My son, my husband and his dad - very long

[Mirrordoor]

Not sure how to deal with this situation. My 15 year old son is quite teenage and stroppy at the moment. Regularly a bit rude/disrespectful but nothing major. Very argumentative so I tend to try not to get sucked into any kind of back and forth because everything I say is twisted and it's not worth it. He gets angry pretty quickly and rants and raves but then, if you don't get sucked into an argument, will calm down and apologise/become reasonable again quite quickly.

The issue is my husband. I don't think my husband always deals with things in the best way but it's got to the point now where he's actively not getting involved in things involving the teenager because it just inflames the situation, such as a fight between the two kids or a bit of backchat towards me. It means I'm left refereeing but in the long run probably makes life a bit easier. My son reacts very badly to my husband getting involved and it just makes things so much worse. Accusations of favouritism, "i wasn't talking to you, I was talking to my mother, why are you getting involved" etc.

My son's dad is not great and my son in one breath is completely aware of that and in the next is desperate for his approval, which i think is probably quite normal. He is quite a selfish man but great at talking the talk. He's got better over the years and is probably the best dad he has been at the moment but still regularly lets him down and doesn't put him first. We've had problems in the past with my son calling his dad if he's in trouble with me or had an argument with me and his dad seeming to just take everything he says at face value, then calling me quite annoyed and i end up having to explain the sitution to him. I find it quite galling since I spent many years trying to protect my son from the way his dad repeatedly let him down and rejected him. His dad was the main topic of conversation while he was under camhs care. Internally I think 'who the hell do you think you are to question me?' but I just deal with it as well as I can. I have tried to explain to his dad that he is an angry teenager who is exaggerating situations (not necessarily exaggerating, I'm sure he believes it when he's saying it and that is his genuine perspective at the time), which I thought he took on board, but I'm not so sure.

Today, it seems that an argument happened between my husband and my son over my son not going to the gym. He said he wanted to join, we've paid for a membership but he keeps coming up with excuses as to why he can't attend. We did make it clear that we'd cancel the membership if he wasn't regularly attending because it's only worth it if he goes twice a week. I think he's currently there less than once a week. My husband asked why he hadn't gone to the gym tonight and it somehow escalated into a argument. We're getting frustrated with him never sticking at things and always having excuses for why he can't do anything. I don't even know why that's worthy of an argument, but they had an argument and it got a bit heated. It sounds like my husband kept saying "whatever" which is not mature.

My husband told me about the argument when he got back but it didn't seem like a big deal. My son seemed fine and didn't mention anything, all had dinner together as usual and nothing amiss. I noticed I had a missed call from his dad and asked my son why his dad might have called. He said that he was probably asking about his gym membership because he'd offered to pay for it, which i thought was odd, since it's nothing to do with him. I must admit it irritated me a bit because he only pays child maintenance because it is taken directly from his wages. He has never chosen to financially contribute towards anything but has a habit of offering to my son so that he looks good but then never following through. I returned his call and he asked why his gym membership had been cancelled, so I said that it hadn't. He said that our son said it might be and asked why - has he been playing up or something? I said no but that he hasn't been attending and has been making a lot of excuses about going so it makes no sense for him to have a membership and it'd be cheaper to pay on the door. I thought it was a bit odd but maybe he thought I was financially struggling or something.

I was thinking over how strange it was so I looked at his phone when he was upstairs to see what had promoted the call. He'd messaged his dad ranting about my husband, saying that that he called him a baby and is going to tell me he's pathetic, that he's taking away his gym membership and power hungry because he's trying to start an argument with a fifteen year old and that he's worried he's going to lose his temper and punch him one day (son punch husband).. His dad responds calling my husband pathetic, says it's good that he called him a baby, that he's a loser and that he doesn't need to worry that he's going to punch him because he will deal with it. Sounds very much like he's telling my son he will hit my husband. That's not the only stuff he says, he does tell him to call me and talk to me about it but my son says that I am always on husband's side so there's no point so his dad says he will talk to me on my son's behalf (basically just thinking everything is unfair I am always against him). I'm gutted and feel a bit sick.

