to do anything they're asked by me, breaking house rules, etc. Tried removing 'privileges' ie watching TV/using computer for other than homework, but finding they're completely disregarding that. Need to work out way of living where some respect remains and with sanctions that work. There's no back-up. Their father won't help and there's no other adult around. Discipline's never been an issue before and it's getting a bit desperate now. Any advice would be welcome, plus the names of tried and tested books!

oh gosh, poor you! I have a teen and two small children and they fight all the time, you have my sympathy having two big ones!

I haven't so far found anything that helps so I am completely useless but I'll bump your thread for you and keep an eye out and nick everyone else's ideas.

Good luck

Well I can only offer my sympathies. Teens are hard hard work. I read a great book called 'Get out of My Life but first Take me and Alex into town'. It is excellect and actually made me readjust the way I view my teen. That said, I then went and completely forgot all about the book and carried on as normal . Seriously tho, its a great book. Failing that you just have to ride the storm (its what we all do) and its a very bumpy ride. Nothing seems to work in my house either. Would love to have my happy smile child back, maybe in a few years Good luck

If only I had the answer - bad enough when there are 2 adults around to even things up a bit. The only way I can stay reasonably sane at the moment is to think that dd has been temporarily replaced by her evil double and that the real dd will be back soon. Then I can be more objective when she's being evil.
As for sanctions, it has to be something you can actually control. I've found withdrawing favours like lifts sometimes works. Also, limiting computer /telly (but be prepared to set pc up as password protected or hide the mains cable). Not sure about grounding if you think they might just ignore you.

Thanks for all the sympathy. I went easily through my teens (even my mother agrees!), so dealing with what's going on is even worse than I'd feared. A friend lent my 'Get out of my life ...', which is very helpful in terms of understanding where the kids are coming from & how they think, but I'd maybe better go back to it, cos I don't remember it being so good on ideas. What I'm really looking for is a Toddler Taming for teens! I'm not just facing the verbals, but sometimes also being hit and kicked - how do you deal with that?! I agree, AuntEm, that the sanctions have to be controllable. I've even thought about taking the plug off the TV, but then my 9 yr old - who looks on with horror at her brother and sisters' antics - would suffer too. I tried discussing what we could do for a trial period to make everyone's lives easier, as I took them to their dad's this morning. The 9 yr old came up with some good ideas, but there's no buy in at all (which is what I was working towards) from the others; instead, all I got was a litany of complaints about the way I do things. I've promised to look at those, but could get no similar undertakings from the teens. Aaaaaaarrrrrrgggggghhhhhhhhhhhh! Please keep your ideas coming, as I'm wondering how on earth I'm going to keep going/sane.

Of course it all your fault-they are teenagers!!

I'm will read this thread with interest as my daughter (age 13) is behaving in a atrocious way and we also have a younger child ,who is witnessing verbal and at times, physical crap, so I understand the frustration that you are feeling.

I have no great answers as we feel like we are riding out a continuous storm here.We have withdrawn priviledges ie NO internet useage allowed as she abused our trust with that one,NO pocket money until she is prepared to get off her arse and do her chores (bedroom is like a disaster zone and I am damn sure I'm not cleaning it up!)all this really is having no effect tbh.

We also have stealing (from us and tonight,she's crossed over that line by 'mistakenly' walked out of a shop with goods-Police haven't giving her a caution but I have questioned before certain items appearing on her person and in room-I haven't given her the money as she doesnt do her chores) .We have a lock on our bedroom door to stop that now and all money has to be put away.

I will wait for answers too! We need Custys wise words

I've just ordered this book, I can completely relate to the OP, I too am on my own, with an 8year old with SN, an 11 year old sensitive soul and a 13 yo who has over the past year or so morphed into a demon!!

