15 year old son - help and advice please!!

[Celtickitten]

I am at my wits end with my 15 year old son and would really welcome any advice people might have. I first posted over a year ago when school informed us that he had been allotted 30 mins extra time for each GCSE exam after (unbeknow to us) they put him through tests for dyslexia. He hasn't got dyslexia but school have now provided us with a supporting letter for ADD referral - though DS refuses to see a GP about it.

Basically, DS was identified as a high achiever early in primary school but all the way through primary we were told that although he was achieving above average, he wasn't 'reaching his potential'. Fast forward to now and his academic attainment and engagement with school is non existent. His targets are 10 A or A* and at the end of Y10 he scraped 1 C in his mock GCSEs. His behaviour in class has also gone downhill resulting in lots of detentions and he also has a lot of lates. He starts Y11 this September and has decided that he wants to get an apprenticeship after GCSEs and leave school - he doesn't care what in. He just wants to earn money. He has read that he only needs 5 GCSEs for an apprenticeship and so has decided that he's only going to engage with 5 subjects. He is at a very academic comp and there is no way they'd accept this. I can see another year of us being constantly called into school ahead of me. I also don't agree and think he should try for more, but it's like hitting our head against a brick wall. He won't take any advise and just gets very agitated and angry if we try and discuss it with him. He says he absolutely hates school and can't wait to get out of there - though he does have a good set of friends and enjoys the social side. DS seems desperate to grow up- as well as wanting a job, he often talks about wanted to leave home as soon as he can (which really upsets me) and his ambition is to have his own home with a girlfriend and a baby (is this normal for a 15 year old?!). He recently split from his girlfriend which hit him hard and resulted in some worrying behaviour at school. As a result he started counselling on the advise of school but doesn't want to continue with it. For the first time ever me and DH are at odds in our parenting of him - leading to heated debates and arguments. He thinks he should be allowed to fail as it is the only thing which may make him see sense. I'm stilll trying to channel him into trying for all or most of his GCSEs as I think that will give him a. Hence of getting a decent apprenticeship but it does feel like a losing battle.

On the other side to all this he is actually a lovely lad - something many people comment on and is caring and loving. He's football crazy - watching and playing and had a fantastic report from his recent 2 week work placement - it was like they were talking about another child. He's also not getting into any other trouble as far as we know though is a total space cadet in terms of keeping in touch and money goes through him like water.

Apologies for this very long post - I'd really appreciate your views as I fell overwhelmed with what to do

I work in a boys school and feel so angry that we force our young men to sit in classroom and take dozens of exams when so many of them are not interested and would be far happier learning useful skills. Some teenagers are just not interested in academic achievement.

It is also so frustrating when they are academically capable but just don't want to put the effort in to achieve good results.

Try and keep this in perspective but 5 good grade GCSE's are better than 11 low grades.
The fact he that wants to do an apprenticeship is a good thing, and hopefully he will put a lot of effort into getting one. You should support him with this aspiration. I hope school will provide advice and help him find a placement.
You say he is at an "academic" comprehensive, but there will be many others in his year who are not interested in studying. School will have to accept this. You cannot force them to study or even to turn up for the exams.

Be thankful he is still going to school, not refusing, or dealing drugs, or drinking to excess.

My DH left school with 2 O levels and did an apprenticeship and he is now a highly salaried specialist engineer. He did an OU degree at 40.

Good luck.

Get him to research apprenticeships. The good ones that lead to lots of money are highly competitive and will need more than the 5 GCSEs he is targeting. Unfortunately, many apprenticeships seem to be a way for some companies to hire staff below minimum wage and provide minimal training before cutting them loose at the end of the programme to replace with the next batch.

I really feel for you OP as our son was in some ways similar. He is very bright, high achiever through primary and into secondary until Y9 where he just lost interest in school. He wasn't very sociable though and not at all sporty. He used to just stay in his rim after school, usually online gaming.

He did tolerably well at GCSEs - 5 As an A*, 3 Bs, 2 Cs, 1D and so went into 6th form where he failed the first year very badly. The school let him restart Y12 with different subjects and that seemed to go well, he did really well in AS exams. However, things then spiralled down. He stopped going to school, didn't leave the house, his sleep pattern was all over the place. Since Y10 his behaviour/attitude towards us was bad but it got seriously appalling by Y13. He was depressed, angry, verbally abusive and physically aggressive (not to us directly, but breaking stuff, damaging walls, doors etc). It was hell. He also kept telling us he was going to leave home as soon as he could and quite frankly we felt that would be a good idea as his behaviour was having a serious negative impact on me, dh and ds2.