I have had to talk to him before about thinking about what he says to his dad because he takes it at face value, which is awkward because I also don't want to tell him that he can't tell his dad things. If he was being abused and felt like he couldn't tell me for whatever reason, I would want him to know he could tell his dad. We've had incidents where he was contacting his dad if I told him off/raised my voice/lost my temper and he was exaggerating the situation and almost accusing me of abusing him. Before I knew it, his entire family were all messaging checking he was ok because he called them up and they all had to get involvedbe. There was a time when it seemed that I couldn't ever snap at the kids or have an argument or just tell my son off without his dad getting involved. I did point out to him that he was basically accusing me of abusing him and if his dad took that seriously it could have serious consequences. He contacted his dad explaining that he had exaggerated and his dad implied that he was coerced into sending the message...

Anyway, I thought we were past that but we're not. I'm not sure what I'm supposed to do. The thing is that my son constantly moans and rants about his dad to me. Any time he is angry about his dad, he brings up the same things to me. His house is disgusting, his dad is lazy, he sleeps all the time and never goes anywhere, he makes him make all the drinks and do loads of cleaning, his Stepmom was harsh to him and telling him off for being mean to his brother when he hadn't even done anything, everything is covered in mould, they don't have food in the house, they don't own a vacuum, they leave broken glass on the floor for him to tread on, they mistreated their dogs, his dad doesn't care about him, his dad lies to him all the time to get out of seeing him, his dad once swore at him, his Stepmom is lazy, his Stepmom makes loads of mess and he hates her family because they always slag his dad off, his dad regrets proposing to her, his dad always shouts at his little brother etc etc. But I don't call his dad and start questioning him every time my son says these things because I'm sure that they are part exaggeration and also I don't think it is any of my business how his dad lives his life as long as my son isn't being abused or neglected. And I know some of those things sound like neglect but I also know that it doesn't tally with other things he's told me. And, to be honest, I stopped trying to reason with his dad or get him to step up a long time ago because it led to nothing but stress and anger on my part. And when my son says those things, I don't join in or phone his dad and tell him everything he's just told me. He'd be really embarrassed and upset if it got back to his dad that he'd said those things.

What am I supposed to do? It sounds like the initial argument was stupid but would blow over but I am so unhappy that his dad is insulting my husband to him and threatening to hit him. It's not the first time it has happened but I have managed to keep it from my husband. I feel very stressed and angry with all of them and I really don't know how to deal with it. I'm annoyed at my son for putting me in this position while recognising that he is only a teenager, I'm angry at my husband for having a stupid argument in the first place while recognising that he is only human and sometimes gets annoyed and I am annoyed at his dad for saying those things while recognising that he is going to have an emotional reaction to the messages my son is sending him. How should I deal with this? It is not beyond the realms of possibility that his dad will eventually turn up here in anger to physically confront my husband.

Having raised two teen boys through a similar phase with their useless father, I'd say just do nothing. If his father wants to pay for the gym membership, let him. Otherwise, it sounds trite but just 'you do you' - get on with being his mum and making sure he's OK, don't worry about what's being said behind your back, just don't get sucked into the drama. Make it clear to everyone that you are approachable and will work through any problem that's brought directly to your attention in a reasonable way, but going around sniping won't achieve anything.

Your current DH should just butt out as much as possible.

Thanks for the reply. Did you also have a husband who was bearing the brunt of things? I think when my son moans about me, his dad takes it more with a pinch of salt, but he seems to have a very low opinion of my husband even though they've never really met or spoken. I think it's all based on my son ranting to him if they've had an argument.

