I need to put this somewhere

[ssd]

and I've chosen here

I know there will be many many posters who disagree with me and tell me I'm wrong, but I need to put this down somewhere, even if no one understands

I couldn't even write a header for it as anything I write sounds like I'd change my boys, which I wouldn't, ever.

I have 2 boys who I couldn't love more or be more proud of, I've supported them all their lives and always will. I've stood at more pitches than I can tell, spent more on tickets, than I can begin to say, I'm just setting the picture incase someone comes on and says oh get a hobby with your boys/spend time with your boys etc etc

basically, I'm envious of friends with girls....and the close relationships they seem to have....and I'd like it for myself

I don't have any female relations, not mum etc etc and no girls in my family

I have friends, don't get me wrong, but now our kids are in their late teens/early twenties, I hear so much of what my friends with daughters do together and I just yearn for that, just a bit of that

as I said, and I cant empathise it enough, I love my boys and wouldn't change either one for every girl in the world, but I listen to what my friends are doing with their daughters, afternoon teas together, going for spa days, cocktails, make up shopping, ......and I'd just love a daughter to do this with, mind you I'd love a close sister to do this with as well, or a mum.

I suppose it's similar to a dad with only daughters who'd love a son as football mad as them, when their wife/daughters don't like football

I know MN will be full of mums who go to spa days with their teenage son etc etc but I don't and I'd just love a girl who wanted to go with me

I sympathise with you. I have two boys and we're very close (one of them does actually like doing spa days with me just as you guessed! ) but day in day out I'm the only woman in the room. Most of our remaining relatives are men too, so even at big family get-togethers I'm still the only woman in the room. I'd love to have some female allies in daily life. And as both my sons have come out, I can't even look forward to daughters in law. So I sort of know what you mean.

My Dad and his brother were incredibly attentive to their mother, especially as she got older, if that cheers you up at all.

I have never done those things with my mother or my sister.

I can't even imagine doing spa days with either of them to be honest.

it sound like you're fantasising and imagining this perfect relationship which probably wouldn't happen.

Do you have brothers? Did your brothers notice things about your mum?

thanks for all the understanding here, from everyone

@Thatstheendofmytether My mil is extremely close to my girls more than my own Dm, she has them twice a week and has them sleep over and takes them on holidays,my own dm has never done that and I'm extremely close to my mother,so it's not always the case x

I have DS and have struggled with accepting infertility. We began adoption but pulled out as not right for us. I feel so sad that we won't ever have a DD.

My DM is emotionally stunted, scared by the horrific abuse she suffered as a child. She did her best. I needed, and deserved better.

Having DS triggered a whole host of emotions I thought I had dealt with. Seeing the same problems with my new perspective as a parent left me unable to forgive previous issues I had already forgiven.

Its been a few years now and I'm starting to feel as though having a DD would be so much more difficult than a DS. Being a mum to a daughter, I think would make it harder still to understand my mums actions and inaction through my childhood.

I've never had the close relationship with DM that other friends have with theirs. I have no sisters and I totally get where you're coming from. It would be nice, but it won't happen.

I chose football, monster trucks and trump trains (don't ask). Maybe there will be a grand daughter to do the girly girl things with. And keep me young at heart.

You can't change how you feel. But you can change how you feel about how you feel.

I do get it.... but girls and mums also have much much worse arguments.

Oftentimes that is, obviously not always

writing this down here has helped me, but its made me feel really wrung out and emotional

I always felt so guilty even thinking this, as if somehow it made it seem like I didnt want my boys, or have something against them, and writing it down here has made me see its a separate issue and thats been a bit of a relief to me

I'd just like a woman in my family I felt close to, like I felt close to my mum and when I hear of friends doing mum/daughter stuff, that I'd like to do, I feel like I'd have liked a daughter. But a close sister would do as well, or even better my mum being alive. But none of it is to be and I cant help yearning for it and feeling so sad when I hear of others stories.

I dont really know how to get over it, I feel it'll just go on and on and if I dont make my peace with it soon I'll carry it all my life.

I just dont know how to.

I have a sister, a lot older than me and there's a huge backstory, but basically we're polar opposites and she has daughters shes really close to and has never needed a sister. I dont want to explain it all but there isn't a relationship there and I've had to withdraw for my own sanity.

I hear you but honestly you could have a daughter and be just as disappointed.

I have a DD - don’t go to spa days together. Don’t go clothes/make up shopping together. Don’t go for afternoon tea’s etc. Don’t discuss ‘girly’ things, closest we get is when I ask if she needs me to order more pads in the online grocery shop.

We do however go out together for the occasional lunch and movie. We also go to the occasional concert together.

Also have a DS. We go together out for the occasional lunch and movie. We also go to the occasional concert together.

So in my life there is no difference between son and daughter apart from the fact they like different types of food, different types of movies and different entertainment acts. I don’t have a closer or ‘different’ relationship with DD and we don’t do any of the things you mention or anything I don’t do with DS. Not because I have made any conscious decision in this regard to treat them ‘equally’ it’s just the way it has naturally evolved for us and that’s okay. There’s no magical understanding or connection between us because we are both female, our connection is based on other common points of (non gender related) interest.

Female bonds are deeper than male ones, usually.

It’s not about spa days or shopping. I hear you op

I'm not disappointed at all. Thats not how I feel about any part of my life. I'm just sad I dont have any close women in my family life.

continuallychargingmyphone thank you

I couldn't be closer to dh or the boys but its not the same and that's not saying its bad at all, just that its different and its the difference I miss.