Like with your son, he was perfect with other people. Neighbours commented on how polite and chatty he always was - it was indeed like they were talking about another person.

In the end, he didn't take any A levels as he had completely disengaged with school and with us by that point. I was in despair as I couldn't see any sort of future for him.

He then got a job - and transformed almost overnight into a lovely young man. He blossomed. It was the absolute making of him. I couldn't believe the difference. That was 2 years ago. Since then, he has developed a social life and goes out regularly with friends. He works hard and 18 months ago got a job with a big organisation where he has a bit of responsibility. He earns £23k which isn't bad for a 20 year old (19 when he started there). There's also a career progression path so he will have other opportunities. He moved out of home a few weeks ago to live independently nearby and we really miss him - something I never thought we'd say 3 years ago!

For my ds, and maybe for yours, the school system for whatever reason, was not right.. Being bright is not the same as being academic. I can see that as ds2 is probably equally as bright but also has a real thirst for knowledge, and really enjoys learning. He is off to uni in September.

Another friend of mine had similar issues with her son who has now just turned 19. He was different to mine in that he was very sociable, out all the time, had a girlfriend from the age of 14, and is incredibly sporty, especially football, so very like your ds. He was also bright but not engaged with school. He dropped out half way through 6th form and them went and got an apprecticeship where he is doing brilliantly. He us working really hard and has totally grown up.

If I were you I'd concentrate on trying to support your son to get 5 good GCSES including English and Maths and agree to him.looking for an apprenticeship if and when he has achieved that. I'd pick your battles - my biggest regret is that ds1 and I spent effectively 3 years having non stop arguments over everything to do with school/ studying. I should have stepped back and let him fail at times but it's really hard to do so! Maybe you and your dh could sit down with your son and agree jointly what to do for Y11 with a view to doing an apprenticeship next year.

And my other bit of advice would be to try to make sure you and dh work as a team otherwise you will just resent each other. My dh has the patience of a saint (unlike me!) and I couldn't have got through those 3 years of hell with ds1 without him. It did put a big strain on us as a couple but we got through it together.

Good luck.

I think you are putting too much pressure on him.
I'm in a similar situation with my 14 year old who is incredibly bright. He has ADD. I want my son to focus on his 5 'best' subjects but hopefully he'll engage with more. Mental health is so important in these tricky teenage years I just want him to be happy.
When I was 16 I got just 3 GCSE's. This was a bit of a wake up call and I managed to turn that into 6 GCSES within two years!
However I floundered for years in not so great jobs and it didn't come as a surprise to be diagnosed with ADHD at the ripe old age of 42.
I'm hoping to start University in the autumn to do a course with a very high chance of a well paid job at the end. Its all really too late and I regret those wasted years. Also ADHD wasn't diagnosed in my day. I was just a daydreamer and didn't apply myself
Your son has a clear idea of what he wants to do. As a pp said I would research apprenticeships with him. I've spoken with my son about getting a trade (electrician, plumber, carpenter) or going down the IT route. He would do well in any of these and the money once qualified is not to be sniffed at.
As a pp said some apprenticeships are a bit of a piss take so why not explore these now so that he has the opportunity to flourish?

Thank you everyone for your really helpful advise. It's so encouraging hearing that there may well be light at the end of the tunnel. I think the researching good apprenticeships is a good idea and will do that. I think the big battle may well be with school. They have really tried very hard with him up to now, but communication between the different staff is poor. When I suggested earlier this year that he is allowed to drop a couple of subjects to allow him to focus on 8 (how ambitious that now seems!), I was told firmly that 'that is not an option'. If he is only going to focus on half of his subjects it seems a waste of time going to the others. I think I'll book in another meeting in at the beginning of term to see if we can negotiate something. He is also planning to look for a part time job this year for his CV so I agree at least he has a plan.

We don't often let students drop subjects as the ones that do always promise to work harder in the others and never do.
Teachers tend to have different views on apprenticeships. We had a student who went on to an excellent programme. He was written off by many (not all) as naughty but was a star of the Tech department and a real success story (he ended up with a full funded degree from his employer).
I would say that even when we had a careers service they were rubbish on things like this so you may have to do the research yourselves. Good luck.

