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Teenagers

Parenting teenagers has its ups and downs. Get advice from Mumsnetters here.

18. I thought it would've improved by now.

15 replies

Whenwillilikehimagain · 05/12/2023 08:39

Long. Sorry.

As the clock turned midnight on his 13th birthday, someone stole our kind, positive, compassionate son and replaced him with a grumpy, judgemental, entitled and argumentative son. We used to be so close. Now I wish he wanted to go to uni for him to wake up to the real world and give us some space from each other. Careful what I wish for, I guess.

He has improved his ways over the last couple of years, he, when in a better mood, admits he regrets the way he's treated me and his brother. DH was stuck in the middle. My problem is I won't let things go. I hate the rudeness, tone and obnoxiousness. I argue back. I take responsibility and hate myself for this.

He (son) and I have had counselling (separately). No idea what he talked about but I have become better at not biting (though unfortunately sometimes I've sucked up and ignored so many irritating/rude behaviours that a minor thing will tip me over the edge. I lose his respect.

I worry about the effect our blow ups have on his self esteem. There's always a negative cloud around him (from him to us and us to him). I worry that he thinks we hate him and will do something to hurt himself.

He did great at GCSEs and used to set himself a goal and do everything he could to reach it.

He smokes weed with his mates occasionally, and this started in the summer after GCSEs, the same time he lost his mojo, drive, goals.

He just wants money. Money money money. A-levels to get him a job with money (not one he'll enjoy). He's not doing great at the new school. They're negative towards him (they really are) and therefore more negativity.

He works hard to earn money but he LOVES to spend it. Always beyond his means. Then he's skint and even more grumpy and hard work until the next payday.

At home he's sullen, argumentative and entitled. Has use of our car we paid for lessons, insurance.

He's wasting his Child Trust Fund (not sure how much he has left) but has wasted it on food, petrol and named clothing/trainers. He won't be able to buy a car now, let alone insurance. We can (and have) used the car as leverage.

Everything is someone else's fault. Never his.

I started life in a council house. DH and I have been able to work/retrain and do up houses so now we live in a house that's quite impressive (asset Rich, cash poor). DH and I will never forget where we've come from, never not be grateful for the chances we've had in life and try VERY HARD not to judge. Unfortunately, son thinks he can make judgements despite me reminding him of our family's backgrounds, how he's no more entitled to anything that anyone else. He has this air of snobbery about him. I hate it. He's done nothing to deserve it apart from be born when he was.

I could go on. The point of my post is that by now, I thought he would have come back. Be better company and we'd be falling out less. I just can't see it ever getting better, he is a different person with different opinions and values to us now (think polar opposite). I know he's entitled to his own, of course, but we wouldn't choose to spend time with someone with such opposing views, would we?

It seems it's all about status, ego and external validation meanwhile he makes us all nervous of what angry, shitty mood he'll come home with. Other people don't see this side to him. He saves it for us.

To clarify, he is generally a good lad. Toes the line. Never given us huge issues like some families have to cope with... It's all low level attitude, tone, show and entitlement and I'm afraid to say it, I actually need a break from it. When will he soften his edges and come back to us? 💔. We love him so very much and he has some wonderful, beautiful qualities under the brashness. Honestly, I won't go into it, too outing, but underneath this hard, prickly shell we know (and have seen) he is still in there. 💯. I know however, he just feels got at and like he can't do anything right because of our constant negative reaction to his negativity. 🥴

Thanks for getting this far.

OP posts:
Whenwillilikehimagain · 05/12/2023 21:40

Too long to even read 😂

OP posts:
Brandyginger · 05/12/2023 21:43

Oh @Whenwillilikehimagain i feel for you. I have a 14 nearly 15 yo and we are very much on the same path. It’s heartbreaking and not how I pictured my life. I’m sorry I don’t have any advice as I’m right in the thick of it.

Libre2 · 05/12/2023 21:47

No advice from me either as I am at exactly the same stage as @Brandyginger but I was just thinking today, how in the name of all that is sacred, do we come out of this period liking him? I love him because I have to and because I just do but I can't stand him as a person at the moment, which is a shame.

So no advice (other than the brain apparently doesn't stop developing until 26- joy) but plenty of solidarity.

Whenwillilikehimagain · 05/12/2023 21:50

Group hug 🤗

OP posts:
Quitelikeit · 05/12/2023 21:53

This can be quite common - why on earth do you engage with him when he is in one of his moods? My tip is to avoid, avoid, avoid and then some

Your son won’t have different values because he was raised by you and will share your belief system even if it doesn’t feel like it right now

Not sure why you think uni wouldn’t be a great thing - we did a little celebration after dropping one of ours off 🤣🤣 because like you we had simply had enough. Now the relationship is totally different and they have emerged from ‘the other side’ if you like

It’s hard not to comment when his shortcomings are in your face each day but try to engage as leadt as you can. You don’t need to be hostile etc but just retreat as and when needed for your own sanity

At 18 his brain is far from developed- think of him as a giant toddler in times of frustration!