His dad doesn't need to pay for the membership but I would let him do that if I decided not to pay for it anymore. I think it's unlikely to happen though because he was supposed to pay for his phone last year and never paid the bill so it kept getting cut off. His nan and uncle on his dad's side were embarrassed and have ended up paying for it instead. This is what I mean by unreliable and why i just feel like I spend my entire life biting my tongue while he questions whether i am a good enough parent. It feels like such a slap in the face and is the reason I'm lying in bed feeling so stressed.

Do you think it is reasonable that my husband never gets to say anything to him? The reality is that he has raised him from the age of 4 and was/is far more involved in his upbringing than his dad. He has chosen to not get involved lately as it was just making things worse and leading to arguments but I don't feel that it is right that he can basically never discipline him or get involved. The kids were fighting last week and he said the name of both of our kids as each one was playing up. Shouting "jack!" kind of thing. And when he said the teenager's name, he had a big strop and stomped off upstairs talking about how he is always blamed for everything, we're horrible, we're always picking on him, his brother always gets better treatment than him...

Although, today's issue wasn't something which needed discipline. I think he was probably annoyed with my son because we're getting sick of listening to excuses and the membership is costing us money for nothing, so my son probably reacted very badly to that and it went from there. It's hard to say. Should I speak to my son about what he said or try to speak to my son's dad?

Next time his dad calls…

Say son keeps moaning about all this to me, now I’m sure this is wildly exaggerated- but let me tell you what he’s saying
His house is disgusting, his dad is lazy, he sleeps all the time and never goes anywhere, he makes him make all the drinks and do loads of cleaning, his Stepmom was harsh to him and telling him off for being mean to his brother when he hadn't even done anything, everything is covered in mould, they don't have food in the house, they don't own a vacuum, they leave broken glass on the floor for him to tread on, they mistreated their dogs, his dad doesn't care about him, his dad lies to him all the time to get out of seeing him, his dad once swore at him, his Stepmom is lazy, his Stepmom makes loads of mess and he hates her family because they always slag his dad off, his dad regrets proposing to her, his dad always shouts at his little brother etc etc.

niw if I was to telephone you with all these complaints I’m sure you’d get racked off, well I’m getting racked off can we just leave ds to rant and take a large punch of salt with his teenage rankings?

As for your ds tell him to stop playing one parent off the other or trying to as it’s a dangerous game

Hugs. I think it’s time to stop contact between you and your ex. Your son is old enough to manage his own relationship. Let ex know, and block him if he continues. There is no point getting involved with any of that nonsense. But if you son wants to rant to his dad about you, ignore it. Just don’t allow it to spill into your life. Don’t tell your ex what your son says. It will get back to your son then he won’t trust you. With the other two I would set some ground rules. He isn’t your child’s father so it’s reasonable to say that he can not nit pick and start fights any more. Let dh know what is ok and what isn’t. Let your son know that he has to treat your husband with respect. Give examples of issues what is ok and what isn’t.

Sit them down together at the table and lay the law down very assertively. If either interrupt shut them down quickly. I recommend doing this with terrible PMS. Really scare the shit out of them.

If it continues look at moving to a tropical island on your own.

This might be a massive drip feed but I am having cancer treatment at the moment and at times have been extremely ill so my husband has been doing everything. I feel uncomfortable with the idea that he can cook for him, do his laundry, drive him around, financially provide for him and then not be allowed to ever discipline him. I think I'd be really pissed off if I was a stepmum in that situation.