I've just ordered this book off Amazon, too. I just hope I can last the few days till it arrives, having reached rock-bottom over my nearly 13 yo dd. I just feel so alone and a complete failure as a mother. I've been sitting at work in tears all day, dreading the moment I have to go home. One day she went to bed an angel and woke up an alien. It was sometime in the summer. She does all the stuff I've read on here, but I just cannot cope with it. The thing is I have no support. Her dad left before she was born and has never supported me. Despite being totally unreliable and never taken any part in her life, he only has to turn up ocassionally (like 3 or 4 times a year) smother her with chocolates and McDonalds and she thinks he is the best thing since sliced bread. He also is always on her side and tells her to take no notice of me, it's MY hormones! After a weekend of spending 24/7 in her stinking pit multitasking (watching tv, on msn and txting) I lost the plot (again) and threatened to murder her. She promptly txted her dad so he coming to whisk her off and feed her chocolate and have a good old moan about me. I hate myself and the person I have become. I used to be a fun person. Now all I do is scream and cry. I need to get a grip. O well time to go home.
I will not scream tonight.
I will not scream tonight.
I know I will.

oh god I'm in this as well.dd 13 is scaring the crap out of me atm. I feel floored by most of the behaviour.know what you mean about the 'alien'.dd has taken to lying as a matter of course- about where she is, what she's doing on the web, afterschools club that she isn't going to( out on strret corners) we argue about bedtime, homework,clothes,money the list goes on.I can't relax.

'Get out of my life...' book must be flying off the shelves. I've ordered it too.

Just read your last post teentorm, at them hitting / kicking you. They cannot treat you like this. You wouldn't take it from anyone else. You can't deal with everything at once, but if you start with one thing, go for zero tolerance on the violent behaviour. You owe it to yourself (and your 9yo). It's going to be tough but be strong! Good luck & hugs.

Family meeting to discuss things and air ideas from everyone?

God I think I need that book too..I posted this morning about my dd 12yo not a teen yet but sure as hell acting like one.Had the hitting situation last night too.

I have to face her later on and have it out- will hope to have mantra in my head cool green grass cool green grass, probably won't work though as even if I stay calm she FREAKS - she is so effin indignant , whole world against her.

God help us ,it really is liking having a toddler again.

if my children assaulted me i would call the police.

seriously.

make em think. i really really would. esp being a single parent as you are.

quite frankly dh has had both ds's against a wall before now - like alpha male shit..push...push...push until SNAP - and we know who is alpha male in my house. dh.

thing to remember is they always want from you, money lifts, food, washing, ironing, sewing a hem or a button - they do.

and if they dont give they dont get.

i used to be of the opinion ( am still am ) that they all live in my house so they should contribute to the chores, of course they didn't until i put financial remuneration in place. chores get rewarded and they do other stuff bcuse i tell em too.

no money unless chores are done. simple - ask them what they want to do - and agree a price - rther than dictate something.

i tell mine - if they can't get on to ignore each other.

Being assaulted is completely unacceptable, but I think getting the police involved is too heavy. For now, anyway. And when is behaviour 'normal' teen behaviour, and when is it something else that other professionals need to be called in to help with? DD (who's 12) started hitting and kicking me again yesterday. I held her wrists to stop the hitting and the kicking got worse. Of course it was all my fault and she only lashed out because I was holding her wrists! She's accusing everyone in the family of being violent towards her, yet she is the one who's constantly having a go. It's really upsetting my 9yo, who I'm getting worried about.
I'm finding it hard enough to keep the show on the road, but this teen stuff is doing me in. I'm teetering on the verge of exhaustion, which - of course - makes it even harder to cope. Now trying to organise a meeting with ex, who's also having v difficult time with her, as I'm seriously concerned at the accusations she's making. But not holding out any hope, as he so far hasn't worked with any joint parenting issues.
Big problem is that, until dd realises that she has a big part in this (rather than always being the 'victim'), she doesn't accept any need to do anything about it. And when I do (rarely!)get her to agree to any actions, she then later denies this!
I am withdrawing privileges - a new chair for her bedroom has been taken away; she can't have the phone whenever she likes. Computer's more difficult, cos of homework. And maybe the laundry will be next. Though personal care is not one of her strong points at the moment. Is anyone else finding this? Lack of using the shower for days, skanky, greasy hair as she 'can't be bothered' to wash it ...?? And I thought teen girls were picky about this!!! Oh for that magic wand and for this all to be over.

