21 year old son

[Nickij1973]

Sorry, I still don't know how to link my threads but I have other threads on the same subject but I haven't posted since the summer.

Basically son is now 21, I've raised him alone, we have no other family and he rarely sees his father. He messed up college but wanted to go to uni so last year he did a foundation year which he failed but caught up with the work over summer with a lot of help from his girlfriend so he has now gone onto year 1 of the degree. Last year I helped him a lot financially despite him getting the maximum amount of student loan as I am single and on a low income. He came home at end of April and did nothing until he returned to uni in September. I didn't give him any money over summer, he used his loan and probably his girlfriend. When he went back I gave him one food shop to start him off then said I would not be helping him this year and he should get a part time job. The last few weeks has been awful, I asked him to get me a student status letter as my council tax has been put up by £40 a month until I prove he is a student, like last year he dragged his feet with this so I gave him a deadline and said I would block his mobile if he didn't sort it out for me (I pay his mobile phone contract). He didn't sort it so I followed through and blocked his phone until he sorted my council tax 48 hours later during which time he sent me a lot of nasty emails from his laptop. A week later he asked me if I could send a food shop, I said no look for a job! I have paid an XBox live subscription for at least 10 years despite tryng to cancel it several times, however I recently changed my debit card which has stopped this payment going out, he is begging me to reactivate it but I have refused and again told him to look for part time work around uni. I am fed up of this and wondering how many years this will go on for. I am drained, worried sick about him, angry with him, feel guilty that I've failed as a parent but most of all I just want him to attend uni, work and be financially independent. Am I being unfair? He drained me financially last year and then refused to have a summer job. I have a lot of expenses myself and need a lot of repair work done to my house and car so really can't help him but resent helping him anyway. Also concerned that maybe a lack of confidence prevents him from working but he won't discuss this with me.

Has he ever had a PT job of any sorts??

You are right in refusing to subsidise him to that degree. He is lazy. Most students work through their summers to help fund their term times. For a 21yr old to offer no contribution is outrageous.

Can’t you have a reasonable conversation with him in which you detail your limitations and expectations of him?

He has had a couple if casual jobs that didn't last. He hangs up if he doesn't like what I'm saying! He currently lives in a shared house with other students and I haven't given him any money or food since September but I pay for his phone.

You have my sympathy, it sounds like you’re being driven to extreme tactics which is really upsetting you.

He may have low confidence but to be honest that’s tough, he needs to sort himself out. I think you need to sit down together like adults and agree what’s going to happen next.

Tell him you’ll support him all you can but not financially, you need to see him standing up a bit more. Good luck.

Does he actually understand the link between earnings and expenses? I don't mean that in a nasty way, but it sounds like he hasn't been challenged in reality.

If it was me I might decide what I would support - e.g. I might want them to have a pay as you go phone with a set level of credit a month, for their safety. House/light/heat/food - but the loan should cover that? Beyond that, he wants it, he earns it?

Hi Lucy, I think he does understand but no he hasn't had the reality and with hindsight I haven't said no enough over the years and he now seems to have very unrealistic and unreasonable expectations of me. I really feel sometimes that he doesn't see me as a person with my own needs and feelings he just thinks I'm his mum and I should help him. It's not a healthy relationship at the moment

Stick to your guns. Don’t back down about anything you’ve said. If you do he will do you you what my friends kid does to her, nag and moan and manipulate until she gives in or compromises.

You’re being totally and utterly fair and reasonable.

I was out the house at 17. Had to pay my own way in all things from rent to sanitary products, I had to manage.

He is lucky you give him any support at all. I had none. I’m not being melodramatic, it made me a stronger and wiser person, so it was good although it was hard.

After that I really appreciated anything I got. My mum paid for one single driving lesson for me and I was over the moon! Even though pals whose parents were on a similar salary to mine got cars bought for them and all their lessons, I really appreciated the little I got after having had nothing for a few years.

He’s not helping himself as he is lazy and the idea of having to work is too hard for the little darling. Nae luck mate. You’re gonna have to work for the next 45 years so best get used to it! We all have to make choices. And work.

You may have been too soft in the past but his life is his own responsibility now. He’s not 16. Far from it. He’s trying to manipulate him. If he gives you massive emails crying boo hoo just give him massive ones right back about how hard it’s been for you and all the sacrifices youve made and how you have bills to pay and that’s the reality of adult life. blah blah. Stay strong. You’re doing the right thing.

Thank you Elieza you're right.

Will Uni be worth it ? Will it definitely help him get a better job? If not could he leave now and get a job and start paying for himself.
I get where you are coming from I am in a similar situation.
So frustrating.