May I ask what are most of your rows about?

FrenchandSaunders · 05/12/2023 21:54

He’s still young, he’s got a lot more growing up to do.

I would try and detach a bit, back off with any negative comments and pick your battles.

Much easier said than done I know!

Pukkateaandbiscuits · 05/12/2023 22:58

It will get better. I promise. It just takes longer than you imagine. Especially in young males. He will return to your core values, so please don’t worry about that. He is trying on different personas right now to try and work out who he is.

In the meantime, try and preserve your own sanity by stepping back, not engaging in any rudeness, focussing on your own life and give him the message that being superior and judgemental doesn’t get any attention. Walk out of the house if you have to. Be too busy to engage in arguments. You do need to “let go” of the negativity. Hard though it is. Clean slate every day. And be a good role model about how to live your life with purpose and fun.

He’s got a bit cocky and is at that difficult stage where he thinks he knows it all but underneath realises that he doesn’t have the competence to back it up. He’s frustrated that this is the case. It’s part fear, part bravado, part ignorance about life, part laziness, part uncertainty about where he is headed.

I think I would be focusing on him not taking responsibility for his own actions by expressing interest in his future career, asking with genuine interest how he is going to support himself, what his plans are once he leaves school, is he going away to college or uni. Don’t give the impression of anxious concern, pretend that you are fascinated to find out. Maybe suggest some days away to visit university towns? Or help him to arrange to see a mentor engaged in a career that he is interested in?

Make your expectations of him once he has finished A levels very clear. If he fails. If he passes. That he has to be in ft work or study or earning a wage or a mixture of both or some other valid employment. Also what you expect him to contribute if he is living at home.

I can tell that you are a brilliant, caring mum op from the wonderfully sensitive way you write about your ds, and the way you worry about him becoming disengaged. Also the way you admit to blowing up occasionally. We’ve all done it. The fact that you were prepared to engage in therapy showed him you were willing to work on your relationship, something he will come to appreciate eventually.

The way you write in your op takes me right back to the worst of the teen years with my dc who are all lovely, responsible, kind young adults now. Your son will come through it too.

He is being properly vile to you precisely because you were so close and he needs to reject you and every thing you stand for in order to individuate as an adult.

There are a couple of things about your post that would worry me:

  • the distinct change in his motivation and character
  • his constant need and obsession with money
  • his weed smoking
  • the fact that you are walking on egg shells around his moods

Are you sure he hasn’t graduated from weed and graduated to harder drugs? Even serious weed smoking can have a very detrimental affect on a young brain.

I think it’s ok to put in boundaries here and make very sure that you are not supplying the financial wherewithal for him to become entrenched in substance abuse.

I think in your shoes I would be taking him away as much as possible out of his current environment. Is there a relative in another part of the country or abroad where he can go and stay for part of the Christmas and Easter and half term holidays?

I would definitely be encouraging him to go away and study too once he has finished school, although it has to be his idea of course, and I would be giving him lots of responsibilities that are slightly above his level of competence, through working or volunteering.

* It’s nearly always true that when a teen becomes stroppy and angry at home, they are not being challenged enough outside of it.

Good luck op. Hang on to the fact that just by being there and sticking by him while he tests you, and still loving and worrying about him, and acting as an emotional shock absorber, you are helping him. He has to find his own way from this point on, so in a way the less you do for him now the better. It’s one of the hardest parts of parenting. Standing back and letting them get it wrong.. and letting them find their own way.

Whenwillilikehimagain · 05/12/2023 23:29

Pukkateaandbiscuits · 05/12/2023 22:58

It will get better. I promise. It just takes longer than you imagine. Especially in young males. He will return to your core values, so please don’t worry about that. He is trying on different personas right now to try and work out who he is.

In the meantime, try and preserve your own sanity by stepping back, not engaging in any rudeness, focussing on your own life and give him the message that being superior and judgemental doesn’t get any attention. Walk out of the house if you have to. Be too busy to engage in arguments. You do need to “let go” of the negativity. Hard though it is. Clean slate every day. And be a good role model about how to live your life with purpose and fun.

He’s got a bit cocky and is at that difficult stage where he thinks he knows it all but underneath realises that he doesn’t have the competence to back it up. He’s frustrated that this is the case. It’s part fear, part bravado, part ignorance about life, part laziness, part uncertainty about where he is headed.

I think I would be focusing on him not taking responsibility for his own actions by expressing interest in his future career, asking with genuine interest how he is going to support himself, what his plans are once he leaves school, is he going away to college or uni. Don’t give the impression of anxious concern, pretend that you are fascinated to find out. Maybe suggest some days away to visit university towns? Or help him to arrange to see a mentor engaged in a career that he is interested in?

