12 year old out of control! Help!

[Whyyyyyyyohhhhhwhyyyyyy]

I have a DS who is 12. I love him to bits but I cannot handle his attitude and behaviour. Every single day without fail there will be an argument which he will cause.

Yesterday as a sterling example I text him asking him to come home from school to get changed before he went to a youth club (Not an unreasonable request) but he point blank refused and every time I asked he would just respond with NO and then when I told him he's going to end up losing his phone and being grounded he simply responds with 'well I just won't come back from school and il still go do what I want and you won't be able to track me without my phone' (we have life360) so of course I was fuming. I couldn't go and fetch him as younger DC is full of cold and had just got out the bath and I was waiting for shopping to be delivered. By around half 6 I started with chest pain (muscular thank god) and DS STILL wouldn't come home. My mum messaged him telling him to get home now as I had to go to the local hospital and he STILL didn't come home until AFTER I was allowed to leave the hospital around 8pm. By the time he got home my mum was here and she had a go at him because of his selfishness and entitled behaviour.

I rang my child 16 times and spent hundreds of messages all of which he mainly ignored.

He is under CAMHS and first assessment/meeting is next month but my god I cannot live like this forever.

This morning he started on his BS again because I told him he was to be home for 3:30 and that he was grounded. I've taken the phone away from him and he left for school at half 6 this morning! He doesn't start til half 8!

He doesn't understand or should I say he doesn't care because he does understand that he's making me feel low and affecting me, he never listens to me, he never does as he's told and he genuinely believes that everyone 'owes' him and that he can do whatever he likes, whenever he likes.

This has been going on for a long time but I can't deal with it anymore. I genuinely feel like I've failed as a mum to him.

He sounds vulnerable, get in touch with the school to keep an eye on him, he is the perfect target for County Lines or other similar activity. Sounds like he is being influenced by other people, do you know who he is with? Is it a recent change in behaviour, check whether he has more than one phone.

Pick him up from school, show him that you are the boss and put in place some hard boundaries. If he is likely to be a flight risk get a photo of him before he leaves the house so that you have one for the police if they need to go look for him.

Sorry you are experiencing this.

What is he being assessed for?

All behaviour is communication. He does sound quite vulnerable at just 12yo. I hate to say it but the effect he is having on you probably won't even register with him It should, and it would with an adult, but he is in the thick of the selfishness of adolescence. Albeit very young adolescence.

It is so, so hard and I do feel for you. I hope he comes home for 3.30 today

@lupinlass I'm hoping they assess him for every mental health condition known to man because he's certainly got something. Unfortunately he doesn't communicate using his voice and then acts the way he is doing which just causes so many arguments. He says he doesn't know why he acts how he does and he doesn't like acting like it but he's said it so many times and his behaviour doesn't change if anything it ramps up more.

The thing is it does register what he's doing to me, he gets a kick out of doing it. He LOVES making me worry to the point of an anxiety attack, if he didn't he wouldn't keep doing it. He knows what he's doing to me. He simply doesn't care. He's been told numerous times by myself and his grandmother what he's doing to me and he cries and says sorry then the next day he's straight back at it again.

I love him but I hate his behaviour and attitude

Where's his Dad in all of this?

He's acting out to get your attention (doesn't matter it's the wrong attention) but something is the root cause.

How is he doing at school? What are his problem areas? Who have you spoken to?
What is he being assessed for? How did he do at primary - what's changed?

I totally appreciate that he's giving you the run around but there will be something worrying him even if he can't explain what it is.

I'm not trying to be mean but I really believe in what I'm saying and think it could help.

You have to stop making it about you, about how his behaviour affects you. Your reaction to his behaviour is not his fault. You have to learn how to change your response. Having you and his gran going on about how he causes your anxiety attacks and then emotionally blackmailing him to come home is never going to solve this. I also don't agree with scaring him to come home by claiming heart issues. He is 12, he needs guidance and boundaries and you have to detach yourself and understand that it isn't a personal attack on you. Can you access any parent support or parenting lessons through school, it's not a sign of failure to ask for help. I often see people spending so much money on dog behaviourist but think parenting should be something we just know.

#notonthestairs his dad is dead (suicide) he wasn't an active part of his life until a month before he decided to kill himself. Ive taken him to all sorts of bereavement therapy and none can help because he simply doesn't know his dad enough.

School he's fine, top sets for everything will sit and do extremely hard maths questions for fun at home, no issues there at all.

I've spoken to head of year/several GPS/teachers/CAMHS etc

I'm going to make sure they assess him for ADHD/AUTISM/ODD and Bipolar (his dad had Bipolar)

Primary school yes he was bullied however he went to a secondary school completely away from anyone else he went to primary with.

@TheIrritableGoldfish this is the FIRST time I've made it about myself I've spent 10 years (since he was 2) BEGGING to get him seen and assessed for ADHD but the doctor says he's most likely got ODD but according to CAMHS that doesn't exist in England yet it does in every other country 🤔 I didn't claim i had heart issues I said I had to go to to the hospital because of sudden chest pains which thankfully is a muscular issue and I'm sorry but he didn't come back so had I had needed to go to A/E he would of been stuck outside for god knows how many hours. So he needed to come home but he didn't so it's a damn good job I didn't have to go to A/E. You seem to think I haven't been trying to help him when I have given up the majority of my time to actually help him and its still not enough. I take him out just me and him, I treat him all the time and he still treats me like I'm crap on his shoe.
As for emotionally blackmailing him the only emotion was annoyance because he kept saying NO and hitting back with stuff like I do what I want.