I have a similar attitude from mine Nicki, he is very autocratic but i am wondering if he actually has very low self esteem. He has just left uni after 2 years (with a loan but no degree) and was happy to meet my requests to get a job (His first ever) and carry out other things at the start. But a few weeks in his manner is back to a huge defensive attitude. If i offer support (to getting back on track academically, which is what he says he wants) its telling him what to do. And he has started talking to me as though i have too high expectations - rent, clearing up, helping out etc, worse still, its like he is entitled. Its like he has reverted to being a 13 year old (he’s 20). I am very worried about his mental health but wonder if thats misplaced. I’m also full of angst but dont know whether to lay the law down about applying for these academic situations or leave him to his own devices (which means he does noting) In the meantime i want to move on with my life. I helped out at with his uni costs but he is resenting every move i make to move costs over to him now he is earning. It is all very worrying and i dont know which way to proceed.

Hi you must be worried. I have a feeling my son will also leave after this year with no degree but a lot of debt. I'm saying no to requests for a food delivery and I'm suggesting he works part time around his course. His disrespect towards me is shocking and I'm so ashamed of the way he treats me. I wouldn't force your son ba I into education but I would suggest that he looks for at least a part time job while he decides. I also worry about my son's mental health and our relationship has deteriorated so much since I started saying no!

nickij, your relationship will recover once he matures enough to realise that you were right. Hold firm. You will need to tell him that the money this month has gone on the car/saving for a new boiler/savid for christmas. Let him understand you have other financial responsibilities other than him.

Dont fret about the loan - he will only start repaying once he is earning.

I think some kids are happy to fly the nest and others need a push. Its hard to keep saying no - especially when its food, but its what you need to do. DD went to uni with lads that spent their entire loan in the first couple of weeks at uni and had nothing to live on. AMazingly they survived and managed to get a job. Unless he is doing a massive course that requires 35+ hours a week contact time, then most undergrads are only doing 10-15 hours contact a week which leaves plenty of time for working.

Dont let him guilt you into supporting him.

Good advice thank you. I think he has spent up so I dont know what he's doing but last year I lived on porridge oats for a week cos I'd helped him too much. It's the disrespect and lack of consideration for me that hurts and his unrealistic expectations of me.

Dont know if anyone will read this update but I thought my son was doing better this year, he recently got a job on Saturday nights but as we only live an hour away he has started coming home, he came for 1 night last week and as he was ill he coughed all night and I got no sleep and had to work the next day. Then he keeps asking for £10/£15 all the time. I said no last week so he sent horrible messages so I agreed only if he paid me back which he has done. He said he was coming home for xmas on 23rd Dec but then yesterday said he wanted to come home last night as uni was basically finished, I didn't want him to but felt mean saying no. I said he would have to get the bus but not late as I had a 10 hour shift today. I stupidly transferred £10 for the bus then instead of coming home early he texted at 22.50 and asked if I'd pick him up from the bus station and I said no I was in bed then 15 minutes later he said he had forgotten his key so I said I'd leave the door unlocked by this time I realised he'd hot the last bus so wouldn't be home until 1230. I told him I was angry and its selfish and he mocked me and said I was dramatic. I have a lot of anxiety around sleep so I lost it and said I was locking the door and he could go somewhere else, I then switched my phone of.. at 1245 he was knocking a the door, I ignored it then at 1.30 so I got up and told him to go to a friend's until he can respect me. I thought he had gone then at 3.30 he was knocking again so I let him in. I've realised he sat in the back yard, ordered a takeaway and left all the rubbish outside. I feel rea6mean as it was such a cold night but I'm sick of him thinking it's ok to disturb me late at night . Do you think I was too harsh?

No i dont. But i think you needed to have set a boundary earlier on in this ‘transaction’ and not let him pass it. At the moment I think he knows that if he keeps going on at you he will succeed somewhere on the spectrum. And then he guilts you by deflecting his responsibility and attitude on to you. I think your boundary line this time should have been at yes he could come home from university but he is an adult and has to make his own way as you are busy working. You can show him your love and ‘be there’ for him in other ways - maybe by saying ‘it will be nice for you to come home, i will cook us a dinner on such and such a night’. If he messes you about on that day Too, then dont make a big thing about it, just calmly say that You love him, but you value your time, that he hasn’t and you wont be doing that again until you see an effort from his side. At some point I think you must sit down with him and write down the boundaries and what you expect from him and what the consequences are if he crosses them. Then there can be no argument or need to ‘have a discussion’ after an event as he seems to firmly throw the blame back on you. I have had some improvements with my son, but it is like he has gone back to the phase of being 13- 15 years old where you are having to push them into being an adult with responsibility but they just want all the benefits without taking responsibility on. I have managed to get rent out of him (see above, he crashed out of uni and i got him to get a job) and money towards food but his resentment was palpable. I also laid down rules as to what he had to do around the house. Again he resents it. It’s like he feels he is entitled to be a child, when he chooses, and an adult when he chooses. We have made steps forward, the biggest one was when i didnt lose it when i got cross over his lack of doing jobs around the house, i calmly said ‘it would be nice if you did your jobs before i asked you to, as i dont want to have this conversation or have to ask you. If i have to keep reminding you, It feels like i am in a marriage with a lazy person, and thats not where i choose my life to be’. Not sure that is a good thing to say but it seems to have worked to a degree. However, i still have my concerns and If your son continues to be like this you may wish to read up about narcissism. I know they are still young, and we are their mothers so that could be why we are taking the brunt of this, plus you sound like a very empathic person, but their lack of awareness of other people, their feeling of ‘entitlement’ and lack of boundaries i am afraid smells of narcissism. I have one eye on that. I know it sounds dramatic but the lack of empathy my son sometimes shows could mean its a possibility. A good website on this is ‘knowing the narcissist’. Narc.com You could ask some questions in that forum and there are also consultations available - at a reduced rate if you are financially in difficulty. It’s very difficult isn’t it when you have been a single mum, you are at a time when you could be making a difference to your own life but you have to put it on hold again, financially and in other ways. meanwhile, the fathers are happy to drop the ball when they reach 18. Good luck, and keep finding space for yourself and protect some time and money for you. It’s your time now too.

