Having trust issues with DD - do I lighten up or tighten up?

[Jaggypinecone]

DD is 15, will be 16 in a couple of months. Since puberty we've had our ups n downs but things were good from about age 13. She studies hard and gets good grades.

She's started now with typical teenage behaviour, wanting to stay out late, stay for last minute sleepovers and the latest is staying over with a male pal (platonic so she says - we said no way to that one).

I know they test the boundaries but she always seems furtive now. For example she'll say she's just going out for a walk then text later to say she's hanging out up at her friend's house - why not just say from the start she's going to friend's house?

I know she's been drinking too but lying about it. I don't mind the drinking per se, we've tried to be liberal about this and allowed her the odd beer or small glass of wine but I picked her up from another friend's the other week and she clearly had a shitty hangover and was throwing up. However even when I asked if she'd been drinking she still denied it and said it must've been what she ate. Now a couple of weeks later, I've since discovered that she had gotten an older friend to buy them vodka.

I hate the lying. I just don't trust what she says now and whilst I want to be chilled, I end up worrying myself sick about where she is and what she's doing. She has lied about other things and even when confronted about it, will dig in and deny it - she never eats humble pie. I'm at my wits end. I'm concerned that she is lying about other things now too, including drugs. My DH is much more chilled about it but to the extent that I feel he's burying his head in the sand.

I'm really not coping well with this teenage stuff and I can't help have a gut feeling that there is more to be worried about. So do I chill a bit and let her make her own mistakes so that the communication lines are kept open? Or what?? I'm just not myself with all of it and it's taking it's toll. I mean it's 2.30 in the morning and I can't sleep.

See the real issue, as far as I'm concerned is the drinking. If she's drinking enough at her age to get a hangover and throw up then she's possibly getting in risky situations with boys too.

Her boundaries will go right down.

I'd have to make her not sleep over at that particular friends' house. That's what I'd do anyway.

15 is too young to be getting pissed like that. UK culture normalises it but alcohol is a VERY powerful drug and causes thousands of deaths a year.

OP I'm a liberal parent, but pissed at 15 and staying out to boot? Not on my watch

Be firm. No more sleep overs.next time she lies tell her you know she's not telling the truth, tell her her lying is a problem. Start saying no. This bit of parenting is hard I've 3 and the middle one went of the rails and we were in and out of the police station and court for 3 years and it all started with sleeping out. Be supportive tho pick her up drop her off, like her friends, but trust your gut. I know I said be firm but gently rein her in and take control. Being drunk makes her vulnerable to all sorts.

I agree no more sleep overs. Give her some freedom and tell her she needs to earn your trust. Once she is doing the right thing slowly give her more freedom. If she lies she starts again and permanently loses her phone.

This is so hard. How do I confront her about the lying without revealing my sources? I guess I don’t need to. I’ve also been thinking back to myself at the same age. I was drinking, had an 18 year old boyfriend (albeit we never did anymore than kissed), was allowed to wander. But I don’t think I ever lied to my parents, perhaps it was because they never asked me directly but they must’ve known.

Hennypenny, I hear you. I grew up in quite a drinking culture. Though my parents were lovely it wasn’t uncommon to see the dads drunk. My ex had a drink problem so I know first hand the grim consequences of alcohol. As such we’ve always been more continental about drinking, especially in front of the kids so it’s even more of a gut wrench to know she’s doing this.

Say she told you the truth how would you react? That could be the clincher, the “mum I’m off to a party on Saturday can you get me some cider please?” Would you??
Would you refuse / ground her etc?

I think that is probably where the issue lies, it might be easier for her to lie to you than tell the true that and get in trouble?

My DSS is nearly 17 and yes we would buy him alcohol for parties - then at least we know what he is drinking and how much.
He is open and honest about the parties and we have built that up over the past couple of years. He doesn’t drink every weekend parties are every 4/5 weeks, sometimes more frequently. He doesn’t lie about where he goes as he knows that we won’t fly off the handle, he also knows that he will say no to things and no means no.

He’s a well rounded teen. Can you get this balance with your DD?

@Nearly She hasn't been to any parties though, she's only 15. This is just hanging out at pal's houses. She had some friends round the other week, I instigated it because I didn't know any of her 'new' friends and wanted to check them out. She asked if they could bring some booze and I did say yes to some beer or cider but not hard liquor. I even asked if she was going to be drinking and had some cider at the ready but she said no coz she was working the next day (holiday job).