I think the big thing is that my husband called my son a little shit during an argument a year or two ago. He called his dad very wound up, his dad called me and managed to not outright threaten my husband but suggested that he might hit him etc. Everybody got involved, his dad was wanting massive discussions and conversations. And I was just thinking... Is it that big a deal? I know how that sounds, but honestly, he was behaving like a little shit. His dad heard that he was innocently minding his own business and my husband came into the room swearing at him and being nasty, but he was actually sneering and laughing at him and refusing to put his things away with a "what are you going to do about it?" kind of attitude. I wasn't happy that my husband said it, he apologised and talked to him about it but I really don't think losing your temper and saying something in anger as a one off when a teenager is pushing your buttons is a huge problem which needs to be blown up into the situation his dad made it. I don't know whether my perspective is all wrong there. His dad never sees that side of him because he doesn't live with him and is there for a limited time. He seems to be on his best behaviour and constantly trying to win him over, which I think is quite sad. But he has no idea of the realities of living with a teenager. At the time I could hear him on the phone to his dad saying "I know she's telling you that I was being rude but I genuinely wasn't, I just don't know why he was speaking to me like that" and his dad was replying that he knows he wouldn't lie and he is telling the truth. So I'm lying then??

Another thing I noticed is that he refers to us not giving him a lift to his dad's as us being funny about dropping him off. And then his dad acts like a bloody hero saying don't worry about them, I'll sort it. The reality is that his dad is supposed to pick him up and he almost never does! My son told me that it's because his dad is going to the pub instead so then he can't drive. There is never a plan for how my son will get to his dad's, he has to call his dad every week and ask if he is coming to get him and almost every time his dad asks if he could be dropped to him. So either me, my husband or one of my family members (for some reason none of his dad's family members ever offer) end up driving him there. I have been on chemo and then surgery, my husband has been working and looking after us all, my parents have been doing the same - cooking for us, taking the kids, when they have illnesses as well as both still working full time and looking after my sister who also had surgery... His dad and his partner have a car each whereas we share a car so it gets difficult and complicated. I am so annoyed at my son because he is fully aware that his dad is supposed to pick him up and that we are run ragged at the moment, yet he's telling his dad that we are being funny about dropping him. It makes it seem as though it is our responsibility and we're refusing to fulfill it when the reality is that we are exhausted and have been doing it because we feel sorry for him because he is desperate to see him and thought it was the right thing to do.

Don't know if I'm articulating that very well but I'm just gobsmacked. I feel quite hurt and upset that we have all been running around picking up his dad's slack so he doesn't miss out and on the rare occasion we can't do it, they have the nerve to speak about us like that, never acknowledging that it's actually his dad who hasn't turned up which is the problem.

I would never articulate this to my son but it feels so disloyal. I'm actually hurt. And angry at his dad.

I don't really communicate with his dad at all, he usually communicates with him directly. We only speak if it is necessary. And when my son starts angrily contacting his dad and basically saying that my husband is picking on him, his dad believes it and contacts me with this as an important issue. To be fair to his dad like I said above, he doesn't seem to believe it so readily when it's me he is complaining about but it really, really grates.

And seeing the "don't worry about them" messages, as though he's stuck with two brutes all week and his dad comes and rescues him (except that we drop him there and give him his tea first) and my son goes along with that! I can't believe my son thinks it is ok for his dad to hint that he will punch my husband. I did think it was odd that his dad sometimes asks if everyone is being nice to him... I initially thought he meant kids at school but I've realised it's actually me and my husband. There is this "us against the world narrative" going on and I can't deny that I am hurt and pissed off after raising him with almost no help from his dad for the majority of his life. It is a punch to the gut.

Why don’t you suggest your son living with his dad?

I'm sorry to hear about your cancer and I do understand the hurt of basically carrying the load all your kid's life only to have them complain about you and play you off against the other parent. Unfortunately, most teens are shits. Entitled and opportunistic. Teens with complex lives and (at least one) dysfunctional parent relationship are even more shit. He loves you, and he will grow out of this and see the players in his life for who they really are, one day.

Given your health I really do think it's best to just concentrate on your relationship with him being the best it can be and let the rest wash over you.

Yes my ex hates my new partner and has threatened harm to him, but we don't live together because - well - all these threads on Mumsnet and seeing what step-parenting does to teens and relationships. I get what you're saying about him having a right to have a say given the responsibilities he's taken on but it doesn't sound like he and your son are close enough for this to happen effectively. Your DH is not particularly sensitive to your son's emotional state and your son doesn't respect him as an authority figure. So while you may theoretically be correct about his 'right' to a say, in practice it's never going to work.