"do you know what I miss/what I yearn for, someone to think like a girl/woman, someone to notice what lipstick I wear, or what brand, someone to notice my eyebrows need done, someone to help me choose a dress for a party, someone to encourage me to dress up nice, someone to notice what women notice, basically."

Hate to say it, but I'm so glad you weren't my mum because that would have been my idea of absolute hell and I would have been such a disappointment to you.

My own mum would quite probably have liked a bit more feminine connection but on the whole she has been happy to meet me in the areas we can meet: intellectual interests, a fondness for the sea and boats, travel and art.

Never had a connection to my own daughter relating to any of the areas you describe: we are very close but again it's about similar interests, finding something we can enjoy together. Which is pretty much how I relate to my son.

I bet your mum was lovely. Have you had any bereavement counselling? Cruse are brilliant and good at helping you unravel your feelings.

It is ok to feel sad about this

I know what you mean OP. I can't see myself going on spa days with anyone, still less my mother (now dead) or my daughters but I do like the intimate female family connection I had/have with them and my sister.

My dh comes from a big family of all boys. I am very close to my MIL, do things with her, talk to her. She gets on very well with all her DILs but is particularly close to me and one other. She would talk to me about anything, we go for lunch and shopping together. I stop short of the kind of conversation I would have easily had with my mum along the lines of "your bra is awful mum you need to get properly fitted" but my intrepid sister in law did manage to get there (mind you she refused to accept that she needed a smaller bra size :)) I never saw it that I already had a mum so didn't need a connection with MIL - I saw it as an extra close female relationship that was of immense help and support to me/her at times.

So you may well have that close female connection in the future - with a DIL or a granddaughter.

I'm another whose mum died when I was a tot. I grew up with a SM but we've never been close (understatement).

I look at my aunt and how she gently deals with her DM (who has dementia and is in a care home) when she's got hairs growing on her chin. Or looks out a brooch to match her dress.

I hope that I'll do that for my MIL (who has 2 sons) when the time comes. And in the meantime I invite her for shopping trips. I notice when she's painted her nails.

The downside is that she talks to me about her 'Women's problems' and her sons assume that I'll deal with that sort of thing so they don't have to.

I understand what you're saying OP. And I sometimes wonder if my DH has similar thoughts as we've not got any sons.

OP I could have written your post. I also have two boys (17 and 19) and am really beginning to feel the lack of a girl in a way that I didn't when they were little. It's very hard to admit but however close you are to your sons, there are some things that are just never going to happen because they're boys. For example I have two brothers who I'd say are closer to my mum in some ways than I am but when it comes to going away for a few days on a citybreak, or going clothes shopping, it's always been me that does that with her, not them.

I also have friends who have lovely close relationships with their grown up daughters and feel they have a whole future to look forward to, now that the tricky teenage years are over, which will be different to mine with my sons. I think the only way to deal with it, which I'm trying to focus on, is to nurture your female friendships as much as possible (citybreaks with a great friend are pretty fab!), nurture your relationships with your nieces and goddaughters if you have them as they grow up, and cross your fingers that two lovely daughters in law come along in due course who you can have a great relationship with!

my mum was lovely, but she became like my daughter, IYSWIM

and yes, I went to Cruse and also paid for private counselling

thanks for everyone who replied, its a lot to think about

and its funny, mum and I would never have done a spa day but she'd have loved an afternoon tea...but as a poster ^^ said, its not about spa days and shopping.

I am 1 of 3 girls so I feel my poor old dad was in the same situation as you for years and years - he loves football but none of us could bear it.

Now 2 of us are married and he has 2 son in laws that he can have a pint with and talk about football.

The future could be very bright for you ssd. With any luck you will get 3 lovely daughter in laws. I certainly go for afternoon tea / theatre etc with my mother in law. xxx

I have one of each (teens now, you don’t say how old you’re are) - older girl - and I really wanted a girl so I know I’m lucky in that respect. I wanted to replicate the mother:daughter relationship that I had w my late mum. It’s not rocket science to understand that so I get what you’re saying.

Both my DCs are great but my DS, bless him, hates shopping ‘just get it without me, mum’ he says. The only thing I have to shop with him for are shoes!! DD enjoys a browse etc so we do occasionally go but she tends to go with friends too (and buys stuff I hate with her own money!)
He’s not into spa stuff (DD and I have been once) although dh is so he might like it when older.
I suppose if I’d had only boys I may have felt like you, but I have friends who only have boys and love it. You have to make the best of the situation I suppose. When ds was younger he liked the London museums so we did that, he’s more open than DD so will chat more about his feelings (although less so now he’s a teen).
He likes a meal or afternoon tea out out, so you could do that. Any programmes you both like? I’ve bonded with DS over some comedy. He likes anything irreverent like little Britain, come fly with me etc.

I get it, I have girls and my dh can feel left out - luckily one is sporty, loves spending time with him and gets rather overindulged consequently with trips to sporting events, both girls like "male" films like superheroes and like to game so he has encouraged them to like what he likes!

I often look wistfully at people with same sex siblings and wish I had DC that shared interests or at the least I could do stuff with them together.

It’s been years since we’ve even been able to find a film they both like!

Mother daughter relationships can be a lot more fraught and I think I probably agree with the comments about the idealised view of the perfect relationship.

But I still hear you. Also I guess we should all count our blessings - we have children, they are healthy etc.

When they get partners they will be very lucky to have you in their lives