Help with Dd nearly 13, hating herself 😔

[Diddlysquatty]

Feeling so sad for my year 8 dd. Been a difficult term with some friendship issues etc.
But also she is so low in mood.
Not all the time... but she really dislikes school. She’s gone from being so keen and a bright spark at primary to quiet shy and mediocre academically at secondary.

But I think the worst thing is how she talks about herself. She feels no one likes her, everyone finds her annoying, everyone thinks she’s weird, she wishes she was slimmer/prettier (she is in no way overweight) when talking about it she says she wants to look nicer so no one will judge her/she’ll be popular. It’s so frustrating but she won’t listen to reason.
I’m trying to best to be calm and supportive and reassure her that we love her, she is loved as she is etc.
I think the friendship issues haven’t helped a although things have settled down again she feels her little group of girls don’t really like or accept her yet she finds it hard to branch out and make new friends.

She’s also given up most of her extra curricular activities now

She says she doesn’t want to be here anymore and no one would care, which is heartbreaking to see.

I’m so sad and worried for her

Sounds silly but I’m also worried that as she gets older if she feels so down on herself and her appearance, and is so fixated on that that she’ll be vulnerable to looking for affection/validation in the wrong places.

Any advice gratefully received.
Have not gone to GP yet as don’t want to make a thing about it if it’s not. GP would presumably recommend talking therapy?
She is already going once a week to speak to a youth worker and has just started a welfare group at school.

If any one can relate or has any advice what should do or say I would appreciate it so much

By the way I have given the option of moving schools but she doesn’t want to do that

My dd is slightly younger, she's 11 but during the first lockdown she changed from a happy confident girl to an absolute misery, she was so down on herself and wanted to be alone all the time. The problem we identified was far too much time spent on her devices. She was on tik tok way too much and so we took it away. She was furious but tough. She started to improve straight away and now I let her on it only in my company and only for 30 minutes a day (that's tik tok and insta combined)

Is your dd on social media? It's not a coincidence that the rate in teen girl self harm, suicide and depression has risen sharply since we started to use social media.

Does she have a phone. Just watched a very interesting programme about the correlation between girls having mobile phones amd and feeling down/self loathing. Apparently there is a real connection. Also, apologies for being naive perhaps, but is she getting outside enough?

Threads like these make me sad because they remind me of when I was at secondary school. I hate myself, thought I was so ugly and everyone hated me. For the whole time I was there.

All I can say is, tell her constantly how much you love her, how good she is at this and that, and how lovely she looks. Compliment her hair, everything. For someone who is insecure about looks, this means a lot and can go a long way to helping build herself up.

Thank you

Yes she has a phone and is on tiktok. The one interest which has really grown rather than waned is art, and she is genuinely very good. She goes on tiktok a lot and I’ve spoken to her about whether it’s affecting her self esteem. She of course says not and says she’s mostly looking at art stuff. She has an account on there which is of her art.
Yes I wonder if there is a correlation - she changed over lockdown and that’s also when she was on tiktok more.
I’d like to reduce/remove it but it’s hard as the art thing is very important to her, and to be fair it has led to her drawing really coming on,

And no, she doesn’t get outside enough, during the week hardly at all apart from school, she is not naturally sporty and has not found a sport/exercise she enjoys.
Was quite into ballet but is stopping now despite my best efforts/even bribery/reward for continuing. One of the main reasons there is feeling self conscious in the leotard. After dragging her there in tears a few times i don’t have the heart (or the ability frankly! to force her to continue.
We do a family walk every weekend for 1-2 hours and of course she moans massively about going but it’s non negotiable and actually normally walks well and enjoys it once we’re there.
We’re a bit limited on distance due to her 2 younger siblings.

Feel quite guilty and wish I’d never got her a phone/let her on tiktok.
Maybe I’ll try and limit it over the holidays.

She also enjoys playing roblox but I think that’s fairly harmless (doesn’t chat fo strangers, normally plays adopt me with her younger sister)

Getting a switch for Christmas so maybe that will help give an alternative to spending time in her room on her phone

Oh - she also hasn’t started her period yet and I keep thinking if she’s heating up for that
I’ve always been very affected by hormones and have v bad PMT

@missbunnyrabbit sorry you had that experience

Did you learn to love and accept yourself as you got older?