I don't want my son to live with his dad. His dad raised it a few years ago (more like 50/50) and my son went through a phase of saying he wanted to live there. He has now admitted that he wouldn't want to. Their lives are quite chaotic in some ways and his dad is unreliable. He also lives around a twenty five minute drive from his school (probably more in rush hour) and I just don't trust his dad to do that every day. I understand that it would show my son that the grass isn't greener and his dad would see what living with a teenager is like, but he's in year 11 in September and I really don't think it would be in his best interests to have that sort of upheaval just to kind of prove a point when I know it will have a negative impact.

I agree with this.

Good on you, that's a good example of you rising above the conflict to do what's best for your son

You have so much going on, it’s no wonder you’re having a difficult time.

However, I agree with PP who suggested it’s better if your husband doesn’t try to discipline the kids. Teenagers are very hard work, but your husband is an adult and needs to learn to bite his tongue or walk away.

And the less you engage with your ex, the better. He sounds like a shit-stirrer who’s using your son as a way of getting at you. Never mind if he believes everything your son says - so what? His opinion doesn’t matter. Unless you really think he will attack your husband, his implied threats don’t actually matter either: it’s just more shit-stirring, designed to make you upset. (Although if he has form for violence that’s another issue.)

Your son is only 15. He’s probably terrified about your cancer, massively disappointed in his father, and taking everything out on your husband. Tell him you love him. He needs to hear it, probably more than you realise. And take good care of yourself.

I don't think (from experience) the way your son invalidates your dp is to do with step parenting - we had a very similar experience. It's another teenage divide and rule thing. So I don't agree your dp should have no say, but your approach certainly seems more peaceful and maybe he could learn from you.
The lifts thing sounds maddening too, you're really caught in the middle. Could your parents or someone else possibly commit to dropping ds off regularly, assuming there's no easy transport? Might shame ex into getting it together.
Is ds doing anything to help at home? Just sometimes pulling (a tiny bit of) their weight and being praised for helping can be a positive. Cooking, errands, hoovering - anything that feels like a contribution to the family.

I always think I do tell him I love him and am constantly trying to think of things for us to do together but am often rejected! I think it's possible ex would turn up here. He does have form for violence, but I'm not sure if any has happened recently. Be seems to have calmed down a bit. I can tell that he is really trying hard to control his anger when he is calling me about these things because he genuinely believes that my husband is picking on his son and wants to hit him. When he called me about my husband calling my son a little shit, he said "I thought I should try calling you first before I come down there and it kicks off". I think my son would be terrified if that did actually happen but I it makes him feel good and loved when his dad says he will hurt somebody for him.

I don't think I'd really call him a shit stirrer, we can go ages without speaking, it is just this one issue that crops up. And it is causing major friction in my marriage. My husband has no idea that his dad has ever threatened him or that he is involved in this in any way because it'll just make things worse.

I just don't see how our family could function if he's basically never allowed to say anything negative. I think he'd be within his rights to stop providing half of the stuff he does if that was the case and that's not realistic. He has always raised him like he is his own child and it was never a problem until the couple of years.

Do you think it's worth trying to talk to his dad, pointing out that he does it the other way round too except I don't call him up and make him explain himself? I dont want to be disloyal to my son by telling his dad things he clearly doesn't feel comfortable saying directly to his dad.

My parents have done most of the lifts recently but they are fed up of it too. They work full time and have also been looking after us all. On the day my son is supposed to go to his dad's, my husband is at work until 8 and then needs to do a 45 minute round trip before he can sit down and eat. I don't think his dad is at all embarrassed by that. He's been this way his entire life. This is what I mean by talk the talk - happy to threaten to hit people for his son and happy to promise holidays etc but can't even be trusted to turn up when he says he will or pay the legal minimum required without being forced. My son doesn't know that though.