Make your expectations of him once he has finished A levels very clear. If he fails. If he passes. That he has to be in ft work or study or earning a wage or a mixture of both or some other valid employment. Also what you expect him to contribute if he is living at home.

I can tell that you are a brilliant, caring mum op from the wonderfully sensitive way you write about your ds, and the way you worry about him becoming disengaged. Also the way you admit to blowing up occasionally. We’ve all done it. The fact that you were prepared to engage in therapy showed him you were willing to work on your relationship, something he will come to appreciate eventually.

The way you write in your op takes me right back to the worst of the teen years with my dc who are all lovely, responsible, kind young adults now. Your son will come through it too.

He is being properly vile to you precisely because you were so close and he needs to reject you and every thing you stand for in order to individuate as an adult.

There are a couple of things about your post that would worry me:

  • the distinct change in his motivation and character
  • his constant need and obsession with money
  • his weed smoking
  • the fact that you are walking on egg shells around his moods

Are you sure he hasn’t graduated from weed and graduated to harder drugs? Even serious weed smoking can have a very detrimental affect on a young brain.

I think it’s ok to put in boundaries here and make very sure that you are not supplying the financial wherewithal for him to become entrenched in substance abuse.

I think in your shoes I would be taking him away as much as possible out of his current environment. Is there a relative in another part of the country or abroad where he can go and stay for part of the Christmas and Easter and half term holidays?

I would definitely be encouraging him to go away and study too once he has finished school, although it has to be his idea of course, and I would be giving him lots of responsibilities that are slightly above his level of competence, through working or volunteering.

* It’s nearly always true that when a teen becomes stroppy and angry at home, they are not being challenged enough outside of it.

Good luck op. Hang on to the fact that just by being there and sticking by him while he tests you, and still loving and worrying about him, and acting as an emotional shock absorber, you are helping him. He has to find his own way from this point on, so in a way the less you do for him now the better. It’s one of the hardest parts of parenting. Standing back and letting them get it wrong.. and letting them find their own way.

Thank you for your lovely, kind and balanced response. Made me cry a little bit.

I do feel like he's lost his way. He has no real idea about what he truly wants to do. He's very practical and outdoorsy but thinks he wants a desk job (to chase the cash). When anyone suggests he might want to consider other ideas, he accuses you of doubting him.

He can be secretive about some things but pretty open about others. If I ask him directly, he tends to be honest (admitting stuff), so I'm not sure about other substances. He enjoys his new-found legal status, pubs and clubs, he says he doesn't do any other drugs. I don't know whether I believe him, I think I do. I don't see signs of it anyway. I don't worry about him getting involved deeper with the drug scene- he has strong core values and a good work ethic. I do however worry about debt (so easy to get into nowadays)/drinking too much. He will always get up early and put in a shift at work after a night out, though.

Someone asked why I don't want him to go to uni. I haven't said that. It's him who says he doesn't want to go (wants a break from education and to earn). He might do an apprenticeship degree later, once he finds out what he wants to do. I'm currently of the mindset that a break away and space to learn about others will do him the world of good. Uni or travelling (but I fear he won't have any money left for that).

Regarding the disengagement from education. He loved senior school, was well regarded and cool (and never received a single sanction). He had to move schools (no 6th form at his) and chose 3 tricky A levels, one of which he swapped after the first half term. He feels like this teacher hates him. The school take a stick rather than carrot approach and it's not been the right place for him at all. We've given him plenty of opportunities to leave/switch start again but he's refused. We saw an old teacher of his the other day and she made a comment that he's 'not a quitter' and there lies the point of the matter- he won't quit, but it's not looking like he'll come out of this with a good set of grades, either.

It's all so tricky. Show an interest, you're nosy/interrogating... Stay quiet, give space, you don't care.

I do need to stop biting back and ignore, ignore, ignore, though. I also need to let him make mistakes and mess up... It's so hard though when stakes are so high.

I appreciate all of your words, advice and empathy. Thank you.

OP posts:
Fivepigeons · 05/12/2023 23:55

18 is very young still. He's going to go on his own journey. Take a step back from it. There's stuff you can only learn by going thru it rather than being told by your mother. You say you know he's a good lad deep down.. those qualities he had as a child, the compassion and the determination and being able to set himself goals... they may be buried under a lot of teenage emotional disregulation right now but they are still there. Look at his behaviour.. it's pure dopamine chasing which is very common in teens... buying designer trainers which gives you a thrill in the moment but means you haven't invested in your future. Honestly people are very lucky when they have teens and young adults who don't go through this phase.