I've asked her directly and calmly when I've suspected her of being drinking if she had been and she always denies it. I've given her the opportunity to come clean but she doesn't and I would have said we had a pretty good, open relationship where we could talk about things. I always believed her and have been clear that I would always want her to tell me the truth no matter how bad it is because I need to be able to trust her - this has been instilled (or so I thought) throughout her life. Can I get this balance with DD? That's what I don't know - how do you get the trust back?

I'd be sitting her down and saying something along the lines of 'We as your parents have a responsibility to keep you safe. You may think you're old enough to make your own decisions, but as you are a legal minor, we are partly liable for your actions.* This is why we need to know what you're doing and this is why we get a veto, which we need to use sometimes. Now, if you tell us the truth about your plans, we can discuss it. We may use our veto if we believe you won't be safe carrying out these plans, but we can discuss and perhaps agree on a modified version. And we can trust you to be straight with us and reliable. If you lie to us, we know you're planning to be unreliable and we therefore need to use our veto for all your plans until we feel you can be trusted.'

*This is likely to go down better than any suggestion that you know best and just want the best for her. She can argue with you, she can't argue with the law.

Thank you, that's helpful.

My dd told me an ongoing lie for 3 months and I now feel it very hard to trust her.
The only way I found out was one night her phone died and I went out looking for her tracked down the boys house that she said was her bf only to find out she was seeing a different boy. I was so angry I sat up all night with her going through her phone and lecturing her. I ended up in ad medication s and blood pressure tablets due to her lies.
She turned 16 yesterday so I think I will have to let go a bit and start to re trust her.
She is out now and I'm a nervous wreck thinking who is she with. Her bf is away on holiday so she is on a girls night out for her birthday. I Have a life 360 on my phone since she lied but it's not always 100%

Its so hard. I never thought I’d be like this. Had always hoped to be free and easy with my parenting and have mutual respect. But I can’t stand lying, cheating or stealing.

Dh and I had a big conversation with her today. Gave her a chance to dig herself out of the hole but she kept denying it until she knew we had rock solid proof.

So the consequences are no more sleepovers, when she does go out she’s got to adhere to a curfew, we have to take steps to rebuild trust. If she lies again, she gets reined in again with possibility of phone confiscation.

She said her friends don’t like me. Ha! I can live with that. She also said that at sleepovers her pals’ parents provided the gin/vodka they’d been drinking. I can’t believe that a responsible adult would supply spirits to 15/16 year olds. Beer/cider maybe but not anything that strong.

So will see how it goes.

It's really hard isn't it? I have a very similar sounding nearly 16 year old too, and she does push boundaries again and again. And like you I've of the things I find hardest is the lying. I feel it's hugely damaging to a relationship. I have found a few ways to avoid it. One is to initiate general discussions about things I think are issues (alcohol, drugs, etc) but to avoid asking direct questions about what she herself has done or not done. Another tactic if you're really sure about something is not to ask a question at all but simply say "DD I can see you're hung over, so must have been drinking last night" You don't always need to reveal your sources, you can have them thinking you've got special psychic powers .

I had a good conversation with DD the other day having discovered she'd been in a pub at 11.30pm (because I got a notification saying her Osper card had been refused ) Initially she claimed she'd been trying to buy a soft drink but I chatted about the pub and said that I thought they were the sort of place that was relaxed about serving underage and she then just carried on the conversation saying that she and her friends had indeed been buying alcohol, and we then spoke about how much alcohol is in different drinks. I couldn't have had that discussion if I'd just said "you're not allowed to drink" or "I don't believe you".

And you're entitled to hold on to your view of what she's been doing even if she does deny it. You're not a court of law and don't need to be able to provide concrete evidence of what happened last time she stayed out all night to say no to this time.

I do still demand phone numbers of friends' parents if DD says she's staying overnight and do call or text them at least some of the times. I think staying out all night is definitely something to keep in check.

But overall I feel strongly that keeping an open relationship is the most important thing, even if it means you have to accept them doing things you'd prefer they weren't. It's no use at all "banning" things that you can't actually stop them doing by going behind your back. You just stop them talking to you about it, which leaves them more vulnerable.

Why do the smilies I try to add keep showing up as gin?!!!

Thanks Firefliess. That’s good advice. The sleepover thing has been difficult. DS has and goes to sleepovers all the time, because I know these are youthful sleepovers, like they have always had - watching a movie, playing x box, midnight snacking that sort of thing. I Know the parents, have their numbers to cross check just in case. It almost seems hypocritical of me not to allow her sleepovers but DDs just seem so much more clandestine. She drifted away from her primary school friends, made pals with a couple of new kids for whom I did get phone numbers (coz she was still about 13/14). But she’s drifted away from these kids now too and become pally with a new lot in the last few months. I’ve no contact with any of their parents and she tends to refer to these new pals as my friend rather than by their name, which I find odd. When prompted she’ll say their name, but it all seems so secretive which just leads to me being more suspicious and questioning.