My husband has already decided to take a step back because he could see he was making things worse. It's harder for my son to claim favouritism because they are both my children. I'm not sure why he had an argument with him today. It was stupid and immature but not worthy of all this stress.

I actually feel more sympathetic towards your husband than other people on here do. It seems from what you say that he does try to stay out of things but then you're not happy with that because it puts discipline on your shoulders. And if he's doing everything for your son, your son should show some respect and gratitude. It's inevitable that when someone is taking advantage of you and disrespecting you, that occasionally you will be pushed over the edge. I don't see many people would be able to bite their tongue and walk away every single time no matter that that's their intention. It sounds to me like he deserves a bit of support for his overall tolerance rather than condemnation for the occasional, inevitable and very human slip.

I'd be tempted to ask your son how he would feel about you starting to phone his father to complain about all the things he says about his stepmother and then threaten to hit her. Seeing as is his father is allowed to do that.

He's playing you off against each other and your ex is falling for it. Idiot. Your husband needs to chill out. He's going to have many more years of conflict until your youngest is through teenagehood.

I don't think he would be surprised about him saying those things about his Stepmom to me because he's usually repeating what his dad has said to him. He sometimes talks to him like a mate and moans about her to him. I have to point out that he is being disrespectful and it's not on. She seems to be very nice to my son but situations arise where his dad will say he can't pick him up but his partner will do it on her way back from her family's house and then my son will moan that she is late and all she ever does is visit her family etc as though there is something wrong with that. He parrots what his dad says. IMO she is not responsible for him and it's not her job to pick him up so if he has to wait longer than he'd like that's his dad's problem for not picking him up himself or arranging something in advance. Another one is his dad not being home on the evening that he is supposed to be picking him up so he can go there if he gets a lift but will have to wait for his partner to be in because she's out too. That gets a load of moaning about her being put shopping 'as usual' or visiting family 'again' as though she should just stay at home in case my son turns up even though his dad has gone out despite knowing it's the same night he has his son every week. I sometimes wonder how his dad has managed to pull the wool over his eyes so easily that it never seems to occur to him that his dad is at fault and everyone else shouldn't have to jump into action to sort it out.

The only comparable one is when he claimed that he took his toddler brother off his lap because he was trying to touch the keyboard and she told him off for being sharp with him when he wasn't, gave him dirty looks, whispered about him to his dad who believed her and was funny with him all night before telling him off in front of other people and making him cry.

I do feel sorry for my husband but he's not always dealt with things in the best way. He has far less patience than me with things and can be uptight at times. I've had to tell him to pick his battles because he was picking every single one and acting like they were equally important. He's lost his temper unnecessarily in the past and made things between them tense. This wasn't a situation which needed any kind of discipline, he has just been getting annoyed by the gym membership situation and is sick of hearing excuses about why he can't go. My son can be lazy and reels off excuses of why he can't do things very easily. It is annoying to listen to but it wasn't an immediate situation which needed to be dealt with. I don't really mind that the discipline falls to my shoulders, it is a bit annoying and tiring but far less stressful than the arguments it was causing between us in the past and it means things don't get so heightened because my son takes it better coming from me. I didn't ask him to do that, I think my husband just realised it was making things worse when he got involved. There was a situation around Christmas where my husband was at fault and I did take my son's side. I had a big discussion with my husband and said he was acting immaturely. Things have improved since then and they've been getting on well. But they both accuse me of always siding with the other one and I am stuck in the middle.

Should I try to talk to my son about this today? What his dad doesn't seem to understand is that he is ranting in the immediate aftermath of an argument. By the time I got home, my son wasn't even bothered enough to mention it to me. I only knew there had been an argument because my husband told me. But now this will be another incident in his dad's eyes which will be brought up and is adding to the idea that my husband is no good and picks on him whereas it would have been a petty argument forgotten about with a couple if hours if he hadn't started ranting to his dad. But then, I can't say that he can't tell his dad things because that's not ok either. I'm fed up of it all.

