DD came home 1.5hrs late because she wanted to. WWYD it WASN'T a year 11 leavers thing

[LegoTherapy]

I don’t want to overreact but I’m really annoyed with her.
She’s 16 and in the middle of her GCSEs and wanted to go out last night with friends to a park. Not a play park but a series of fields and open space next to the river where all the school idiots jump in and risk drowning every summer. It’s a mile away and very isolated. I was happy for her to go on the understanding I knew where she was, what time she was going, what time she’d be back and who she was with and that she wouldn’t be walking home alone. She agreed to be back at 9.30pm at the latest but I said preferably 9.15pm before it went dark.

Last year she ended up in A&E after going missing due to drinking and being given a spiked vape. She didn’t know where she was and it was extremely s art for us both, police involved etc. I didn’t know she was in the park, she was supposed to be at her dad’s. Due to this and the fact she doesn’t really go out, I worry about her going out to parks.

She messaged after 9.30pm to ask if she could stay out longer and I said no. At 10pm she said she was heading home. I then got a notification half an hour later to say she’d spent money in a take away. By this time I was really pissed off.

She came in 1.5hours late and then got upset that I didn’t want the pizza she’d bought me because I was going to sleep. She knew I was really tired and we’d arranged to watch our favourite tv programme together once she came home. I don’t eat late at night and she knows that. I sent her to bed and told her I’d speak to her in the morning. She may have been drinking but I don’t know for sure. I’m not too bothered if she was, depending on what and how much she was drinking due to the past experience.

I don’t want to overreact so please would you say what you would do/what you have done in situations like this?

Her location also wasn’t on and hadn’t updated for 24 hrs so I couldn’t see where she was for certain.

Her time management is awful generally and she’s late every day to school. I suspect ND (like me) but she won’t consent referral for assessment. She knew to be home before I was dark though so even if she found it suddenly dark she’d have only been 20 minutes late.

WWYD?

I write as a secondary safeguarding lead and mum of 4 - aged 10, 15, 18, 20

I'd make a Life360 agreement. She downloads Life360 and keeps it logged in. That means you know where she is. But the compromise (because at 16yo, some degree of compromise and flexibility is better than an authoritarian approach) is that you won't use her location against her. If you do, she's just going to remove it off her phone, so you won't know where she is.

Use this ^ mature conversation to talk about why her safety is important. Not just laying down thr law.

In terms of coming home late, I'd expect to collect my child at that age. They csn make their own way home on time if they like, but any argument then I'm driving to collect them (which the Life360 agreement helps with).

Also, consider context. Most schools round me had Y11 leaving day today. There will have been thousands of teen parties across the country. You surely remember being 16 yourself? So while I would normally have higher expectations with my teen, I'd have more flex on Y11 leaving date (and also prom night and results night).

The fact she bought you pizza, I think, is sweet. It was a peace offering. She knew you'd be disappointed and her gesture suggests you have a strong enough relationship with her that means she doesn't want to disappointed you. Many parents don't have that type if strong relationship with their teen. So I think you'll be OK.

Thank you for your reply.
She does have life360 and can’t alter apps on her phone due to the settings so I’ll be checking that today to see what’s happened. I doubt it was purposeful.
I trust her, I just don’t trust others after the events of last year.
Her leaving events haven’t happened yet and the park has been a regular thing that she’s only just found out about. I was happy for her to go. I can’t go and get her because I have a younger child in bed and am on my own. I don’t drive either and the park is massive. It’s not somewhere I’d be after dark and I don’t want her there after dark either.

Tbh I think you need to loosen the rules a bit. Sure i would punish her for completely disrespecting you last night but at the same time 9:30pm is quite early for a 16 year old to be home, let alone 9:15. Is there a better way for her to get home? A bus perhaps? I mean it’s only a mile so I would be reluctant to encourage bus use but if it helps you feel better about her being out a bit later it might be worth the consideration.

rules would be for me that she would stay out later but she must keep location in and always reply to any contact from you. Aside from that she does need to be allowed the freedom to develop the independence she will need in the next year or so when it comes to moving into adulthood.

teach her to always be aware of her surroundings, no noise cancelling earphones, can contact you at any time of need be etc. I would also come down harsh on lateness going forward. That’s something that really does need addressing. Mine were about 13/14 when they came home 5/10 mins last and the very first time I took their phone for the equivalent amount of days per minute late. It stopped lateness very quickly

I moved to London to start a Hospitality Training g courses 16. I think you need to loosen the apron strings a bit. She kept in touch. Praise her for that or next time she might not.