Being assaulted is completely unacceptable, but I think getting the police involved is too heavy. For now, anyway. And when is behaviour 'normal' teen behaviour, and when is it something else that other professionals need to be called in to help with? DD (who's 12) started hitting and kicking me again yesterday. I held her wrists to stop the hitting and the kicking got worse. Of course it was all my fault and she only lashed out because I was holding her wrists! She's accusing everyone in the family of being violent towards her, yet she is the one who's constantly having a go. It's really upsetting my 9yo, who I'm getting worried about.
I'm finding it hard enough to keep the show on the road, but this teen stuff is doing me in. I'm teetering on the verge of exhaustion, which - of course - makes it even harder to cope. Now trying to organise a meeting with ex, who's also having v difficult time with her, as I'm seriously concerned at the accusations she's making. But not holding out any hope, as he so far hasn't worked with any joint parenting issues.
Big problem is that, until dd realises that she has a big part in this (rather than always being the 'victim'), she doesn't accept any need to do anything about it. And when I do (rarely!)get her to agree to any actions, she then later denies this!
I am withdrawing privileges - a new chair for her bedroom has been taken away; she can't have the phone whenever she likes. Computer's more difficult, cos of homework. And maybe the laundry will be next. Though personal care is not one of her strong points at the moment. Is anyone else finding this? Lack of using the shower for days, skanky, greasy hair as she 'can't be bothered' to wash it ...?? And I thought teen girls were picky about this!!! Oh for that magic wand and for this all to be over.

teentorm - How old are they?

Custy speaks sense. Its all about currency. What is their currency? You say that the TV/PC ban didn't work. How long was it in place? Did you remove their phones and their games consoles? Personally I wouldn't let them have the computer for homework either. When mine take the p*ss I ban everything. Then I wait. DS1 caves quickly because of GCSEs and DD1 caves because life does not exist outside of MSN!

Sorry - didn't realise I'd hit the send button twice on the last post. DS is 14, DD1 is 12 and DD2 is 9. Difficult to work out what really is DD1's main currency; mobile phone is still only really used for emergencies & needed to get safely to & from school 7 miles away in the city. Perhaps I should really limit computer use for minimal homework, or take heed of MarsLady and ban it altogether if the behaviour ever sinks again to Saturday's low. Mind you, I did keel over later yesterday and called all the kids to the kitchen table. Told them I'd had it, was exhausted and asked how we would cope if I got ill. Apart from not getting dressed till 2.30pm, dd1 then helped out with chores without a murmur (and no pay, as I don't give it for basic help). I've been stuck in bed all day today, and she's been great at making cups of tea and fetching anything I needed since getting back from school. She even had a shower and washed her hair, and has tidied her room a bit without me saying anything - what a transformation! But it's pretty drastic if this is what it takes to have my girl back! And will it last only as long as I'm ill?

How does one actually succeeed in limiting/banning tv/computer access. I have failed completely. DD flatly refuses to do anything I ask of her and a request to hand over her pc/tv she just says no! We had endless rows about her school bag because the rucksack was not 'cool'. Neither was the shoulder bag. She insisted on taking her books in a handbag, a battle I cannot win, so I insisted she puts her books in a plastic cover because the bag is not waterproof and when it rains her books get ruined. After 1 1/2 terms and a note on the front door reminding her she still refuses, so this morning I took the bag. I actually brought it to work with me, so she could not find it. So guess what. She has not gone to school. I've just phoned her up and told her I'm taking the tv and banning msn and she just says 'no you're not'. I don't know how to enforce these bans without using physical force.

wotsitallabout - I had problems last week too which I posted under manhandling thread. I've banned internet, dvds and sleepovers for two weeks.
If I were you I would physically take the tv away , lock it in a cupboard or something, or do as custardo said she did on my thread and cut all the plugs off.
There's no messin with her!