Thank you for your response its really helpful and I feel a little better, I've taken the day off work as I'm so tired and stressed and I feel really down, as usual he's sleeping all day. I told a friend and she said oh well you did what you thought was best so I think she thinks I was wrong so I'm really upset

He’s ruling your life - you need to take your life back into your own control. Your friend doesnt necessarily think you were wrong. You are blaming yourself and if this is what you do it is how he manages to manipulate you. Take this day to sit down and write out your boundaries. Let him sleep so you have time for yourself. Then set out your rules for the holiday.

Good advice, thank you.

He got up and asked if we could do a food shop, I cant really afford it but I said ok, then we argued in the car and didn't go shopping and now he's packed up and left again and said I'm mental and he isn't coming back for xmas

I think that is his choice. I feel for you, these boys manipulate us. I think he will come back in his time, and when he does please ask him to be respectful. I don’t think you were unfair in the night. Look after yourself and don’t blame yourself. He is choosing to be like this. I wonder if he is so disrespectful to others. I suspect not. (My DS is like that at 15, I am realising I am too soft).

My stepson was a total nightmare from 16 onwards and we were amazed when he went to Uni at 19 but then he dropped out of Uni during his last year and his dad and I tried not to worry too much, but you can't help it.
Thankfully, he met a fabulous girl and he sorted himself out by his mid twenties and now he's doing seriously well running his own business, very focussed and on mega bucks. Honestly, I'd never have guessed he could achieve so much because he always seemed moody and difficult but he's like a completely different person these days, and so kind and thoughtful.

I'm sure you're doing a great job but just hang in there when it gets really tough and hopefully, you will both get through this.

He has said he isn't coming back for xmas and I owe him an apology. He said he was so cold he was hallucinating and I'm crazy, hateful and horrible. I've said I had to do it because he respects nothing I say and he didn't care that it was so late. I just wish this hadn't happened so near xmas. I've asked him to let me know for definite by Saturday what he's doing

Start from scratch with him. Write down your boundaries, eg you'll pay for X and he has to find the rest through work. There are to be NO top ups of cash or extra good shops beyond what's been agreed. You love him and want to enjoy spending time together during holiday periods but he is an adult age you expect him to take responsibility for his own travel, laundry etc. Any nasty emails will not be tolerated- you'll bin them and he don't be welcome to stay anymore. In return, don't be rude to him and don't raise your voice. Just calmly repeat the rules even if you end up sounding like a parrot. If he follows the rules try to enjoy time together and do something you both enjoy eg watching a film or whatever.
Oh and put it out there now that after uni you're expecting him to find a flat or pay you the going rate for his room and board.
The moment he crosses any of these boundaries just calmly ask him to leave.
If he phones you up asking for extras just say no, that's not part of the agreement.
Good luck

I dont think you should have locked him out, why does he not have a key?
He is immature and full of bravado hence all the your wrong and he is right, think of him as a teenager and just ignore the rude and obnoxious behaviour.
Say no to any money for anything. If you can afford it , buy him staples such as pasta , rice, boxer , toiletries etc
Dont look for affection, your needs to met, praise , validation etc, you reared him to go and leave and live his own life and that's what he is doing and that's good.
He got a part time job and that's what you advised him to do.
Try to carve a different type of relationship ship with him, be kind, you are both struggling but he is not mature or responsible enough right now to recognise your worth, he will be some day so dont damage the relationship in between. Xx

Oops I see he forgot his key. My son does the same. However, he was coming home to his mam, he need you, he is hungry , he is cold and he needs you. It's so frustrating when they seem like adults and and act like children. But he is still looking for help, buy the food and at least feed him. Explain your finances to him and let him know calmly how you are struggling at the moment.

Thanks for the responses but I didn't let him in because yet again he showed his total lack of consideration and respect for me, I asked him to get an easy bus to wait until the next day so I could sleep but he turned up at 1245am. If he's hungry then he should spend his money on food not going out. I cant afford to support another adult.