For my Y11 leaving day my whole year went to the park at lunch and got smashed. Nipped home at teatime to get showered, then all off to a club until 4am the next morning when I rolled home in a taxi. It was in the pre-mobile days, so my parents had no idea where I was but they were used to that so it wasn’t a cause for concern. I do think that now we CAN track our teens it ramps up anxiety when we CANT for whatever reason. It’s become the new normal

However - in your case OP I can see why you must be feeling extra jumpy about these kind of evenings given what happened to her last year. That sounds so scary and must have left a legacy.

It’s half term so I’d say 9.30 for a 16 yo celebrating end of school was quite early, and she did get in touch initially. The location being off needs a conversation. Dd tends to send me her pinned location on WhatsApp. I personally hated life360 stalking dc but the compromise is they keep me informed. Post GCSEs there’s a bit of a shift to them letting me know where they are/who they’re with rather than “please can I….”. 16-17 is a bit transitional and learning for both of you re new boundaries.

I completely get your worry after what happened last year and there's a conversation there to have with her around trust and responsibility, but I also think that buying a pizza and not arriving home on time to watch your program aren't major transgressions for a teenager as she wanted to be with her friends which is understandable. Maybe there's a little bit more flexibility needed.

I can understand why you worry about her being out after the previous incident, but 9.30 is very early for a 16 year old, especially on y11 leaving day. She will have felt very silly having to come
home that early when all her friends were out celebrating, hence her ignoring your curfew time.
As others have said, you need to talk to her about keeping her location on, replying to your messages, not drinking too much etc., but if you are too strict she will push back and be more likely to lie about where she is and/or ignore you as she did last night.

FWIW my ds15 was out with all his mates, male and female, last night as they'd had leavers assembly earlier. His curfew is usually 10 but we cut him some slack last night and he got back at 11.15 after walking his gf to meet her mum. They definitely needed to let off some steam after a very intense few weeks of GCSEs.

It sounds like this is more about you than your daughter. You were tired, you don't eat late at night, you wanted to watch a tv programme together.

I think you need to let go a bit. She brought you pizza as a way to make up for being late and you shrugged it off in a sulky way.

You sound a little needy. I get it. I'm dreading my 15 year old going out and getting a life away from me. I'm a single mum and he's my only child. But I'm going to have to grin and bear it as it's his life. They deserve to go and find their own fun away from us. They need to.

It wasn’t a year 11 leaving thing. It’s something that happens every Friday but she’s only recently found out about it and wanted to go. Her friendship group is unstable at best which is another worry incase they decide to leave her.
I wanted her home before dark because the park isn’t safe after dark. She could get a bus but the main concern is getting out of the park. It’s huge and just fields , woodland and river and also bordered by the canal on the other side. There are no lights in there and someone was fished out of the canal 3 weeks after going missing after drinking a few years back. She’s vulnerable and naive but does have a sensible head on her shoulders generally and I have no issue with her travelling much further in the day. It’s because it was dark and not safe. She said before I did that she’d be back before dark.
In terms of lateness, I have been on her case for years about it and tried all sorts to help her. The head of year gave up and just said she just because she turns up to lessons and will get excellent exam results then they aren’t bothered. There have been no consequences from school apart from the odd 20 minute detention. College will hopefully have a more robust approach.

in terms of apron strings, I’m trying to foster more independence. She wants me to collect her contact lenses from the opticians but I’ve said no because it’s 5 minutes walk and she can do it herself. The same goes for getting her a specific food she wants for tomorrow. The shop that sells it is 10 minutes walk at the most. She’s at that funny stage of wanting to be independent yet babied. Mummy will do it because I don’t want to and people might see me that I know 🙄 I don’t need to go out today and want a rest so no, I won’t be going. She will likely choose not to go herself and do without. That’s her choice.

I was up to all sorts at her age but also vulnerable and in dangerous situations where I was assaulted several times because my parents just let me do it so I’m overly cautious I think. I need to find a balance as does she.