I think you’re probably at the hardest age with your son. Hopefully by the time he is around 20 he will be mature enough to see all his fathers faults.

I don’t think there is a great deal you can do. However if I were you I would get your husband to back off as much as possible with the discipline and maybe try some one to one time of there are things they both like doing. I’d stop facilitating your ex, so no dropping your son off or asking others too if that is something he is supposed to arrange. Reduce contact with ex to as little as possible. Ask for any significant issues to be communicated about in writing via email. I’d make ex aware that you monitor your sons phone use and that anything of a concerning nature has been saved for future reference (eg his texts).

with your son I think you need to massively rise above it. Have strict boudaries and stick to them. Like with the gym, you said he needed to attend 2 times per week. Maybe say if you manage that over the next 3 weeks we will keep paying if not we won’t. No arguments that’s just how it is. Don’t get drawn into a back and forth. You just can’t win with a teenagers.

Does your son have any other positive male role models in his life. An uncle or anyone who is an older male with a calm settled attitude? I wonder if that would help?

I am sorry about the cancer, that must be so tough.

As a former stepchild and now step mum and mum of three I have learnt the following:

1. teenagers are all pains in the arse at times, but they do come good in the end
2. they often rant to the non-resident parent, it's normal
3. as a general rule, discipline or feedback is much more likely to work if it comes from the (resident) parent rather than the step parent.

I would focus on de-escalation, picking your battles and not getting caught up in their teenage dramas.

And personally I would let him decide when to go to the gym. He needs to learn to take responsibility for his own health and wellbeing. It doesn't cost you any more whether he goes once or twice a week.

Good luck with everything.

I don't really see the point of forcing him to go to the gym. It needs to be something he wants to do himself and if he doesn't want it enough to make it worth spending the money on I would just cancel the subscription for the moment.

Can DS and DH go to the gym together??? ie forge a better relationship by doing something positive together??

Stay calm
stay out of arguments with his dad- be neutral
give him independence and choices
support him and be a safe haven from the men around him.

Don’t argue- you are the adult and clearly the most mature of them all. He needs you in that way.

Thanks everyone, some good ideas here. His dad is likely already aware that I monitor his phone use and wouldn't care that I've seen that. He's quite a confrontational person. The idea of using it a set number of times per week or it gets stopped by a certain date is a good one and is what I told my husband I would do yesterday. He seemed to think that I was being soft though, because we have told him repeatedly that he needs to use it or it will be cancelled. I think that is different because there was no actual limit set. The gym is costing us more because he can just turn up and pay on the door but was adamant that he would use it enough to make it worth it. He is lazy and has a habit of losing interest in things which require any effort. He's dropped lots of other hobbies in the past but we are concerned about him just playing video games indoors which isn't healthy, so we were pleased when he said he wanted to go to the gym. He's also an extremely fussy eater and only wants to live on junk so we have been concerned about his health. All of that stuff will be behind my husband's reaction.

My son is close to my dad so he is a good male role model.

I've just tried to talk to my husband about it and now he's mad at me too. I asked why he decided to bring it up and get into an argument with him and he said that i wasn't there so he had to. I asked whether it was really something which required immediate discussion or even something which needs 'discipline' because I don't think it is. I think he will have been annoyed that he's costing us money and keeps making excuses not to go and this is another thing he's not going to stick at. I tried to say that it could have waited until I got home and pointed out that he said he was trying to stay out of things because it was making things worse but he cut me off mid sentence and walked out of the room. I know he will be thinking that I'd never deal with it, that this has been going on for ages and he's the only one saying or doing anything about it... But I don't think it's that big a deal.

So now my husband is angry that he's not allowed to say anything, my son presumably still thinks that i take my husband's side in everything and his dad believes that I'm not protecting him from an abusive stepdad. I've been so worked up about this that ive hardly slept and I'm exhausted.