LovesTents Yes I think you are right I will have to enter her room (aaaaaaargh)and remove the tv/pc, if I can get in there, but I will have to wait till she's not around to avoid physical violence. I don't think I could bring myself to cut off plugs, but I had to laugh. My DD informed me that she knows how to wire a plug.

When mine get banned from the PC etc I don't ask. I take. First I give them a warning that it is going to happen and then I take action.

You can do it wotsit.

its sucha fucking arseache though

finding a small screw deiver, wire stripper, wiring, re-wirning, insulation tape

my ds knows how to wire a plug

i can't tell you how much he couldnt be arsed to do it though

It's good to know I'm not the only one.

I'm a single parent to DS13 and DS8. DS13 has dramatic mood swings. There's usually some kind of 'reason' or trigger, but his reaction is so enormous - he screams and swears and roars and throws things and bashes things and punches walls - it can be quite frightening - and although he's often back to normal within minutes, it can take ME hours or even days to recover.

I think I'm quite good at dealing with it, most of the time. But even so, it's exhausting and depressing. The hardest, hardest thing is that there is NO backup - sometimes I really, really want someone else to deal with it - but there isn't anyone. Sometimes I really want to just run away - but I don't.

Some of the things that HELP are -

• Ignoring a lot of the minor stuff. I can't always manage this, but it's best when I can - I don't want to live in conflict, and it helps ME cope if I save my energy for the battles that matter most. For example, at the moment I am completely ignoring the disgusting mess that his room is in - after all only HE has to live in it! - but I make him pick up after himself in the rooms we all use.

• Once conflict has started, use absolutely every ounce of patience I have not to start shouting too! It's hard - and I don't always succeed - but the conflict ALWAYS gets worse if I shout back. It doesn't always get better if I stay calm, but it sometimes does, and at least it never gets worse!

• I talk to him afterwards about the effect his behaviour has, especially on me. I worry a bit about this filling him with guilt (!), but I think a lot of the time he doesn't actually realise he's being horrible, rude, aggressive etc - and he needs to know. It's also quite effective, because basically he loves me - he cares a lot more about upsetting me than about being in trouble at school.

• I have recently decided to get off his back about school. School doesn't suit him, or vice versa, and he gets into trouble. I used to try and 'support' school by making sure that if he was in trouble with school, he was also in trouble with ME. I'm not going to do that any more - I need all my energy to manage MY relationship with him - they can sort out theirs themselves!

• I DO use sanctions, but I'm not sure how effective these are. At times I have stopped his allowance, removed his playstation and/or access to TV/PC/phone/MSN, grounded him, given him extra chores, and done all of the above simultaneously! Often these sanctions slip because I am too knackered to enforce them! Grounding is absolutely the worst for dealing with bolshyness, because it means he's just around being bolshy more! Getting him to do extra washing up or chores is probably the best - if I can bear to have him around! - because he seems to then talk to me, and I often find out what's bothering him.

• Trying to focus on the positives, being extra-sweet to him and doing extra NICE things helps too. This is hard when I don't feel he 'deserves' nice things, so I tend to wait 'til I think he DOES ... but when he's happy, he's less bolshy (aren't we all?!) so I sometimes wonder if I should try this more often. Meanwhile, I try to make sure there are extra nice things for ME if he's being particularly difficult!

• It helps if I can remember it's not personal, too, but I often can't quite manage that!

Reading your other comments has helped though!

Try a book called "How Teenagers Think" by Jellyellie. I have found it very helpful. I have a 13 year old who has been a nightmare for the past year. Up until two weeks ago, when I called the police, she had been hitting me with no regard for how much physical damage she was inflicting on me. Phoning the police was not something I did lightly but he was great and has made her think about what she was doing.
The last two weeks have been tough for both of us but we are going in the right direction finally. I realise that I made the mistake of letting her have ( within reason) everything she wanted. The trouble starts when I say no!