My daughters were out clubbing at 16... sometimes.. well the ones with no alcohol.
Finished at midnight.
Very mature for their ages.. l was with my first partner at 16 and one of those daughters was ours..
They grow up much more quickly now.
I always said to mine.. l trust you.. but if you betray that trust then there is no going back.
They had money for a taxi home.
9.15 far too early for a 16 year old.
Mine were HE but did 8 GCSE'S and passed with high marks.
At 16 they has to be some trust as she goes into adulthood.

It’s DD that requests to watch something with me, not me although I value the time too and enjoy it. It’s a weekend routine that she looks forward to because it’s the time she gets on her own with me. I don’t think that’s needy.

You need to explain she should respect you enough not to have you worried unnecessarily about her.. I used it tell dd's I needed to know where they were incase anything happened. How would I know where to send police or go find them myself.. And staying out late was all well and good for them. They knew they were safe and sound having fun but I didn't... Did I deserve that added worry? Actually helped a lot. Never had issues with dd2 and dd3!!
Even adult dc at home needed to give me a rough time of getting in so I could get to bed and sleep!! Wasn't a massive deal obviously as ds stayed at home until 24!!

Is this the hill you want to die on.
16 isn’t 15
Not ideal in the middle of GCSEs but perhaps an agreement that no going out Sun-Thurs nights and revise and relax more with Fri and Sat. Give the freedom and give her a max time home if she’s late, deal with it then

9.30 for a 16-year old!?

She wants to be out with her friends, not watch TV with you!

I understand you concern but at 16 my DD doesn’t really have a ‘home by’ time on nights she doesn’t have school - she was at leavers last night - on a field with her mates.

she’s sensible, they all walk home together, she has her phone on and responds to messages.

ive had to pick up her sisters at 2am on a few occasions when they were drunk and lost - but generally they are also sensible kids.

So I agree it’s not a battle I’d pick

What I used to do with DD when she was out - older that this as she was 16 in the pandemic - was she would call me when she was walking home (and have location on) and we would talk as she walked home. I still did this when she was at uni now and then if she wanted to. I have a younger DC and on my own, but if needs be, I would take him and go and pick her up.
Clearly doesn’t cut the risk full stop but I knew where she was then and her progress home.

It’s crazy how different things are now.
When I was 16 in the 90’s, the parents had no way to track us or contact us, how we would’ve hated that! They had no idea where we were, we often lied and I came home a lot, usually felt bad making my mum upset, but we all still did it as we were having so much fun. I was allowed back later than that at 16 though
Now I dread the thought of my dd being in a park in the dark

My 11 year old came home at 8.30 last night. My 16 year old at midnight. I think 9.30 is way too early but I can understand why you're jumpy after the spiking incident.

People seem to be missing that she herself said that she’d be back before dark. I’m quite happy for her to be out later but not in the park. She’s not feel safe getting a taxi and just wouldn’t do it. She walks all the time with AirPods in and won’t be swayed otherwise. It’s more the fact she went against what we agreed on and that now there are trust issues.

It’s a tricky age, I agree.

We are all good now 🥰

Totally get why you’re annoyed, I would be too. You gave her clear boundaries and after what happened last year, it’s not just about staying out late, it’s about trust and safety. The pizza thing would’ve really wound me up as well, it’s like they mean well but miss the point.

I’ve got a 14-year-old and we’re just entering this stage. I’d have a calm chat once things cool off, not a telling off, but a “this is why I need to know you’re safe” kind of talk.

Also, a bit of a random one, but there’s an app called luna (weareluna.app) that’s actually really good for girls her age (my DD found it on tiktok) covers stuff like boundaries, time management, mental wellbeing, and it's all made by experts. My daughter’s found it helpful and doesn’t roll her eyes at it, which is saying something 🤣🤣🤣

Well, she asked to go out tonight. I reiterated the rules and why and she agreed to them, promising to be back on time. She’s still half an hour away in the park, right next to the river that I told her to stay away from, and she’s supposed to be home at 10. I told her before she went that if she wasn’t back on time this time she wouldn’t be allowed out again down to the park. She’s now not answering her phone. So how do I handle this now she’s done it again? And no, it’s not a leavers thing.

What time was she home? Did she keep Life360 on so you could see her location?

Given what happened last time, I'd have been going to collect her, especially since you don't like the area or her friends. Did you do that?

Not sure why you make the point about it not being a leavers thing. It is factually correct that yesterday was the last big GCSE exam, so I would not be surprised at there bring a lot of Y11 high jinx this week. "Leavers thing" or not.