Maybe for you too, you can imagine that things like performing infront of the rest of the class in drama or dance are dreaded by her 😞

If she's good at art get her across to Instagram, the community comments and support on there is way nicer, tik tok is full of trolls, nasty comments, I'd ask her to delete the app for a few weeks and see how she feels, it maybe a relief for her that you take control.

Have you seen her account? Seen comments? Ask her to sit with you and watch the "social dilemma" on Netflix.

She can find confidence from art it's a great skill to have, I'm afraid our country and education system is simply awful at valuing this. Maybe get her some books on graphic design, get some courses outside of school in learning Adobe software, so she has constructive screen time.

I'm sure you do but just keep telling her she's loved, talented and lovely.

@dhisreadingmypostsagain thank you so much for your suggestions x
Great idea about watching the social dilemma too.
I do look at her tiktok and haven’t seen/she has said she hasn’t had any hate comments but I think it’s also the way it just shows you random videos which at least is not the case with Instagram.
Will also check out extra curricular art stuff. She loved art club at school but it’s such a shame they never started it back up this term

@Diddlysquatty

Oh - she also hasn’t started her period yet and I keep thinking if she’s heating up for that I’ve always been very affected by hormones and have v bad PMT

My dd (who I said got worse during lockdown) also started her period at the end of lockdown. Maybe there is a correlation but tbh I would be highly concerned about the use of tik tok. Yes it's hard to take it away, but at 13 she doesn't know what's good for her and as adults we know tik tok and Instagram are highly damaging

Have you been on tik tok yourself? I'm 36 and I can have self esteem issues generate from watching it for just a few minutes. Imagine what it's doing to the minds of young girls

You could essentially ban her tik tok use but let her upload her own videos to her account from your phone

I found the Young Minds charity extremely helpful in similar circumstances.

Thank you everyone
You’re right about tiktok. Wake up call.
I think I’ll talk to her about putting her art videos on Instagram instead and obviously monitor it closely

She was better this morning, and has come home from school ok. It’s like at bed time it just all comes out and overwhelms her

@Diddlysquatty

She was better this morning, and has come home from school ok. It’s like at bed time it just all comes out and overwhelms her

I think you should go cold turkey on the social media for now and see how she improves. My dd begged and begged and said her life was over without tik tok but I explained that it's not forever and that we would speak about it again in a couple of weeks. Eventually when i gave it back it was strictly time limited. Does she have an ipad? If she likes art I recommend the procreation app you can use on the iPad with an Apple Pencil. That could occupy her for a while and take her mind off things or maybe take her out for some new art supplies

I was going to ask too about social media and being outside.
She doesn’t have to do sports outside...lots of people dislike organised sport. What about getting out at weekends into the woods/coast? Dog walking (become a dog walker for hire if no dog of her own ), sea-swimming (fantastic for low mood), train as a life-guard, work experience at stables? You might have to do these things with her to get her started until she gets going herself. She spends a day per week off social media and right out of the neighbourhood, doing something outdoors that tires her out. And maybe earn money from it(dog walking) or gain experience/qualification (life-guard, stable work).
And it might be a cliche but the best way to improve mood is to do things for others.
Volunteering projects? - again something active and practical - eg beach clean-up or helping to cook or serve a large community meal.
Art classes and trips too maybe - but that’s doing something for yourself and sometimes I think art can be a little introspective and navel-gazing which isn’t good for mood.

Agree about the social media. One of my younger sisters was exactly the same between the ages of 12-16. Now she's grown up a bit more, and has deleted her Instagram account because she realised how much it was affecting her.

I also think hormones are playing a part, most of us felt like that at 13. I remember how my mum kept telling me that she still loved me and would always be there for me.