I think it's important to not escalate it by getting involved in petty arguments or getting to invested in what's going on with him right now. Teens need a lot of space to deal with their emotions and decisions... they are often unable to if challenged in the moment. You won't get anywhere rising to petty irritation or moodiness from him in the moment.
Basically just give him as much space as possible till he turns 21 and then maybe try again then! Not everyone turns the corner into maturity the second they hit 18. It doesn't sound like he's that wild.. just like he hasn't really made it into adulthood yet

Pukkateaandbiscuits · 06/12/2023 00:07

Yes that’s exactly it op. It’s scary because we want them to reach their potential and precisely because the stakes are so high. But try and relax, I know it’s hard, but there are so many different ways to skin a cat. And different flexible and circuitous routes to take. It may take longer than is standard but does that really matter? And besides, the ball is in his court now.

Honestly, the more you write about him, the more he sounds like a terrific young man underneath the current angst! Determination will allow him go far. And that’s very positive about the drug situation.

I wonder if talking to him about uni not being the be all and end all would do any good? About how he will incur a lot of debt and he has to be serious about it if he goes. About how a first degree doesn’t necessarily guarantee a good wage any more and how he will probably have to carry on studying post uni to obtain a higher than average salary. And tell him the world is crying out for practical and outdoorsy people.

I personally know tree surgeons, landscapers, civil engineers, who earn a fortune! I also know country park wardens, foresters, ecologists, land agents and thatchers, who don’t earn a fortune but who enjoy a very good quality of life.

Would he be interested in a National Trust volunteering holiday repairing paths or stone walls? How about taking him to Cirencester to look at the agricultural college there? Or interesting him in an apprenticeship in construction where he can earn a wage and study at the same time?

He needs something to get excited about. This is an area where a bit of a light judicious, parental steer or intervention can make a difference, by opening up some possibilities for him through a fact finding trip, a training day, a volunteering holiday or similar, and demonstrating that there is a whole world of different avenues to explore out there. Don’t be heavy handed about it but leave some brochures around or suggest a day trip and then “accidentally” run in to a stone wall repair volunteers day or similar?

Pukkateaandbiscuits · 06/12/2023 00:13

Forgot to say that it is really important that you try to hide your anxiety about his future and also that you don’t step in and solve his problems for him, because this gives the subliminal message that you don’t trust him to make decisions and that you have no faith in his abilities to carve out a future for himself.

Whenwillilikehimagain · 06/12/2023 15:10

Such gentle and helpful advice. Thank you so much. Thank you for hearing me.

We have told him that uni is not the be all and end all. That there are many routes through life and not everyone has to walk the same path. IMO unless someone 💯 knows what they want to do as a career, or their chosen career needs a degree qualification, it's best to wait to find what you love and what you hate before committing financially to a degree. However, he knows we will support him if he does/doesn't want to go. We just want him to be happy. He seems so unhappy when he's around us!

As hard as it is, I know they have to learn from their own mistakes. He'll no doubt learn how easy it is to waste/spend money once his 18 years of savings has gone on MacDonalds and trainers... It's a harsh lesson but may well be a lesson he learns early and takes through life.

Maybe not doing so well in his A-levels will give him the motivation in the future that he lacks now.

Ultimately, I can't control him or do it for him.

You're right. He's a great lad. It's just so hard to see the real person when there's a black cloud hanging around him at home.

Thanks again.

OP posts:
Rolo1324 · 07/12/2023 09:17

This is a really helpful conversation that resonates with me and my 18 yr old son. Been an incredibly difficult year but not massive bad stuff. Just not knowing where he wants to be or to do. Money a motivation but he hasn't been able to secure a job or stick at 2 apprenticeship opportunities. He seems to wing his way month to month by waiting duties or food delivery ( cash in hand) totally loved up with his girlfriend who studies at college and works weekends. All he does is drive her to and from places. He can be really unkind to me when I try to offer any advice. I understand about MH and brain development but feels really challenging at times ✖️

TM1979 · 07/12/2023 09:32

My ds is 19 and just coming out of the woods now. He’s grown up a lot in the last 6 months or so. Out of my 4 he’s caused me the most tears and sleepless nights. He went travelling in the summer and came back a different kid. Doing an apprenticeship now and has settled down.
Don’t give up hope..it will get better!

hurlyb · 12/12/2023 07:00

I needed this thread - mine is 16, already on the verge of being kicked out of college for not being engaged with study and I'm worried sick. He scraped his GCSEs with minimal effort after I revised with him for most.

It's so hard when you don't understand their mindset or motivations. He has an answer for everything- it's always someone else's fault. He is also a decent lad underneath the attitude and can be helpful and lovely. Usually when he wants something.

I have parented both of mine alone for years and quietly worry I don't have enough energy in the tank to stay positive during the hardest years so far. It's so helpful to read others suggestions for how to deal with this.

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