I appreciate you are offering advice but I don't need parenting lessons I need my son to stop acting how he is and do as he's told most of the time. He also wasn't scared. If he was scared he would of come home when his grandma told him to come home as I needed to go to hospital and again he didn't come home until 8pm when I had thankfully told I could go home! He didn't even know about the chest pains UNTIL he got home.

Yes he's 12 and he's finding his feet but i ask you to Google ODD (Oppositional defiant disorder) and on the list of symptoms you will get a clearer picture of how my son behaves. His behaviour is so far from 'normal' and as said previously his dad had Bipolar which ultimately killed him. I have spent years trying to help him and each time he ramps up the behaviour.

He has whatever he wants, he's been incredibly spoiled his whole life and he's never even had to lift a finger to help anyone because i do it all for him. He is not a child who is on a tight leash with no freedom.

@TheIrritableGoldfish

I'm not trying to be mean but I really believe in what I'm saying and think it could help.

You have to stop making it about you, about how his behaviour affects you. Your reaction to his behaviour is not his fault. You have to learn how to change your response. Having you and his gran going on about how he causes your anxiety attacks and then emotionally blackmailing him to come home is never going to solve this. I also don't agree with scaring him to come home by claiming heart issues. He is 12, he needs guidance and boundaries and you have to detach yourself and understand that it isn't a personal attack on you. Can you access any parent support or parenting lessons through school, it's not a sign of failure to ask for help. I often see people spending so much money on dog behaviourist but think parenting should be something we just know.

Completely agree

don't need parenting lessons I need my son to stop acting how he is

In a situation like this the only thing you can control is your response and the way you deal with your son, you can wish him to stop behaving as he is, you can plead but whether he does or not is completely outside of your control. I think he is a very scared boy, he (and you) have been through a traumatic time, there is a reason behind his behaviour. I know first hand that mental health provisions are woefully inadequate but please consider getting support for yourself, there is no weakness is asking for help with parenting.

Does he usually come straight home after school? I’m just wondering why you text him and told him to come home before youth club. I’m not denying he’s got you stressed out your mind but maybe it’s a “can’t see the wood for the trees” situation.
He 12 so not thinking beyond his own best interests. If he’d made plans and didn’t care about being at youth club in his school clothes it’s not unexpected ge would resist (not saying that’s ok). And then he didn’t come home because he knew he was in bother! Again not ok but not unusual.

Changing plans on my DS rarely goes well and I spend a lot time thinking why am I explaining myself to you get in the car. When I make rock solid plans and let home know things go much better. I’m not blaming you just trying to help.

Is it possible that you could have reacted more calmly ie. Does it really matter if he didn't come home to get changed ? Are you bringing too much tension and stress to minor issues ?

If you let go of the smaller stuff he may listen more ?

I'm going to make sure they assess him for ADHD/AUTISM/ODD and Bipolar (his dad had Bipolar)

I don't want to piss on your chips or anything but there is no way you will be able to decide what assessments CAMHS will do. They will see you and your son, they will take a history and find out what's going on then make the judgement on which assessment/s they think he may benefit from.

Your responses and interactions with him are impacting on his behaviour though. He’s 12, he isn’t living and acting in isolation. His relationship with you is critical.

Listen to him. Don’t keep nagging & telling him what to do. Hear what he’s trying to tell you.

He’s used to everything being handed on a plate for him so now thinks he can do what he wants because he will get his own way. Pick your battles and if you are going to punish him do one thing not ground him and take his phone off him etc. He will shut down communicating with you if you are going to be on his back all the time.
If he gets a diagnosis of something it isn’t going to change who he is. You have to start working out what works and what doesn’t and no I’m not giving you parenting lessons I’m giving you advice from a parent who has been through hell and back many times. There’s a good book called blame my brain the amazing teenage brain revealed (I know he isn’t a teenager yet but is nearly one)

I'm going though the same at the min, my 12 year old keeps getting suspended hus on the line for permanently exclusion. He ran away yesterday me and his brother had to fourse him in the car (someone thought we was kidnapping him) im at my wits his never in lesson has he gets c3 or suspended his had no education for the last 9 months. The things hus saying to be is totally out off order. Iv just done a chams request. I feel like a failure. I see no end off it. Please tell me it gets better

@Nikki27mumoff3 nope got much much worse. He's nearly 16 now.

Sorry to hear that- did you get a diagnosis from camhs

@allwillbe nope, not yet, he's on pathway for ASD, Which has been blindingly obviously (to me anyway) since he was a toddler. But nobody else believed me until recently. Too little too late now though.

Sorry to hear that. We went through extreme issues with our daughter from about 14- camhs and police/ss involvement. Our dd never listened to any rules, stayed out and didn’t obey curfews and when i read this I always feel so sorry for mums going through this. The worry and the doubt in your parenting is awful. Ours was diagnosed with trauma and adhd and maybe a diagnosis does help abit . All I wanted to say is she is now 18 and things did improve and maturity does seem to help- I don’t believe we are home and dry but I really think things will get better for many people experiencing this behaviour as maturity does help with their behaviour.

@allwillbe same thing here, but I've told him that when hes 16 he's out.

My son is 12, he hasn't been to school for over a month, he sufferers from anxiety, and is waiting for autism assessment, he has recently attempted to end his life, i am trying to get the right support from him, reached out to crisis team, cahms, gp, safeguarding you name it, but while I am waiting he is refusing to co operate he is staying up all night on his PC, I had a timer set but then he gets angry aggressive, threatens to end his life, he wakes me up early hours in the morning if I've knocked the internet off, or if he comes off early he can't sleep his anxiety lucks in he hears things or sees things , and I have to get in with him so either way my sleep Is disturbed and effects me the next day at work, he's got me over a barrel and my mental health is effected also, please tell me what I can do