I get good reports from her boss, teachers and other parents that I know but there is an edgy side to her that terrifies me as to where it may lead her. Already she is talking about leaving school after her exams next year and having a gap year, she’ll only be 16. She is so desperate to spread her wings and leave. I can get this but whilst in many ways she is mature and seems old beyond her years, she is still very young and her recent examples prove she still has a lot of growing up to do.

Teens lie to protect relationships (I read somewhere). So weirdly enough, it's a marker that they care about you in their lives.

You could ask yourself... why isn't she willing to tell you the truth? What would you have to do to get much more truth out of her?

I hope you work it all out to your satisfaction, OP.

Would she have any of her new friends round the house at all? It might be easier for her to talk to you about them by name if you've met them. I was very private about my social life to my parents as a teen not because I really had that much to hide but just because it felt like a world they knew nothing about.

I have asked for parents numbers and called someone I don't know just to check out a sleepover plan btw. DD doesn't really like me doing it but the parents never seem to mind at all.

I don't think your DD is strictly speaking allowed a gap year at 16. They're supposed to be either in college or a job with training (eg day release) until 18 these days. But it's hard when they're so impatient to grow up isn't it? My DD is 16 next month so off to sixth form college in the autumn. She's excited about that, plans to get a Saturday job and it does feel like she's getting to be more grown up than at school. I'm thankful she wasn't born a few weeks later like yours as another year at school pushing every rule she can find would be hard work. Good luck!

My daughter is nearly 5 months old but I’m just gonna give you advice as I was once how your describing your daughter 😂 & what id personally do if your daughter was mine.. and read this closely please
Teenagers will be teenagers, they’ll do stuff you won’t want them to, but truth is what you won’t know won’t hurt you, all you can do is encourage her not to lie and if there’s anything she wants to talk about then your there, I hope your relationship is open cause that’s the best way! I felt like I couldn’t talk about sex or problems with my mother, when I moved away from her that’s when we got along better, don’t let it get to that..
I feel like if I had someone to talk to that’s family for example my mother life would of been easier for me, my family let me drink from around 15 but knowing where I was and not all the time, safe is better than unsafe they use to say it’s not a crime to get a bit drunk and have a laugh, just supervised so daft stuff doesn’t happen. Not saying when your daughter is out getting pissed she gets up to all sorts with boys etc cause she may not be like that! But some girls are cause they cannot handle themselves but hopefully your daughter has been brought up better than that. As for going out then messaging you she’s hanging out there I don’t think she’s lying I think that’s just teens making plans amongst themselves, nothing you should be worried about. And as for the boyfriend business I mean she’s a young lady now she’s blossoming towards adult life, she’s round the age to get a boyfriend and tbh as long as you encourage a healthy one you should be happy for her, if not already get him to come round and meet him, boyfriends and friends call be all in one I know she’s still “young” but if your not happy with safe sex in your house, sofa would do him? And if anything happens whilst house is sleeping aslong you have her on contraption then no worries (whether you like it or not teens have sex it’s better to encourage safe sex than not atall) and she’s old enough to make her own decisions, she’ll always be your baby girl but you gotta remember there comes a time where she’s a person of her own!!
She seems like a lovely girl doing good in school etc and you’ve obviously done a good job to hear your daughters a kind person. It’s just teenage antics she’s getting up to, it’s reality isn’t it..she will grow out of it soon enough just make sure to have a open relationship with her and it’ll guide her in the right path, everyone makes mistakes she’s still a human being, you’ll both be looking back laughing about this in no time! She’s closer to 18 so maybe treat her more like an adult if you don’t already. You seem like your trying hard with her just try not let it get to you too much babe, I’m sure you was similar when you was a teen just more sneaky I suppose 😂 good luck x

Maybe encourage her to let her mates stay at the house if not already set up a girly night for them , few drinks, Netflix & a take out seems harmless to me. Listen hun it’s all about encouraging your daughter and talking to your daughter teens being teens and mums not knowing what to do is just life isn’t it.. no right or wrong answer. You parent how you feels best. Try make her aware your always there for her

She's emotionally blackmailing you to be a nice parent, ie give her carte Blanche to allow her to do as she pleases. Just like her friends' parents. Not.

I read about a study that suggested all teens lie (98%) - and often it's not even about stuff they'd get into trouble about - they just don't want you to know stuff.