Feel like my 15 year old daughter is gaslighting me

[BurningBuntingFlipFlop]

We were having a lighthearted chat about sibling order and how it shapes you, started by a tiktok I'd seen.
All fine, then dd starts saying how she has it the hardest (she doesn't, she's the most spoilt, only girl 3 brothers) that's fine, she's entitled to her opinion.
Then she says, she has the most pressure, loads of academic pressure, and when she got her report I only mentioned the one 4 she had.
Now this is so far from the truth that I lost it, I had the messages I sent her when the report came through, heaping her with praise that she did so well, had all excellent for effort, is working so hard and we're so proud of her.
My dh even sent £50 as a well done!
She then said well that's how you make me feel.. again with zero evidence of anything. I've told her she can feel however she wants but she can't just lie about what happened.
This happens pretty regularly, it's almost like she wants to be the victim of awful parents.. is that normal? She's always been a bit dodgy with the truth since being little and she lies about really trivial things, but recently she says things to me and then minutes later says I didn't say that, I get cross and then she'll use me being cross as the justification of what she said, if that makes sense.

She’s 15. It’s really common for teens to be hypersensitive to criticism.

You also sound hypersensitive to criticism tbh, given that you “lost it” in response to a fairly mild comment. I know teens can press your buttons so it’s not always easy to react as you’d like to, but it might help to try to model being calm and respectful, so that she can behave that way too.

Maybe when she says something like this in future just ask her what she means and discuss it together. You can remind her of the praise etc but in the context of a conversation about how she feels- she’s more likely to take the point if she feels she is being listened to.

You have my sympathy as these dynamics can be tricky.

One of my dds was like this!
I just resorted to saying things like ‘well that’s not how I meant to make you feel and I’m sorry’ on repeat. Even now she’ll recall things that happened that simply aren’t true, her siblings just roll their eyes at me and smile when it happens. We’ve all come to realise that we have to let it go as it’s just the way she is. Unless it’s about something critical in which case she gets told on mass!

Thanks for replying " lost it" probably wasn't that to be honest, just me saying what are you talking about, that's not what happened. But this feels like it's happening a lot, to the point that I am really sensitive about it. I feel like I'm trying so hard to be a good mum and she then just makes stuff up to complain. It might sounds like a mild comment bit it's the opposite if the truth, so what do I do. I actually sent her screen shots of the messages I'd sent at the time and she just ignored them and continued to argue that is how she feels. I said if you feel that way maybe read them and see that's not how we actually treat you, and she just continued to say it is.

Thanks Maybe, I will try that. I know I can end up getting frustrated and it doesn't help but it's infuriating.

Honestly OP I think these days sometimes it’s just not “cool” to have a healthy family & home life so kids will sometimes just invent a narrative that suits them.

My younger cousin is nearly 16, in year 11, and she has also started off with this over the last year or so. Her whole friendship group is a bit like that and it just makes absolutely no sense to me at all. One of her male friends, same age, tells them all how he’s been basically dragged up living in a council flat with 2 drug dealers for next door neighbours in the flat above, really painted this awful picture, so when I picked them up a few weeks ago after they’d been for food I said I’d drop them all off at their homes to save everyone getting different buses home alone and this lad was insistent he could get the bus etc I’d said no it’s not safe (10pm, dark, they’re only 15, 90 mins on diff public transport and considering what he has told me about these drug dealers he lives near obv not safe), imagine my surprise when he gives me his address and we pull up outside a big detached house in a lovely estate😂

If you have healthy parents and a lovely home life you have nothing to “brag” about, it’s not very cool! X

@BurningBuntingFlipFlop I really feel for you. My almost teenage son can do this. He’s Autistic so I don’t know if that plays a part. I told him that gas lighting is what abusive men do to women, and I find it distressing and would need him to stop, he apologised and actually hasn’t done it since. I think he was just trying to get his own way, normal kid, without realising how awful it is for the person you’re doing it to.

Sounds familiar - mine’s 14 and I regularly haul out old texts to prove she’s talking absolute shite! She’ll say “well it’s how I feel”. Everything’s terrible, everyone hates her, I’m never nice to her, etc. I’m the worst person to do this to as I really hate being lied to and get incredibly riled by obvious bullshit.

I think a better approach (which I do try to do!) is to listen to the feelings, not the fact they’re not telling the literal truth. Say “why are you feeling like that, what’s bothering you?” And mine will sometimes then actually explain a particular incident or problem that’s making her feel like that. Sometimes just listening to her moan for a while then suggesting something distracting will cheer her up.

I think teens do often want to be the victim because they’re in hormonal turmoil or emotional and it’s easiest to blame their parents. It’s part of why it’s such a stressful time (with some teens).

Maybe try a few weeks or rolling your eyes and walking away if it’s more trivial nonsense. If it’s something she’s actually really upset about sit down with a cup of tea and talk it out?

That seems like a terrible thing to do to a teenage girl who already feels unheard. This is exactly what she’s causing OP of.

OK, it sounds frustrating (infuriating?!) But she is telling you how she feels. Sounds like she just wants to be heard and sometimes we have to listen just to listen and not offer a solution or a justification (even if we know we are right!)

She is 15 and life isn't fair atm, no matter how the evidence presents itself, so yeah, a bit of gritting of teeth and 'that sounds really hard, I'm sorry." And some "how are you feeling today"s?"

Keep plugging away....she will get there in the end. Solidarity

Helpful advice, I appreciate it.