It sounds like you're doing a great job, just keep reassuring her you love her. If she likes art, try and get her involved in some after-school/weekend activities so she can meet like-minded people and perhaps find a 'safe' space away from all the bitchiness at school. Might take a bit of pushing on your part but she shouldn't give it up. It was exercise for me, I would've stayed inside all weekend, but each Saturday afternoon my parents 'forced' to go for a walk. Fast forward 10 years, and I love going for walks

Secondary school was awful for many of us. But having friends outside that environment helps, she'll slowly realise her school 'friends' aren't worth getting that worked up over.

Thank you
We watched social dilemma today and she found some of it boring but did watch it all, we talked about it and agreed she’s going to give up tiktok for a bit. She’s adamant it’s not affecting her but accepted that it might be without her realising

Totally agree about having friends outside school and I will continue to push that. There’s a nice youth group locally attached to a church and she knows a few of the others a little, she’s so far felt too shy to go but I’m really going to encourage it in the new year.
And yes to the fresh air. We will continue with the walks, we have woods, hills and coast not too far (half an hour)
What I keep meaning to do but struggle with is having 1:1 time and going for a walk with just her as I have 2 other younger girls. But I think 1:1 time is very important
She would love to walk a dog - she’d like us to have a pet but my DH dislikes dogs. Cat is a possibility just need to check if another dd is allergic.

Thank you so much for all your help and making me rethink about social media

Oh - and when I say tiktok for a bit I intend it to be permanent

I'm going to go against the grain a bit. I think it's a mistake to ban TikTok especially if she is saying quite loudly a d clearly that is not a problem. I think guidance on how to use appropriately is better as it's a permanent factor in their lives. I have a Y8 too and she makes a few vids, mainly of cake baking and funny dances, and she's quite proud of them.

I'd help her with her friendships in real life - meeting friends outside school, going to town to do Xmas shopping etc. Coronavirus permitting of course. Independence builds confidence

My DD is same age and having same problems. She was fine in lockdown until end of May when things relaxed a little - she got worse and by the end of the summer refused to shower or come out her room, only ate in her room, would hide under her duvet if we tried to see if she needed anything. Hasn't had a haircut since 20th March 🙄

We ask now for phone outside bedroom 9.30 & last few weeks she has got into Modern Family on Netflix, starting to eat downstairs, has been on trampoline. So gradually getting better I would say.

Can you find a series she might like? Friends?

It was a tough summer for us - but being back at school has helped - tho I think she's isolated at school with no real friends.

I would also say about to start periods so I guess that must play a part?

Hi, I’ve recently had the same issue with my 13 year old although she’s never had proper friends. She spent the whole of lockdown without making contact with anyone and I worried going back into year 8 would be like starting all over again. Not long into year 8 the friendship issues started again and I approached the school as I was worried about the mental affect on her and the school were/are really supportive and have helped her join a new group of friends, totally different from the last lot. she did the whole, I’m not sure they want me to be their friend etc, but a few weeks on after I told her unless they tell her to go away or don’t include her she is to accept that maybe they like her and do want her company. She has now accepted that they are a real friendship group and so much happier (and always on the phone now). It’s really hard and heartbreaking but maybe speak to her form tutor and see if they can advise anything. I really wasn’t sure involving the school was the right thing to do but it proved to be the best thing for us.

Roo07 sorry you’ve had that experience too but that’s good the school have helped.
Dd was dead against me speaking to school but earlier in the term she became very upset at school and so they became aware which was good actually. The form tutor has been fairly helpful and that’s how she got linked into this welfare group which is a weekly group for 6-8 weeks looking at issues like anxiety, friendships etc.
Also I think what helped on the friendship side, though controversial and I wasn’t sure if it was the right thing at the time - was chatting to a couple of the other mums at half term from her original group of 4, taking a sort of ‘isn’t it awful all the friendship stuff’ approach. 2 out of 3 of them were really nice about it and sympathetic and I think had a word with their daughters. The 3rd and mother of the one who has been the meanest was not so much but even so, coincidence or not they have laid off her a bit since half term

@Diddlysquatty

Oh - and when I say tiktok for a bit I intend it to be permanent

That's brilliant... as hard as it seems it's completely for the best. You sound like a great mum OP