I grew up in an awful household with so much trauma. I had years of therapy, and I am trying so hard to make such my children have lovely childhoods. So I think it's especially triggering for me when she makes stuff up about how awful it is for her.

It's almost like all the therapy talk out there on tiktok etc makes them think they have trauma because you took their phone off them one time or whatever.

She seems determined to want to think I'm awful and it's bizarre. I know I need to find a way to ignore it because just arguing about it is helping no one.

I

I'm not sure she feels unheard. I regularly lie in bed with her while she opens up about her friends, boyfriend etc etc. She always comes to me when upset and I listen. I just don't get the criticism of me when it's total nonsense, completely fabricated.

I mean also, I think it is healthy for teens to have some rebellion, so rather rebel in a safe space against a mum who cares for you than in the wide world with people who don't. So don't despair!

I find it helps to remind myself that my teen isn't telling me objective facts that I have to agree with- they're telling me how they feel. For your DD, it's quite possible that she feels that she's not doing well enough, that she's under pressure etc, despite the praise you give her. She's telling you about it because you're her mum not because you're the one who's actually to blame. It's also much better that she's open with you about all this (even if it's hard to hear) rather than shutting you out.

Maybe try asking questions and talking generally about it all- sorry you feel like that, what do you think would help with the pressure? etc. You don't have to agree or disagree with her assessment of things, you can just use it as a starting point into a discussion.

It sounds like you have a really good relationship so you are obviously doing a good job!

It sounds like she's just being a teenager OP. The world is out to get them and their parents are the worst. It's just how they are - they need to distance themselves from you so they can leave home. It's healthy, although obviously irritating for you.

Ignore the criticism if you know there's no truth in it. She'll get over it in a few years.

I grew up in an awful household with so much trauma. I had years of therapy

Me too op, and I think this does make it more difficult to cope with “woe is me” moaning. But I also think teenagers do have a lot of stress and worries even if their family life is ok. If you had a dysfunctional family/abuse growing up then it’s hard to disentangle that from the fact that being a teen is tough anyway, though of course in a different way - and having supportive and kind parenting is important for them even if they throw it back in your face. The fact she’s moaning to you in itself shows she knows you’re there for her.

My Mum had an awful childhood, really terrible. She feels she done a much better job with us and is completely unable to see how awful some parts of our childhood were. In fact, most of it was pretty awful but I think she feels compared to hers it was ok so is completely unable to be accountable for her mistakes and look at her own behaviour. I now hardly speak to her, I think I would have been able to forgive her if she’d stop lying to herself about her shortfalls and admit her mistakes.

You love your children and obviously care enough to seek advice which is something my Mum wouldn’t do (unless it was to blame me for any issues) but would you consider joint counselling for the both of you? It may be she feels pretty unheard? I don’t know?

I was away with a group of women for the weekend and a common trend amongst us was the tendency for teenage daughters in particular to make us feel that nothing we do is quite enough for them, that they are constantly measuring us against how we treat their siblings, how they are treated vs their friends, etc. Throw in a culture where to have normal loving family lives with no trauma or huge grievances is considered terribly dull and boring and you have a receipe for this kind of carry on. OP, please try not to take it personally, the women I was away with are kind, warm and thoughtful people trying their best as I have no doubt you are yourself. It's a trend and hopefully a phase, you could tie yourself in knots trying to get to the bottom of it or change her narrative but all you might do is feed it. I'd steer a normal course of loving, kind but firm family life and let the chips fall as they may.

Maybe she does but I honestly don't think it's the case that I'm just comparing my childhood to hers so it's fine by comparison. She has a lovely life, I go above and beyond often. I feel guilty and worry about everything and always apologise to her when I know I might have been snappy etc.
It truly does feel like she just wants there to be something bad? She isn't depressed or anxious, this conversation wasn't her talking like that, it was just moaning about something that never happened.

Her older brother was there and he just rolled his eyes and walked off because he could see she was talking nonsense.
I said to her later, if you ever feel like we are putting too much pressure on you or you think we're only happy if you get good grades read through those messages and see that's not true. And she she said I don't know what you're talking about.. like didn't even understand why I was saying that.

I grew up in an awful household with so much trauma. I had years of therapy, and I am trying so hard to make such my children have lovely childhoods. So I think it's especially triggering for me when she makes stuff up about how awful it is for her.

Talk to your daughter about this. Tell her how anxious you are to be a good parent and ask what you can do to support her. Don’t get angry if you don’t like her feedback, ask why she feels that way and how you can work together to understand each other better. You are supposed to be on your daughter’s side, not locking horns with her, try to make this a partnership.

I think it’s part and parcel of being 15. I’ve three boys and the 15 year old (others are older) is adamant that the others are favourites and he’s not when it couldn’t be further than the truth.

but I think it’s their reality and it’s maybe for us to work out why?

I think you might encourage this pattern of behaviour if you keep trying to get her to see your pov and she’s knows it’s bothering you

I agree it’s always right to try and work out what’s behind what teenagers say and question whether she does have a point but I think this “gaslighting” type of thing is fairly normal teenage behaviour. They like to rebel a bit and it’s part of growing up to detach and disagree with your parents even if it’s illogical.

My advice would be to ask yourself honestly if she has a point or if there is anything in what she says, which it sounds like you’ve already done, but then don’t feed it. I would probably say something like “well I don’t agree with you on that” in a fairly breezy way and then move on.