DS was a clever clogs who hated school, often refused to even go in. He did work in class, but refused almost all homework. Got good marks in the end. He is now a junior soldier in Army, btw.

...has decided that he wants to get an apprenticeship after GCSEs and leave school ... He has read that he only needs 5 GCSEs for an apprenticeship and so has decided that he's only going to engage with 5 subjects.

My advice to OP is work with what your son wants; he has to live his life. There are other paths back to university (for instance) he can pursue later. It's good for you if he can't decide which apprenticeship, then you can argue that he should try in all subjects in case any of them are relevant to what he does later.

My advice to my DS was that "if these GCSEs are the only qualifications you ever get, then make them good ones." He took that on board & got mostly As in the end. I also insisted that DS was always respectful to staff. He only had a terrible mark in one subject (RE).

He is at a very academic comp and there is no way they'd accept this. I can see another year of us being constantly called into school ahead of me.

Shame it's wrong school for your DS. But if you & your DS have a unified plan then you can jointly & politely rebuff school without getting wound up by them.

It's really hard when they disengage but not totally unusual. I've been a ks4 head of year for a number of years and there's always the case of the students who can but don't want to! I'd suggest looking at apprenticeships and actually contacting the place to meet him, this may inspire him to work harder, also some places may offer higher level apprenticeships which he will need more qualifications to get on to and again this may inspire him to stick in. School should be getting people in from all post 16 areas to talk to students and may have some contacts, so give them a call. I know it's frustrating but we're always loath to stop subjects at this stage, it sets a precedent and as previous posters have said it doesn't always equate to more work going into the remaining subjects.
Finally, are there any older lads that he looks up to, maybe ones who messed about a bit but then realise the importance of sticking in? If you could get him talking to somebody like that as I've found it seems to be more powerful coming from a peer than us nagging parents it teachers!
Sorry just realised how long this was!

A colleague & my aunt both tell Hellish stories about teenage daughters who were horrible about school. Rebelled, sass to teachers, wouldn't go in, low effort, scraped passes. Minimum ambitions. No drugs in picture AFAIK.

Both landed on feet, were great grafters once they entered the working world, ended up working in health professions.

My son sounds quite similar, he completely excelled at his small primary and then struggled when he hit secondary. He loves sport, which is a saving grace for him, but has hit a wall academically and wouldn't talk about it... eventually we worked out with him that he was finding peoples' expectations of him really intense.. that he was predicted A/A* in everything.. he said he didn't want to get these grades incase he didn't keep getting them, he said he thought he wasn't as clever as everyone thought he was, and he got bored and restless really easily in alot of classes, particularly in the classes where he thought the teacher didn't like him, and so was coming away with Cs and Ds.( In my experience there can be a lot of low-level sexism in his school, where boys are put down really hard for any bad behavour and girls get let off and given more positivity more easily - his sister finds secondary hard now she's started, but hasn't got in half as much trouble despite being v dreamy and forgetful). My son is now 14, and what really helped me was reading a book called 'blame it on my brain' and also finding one member of staff who he felt liked and respected him (his head of year who also was his rugby coach)... i went in and talked to him and my son's tutor, and this guy was amazing - offering for my son to go and find him anytime in school that he was having a hard time about anything. he also checked in with him in a low key way when he saw him around school... it made all the difference. Even though my son didn't actively try to search him out at any point, he now has an ally who will help stand up for him and doesn't expect him to be perfect all the time, and understands him getting frustrated. My advice would be to let your son know that you are on his side and will back him in any choices he makes, that you believe in him and you will stay by his side and help him figure things out. Like others have said, the school system really does expect all kids to fit in the same mould which is such a shame, as kids like yours, who are really lovely people, just don't get recognised for the beautiful people they are, beyond their grades. Good luck!

Nothing wrong with focusing on the GCSE's he needs/wants. I think it's eminently sensible, actually, if he's not engaging with the higher expectations of the school, and it's going to turn into a battle. He at least has a plan, and sounds to be quite a determined and single minded boy.

You may need to point out to him, however, that he must at least go through the motions with the other subjects, attendance, behaviour etc., or it may put his plan in jeopardy. Teens - you've got to just go with the flow and be there as a safety net, imo! Hope it all works out, op.

Agree that I'd help him plan him apprenticeship and focus on that - the school are focusing on their league tables but you need to focus on what your ds needs. Don't force him to meet other people's needs....

School should allow him to drop a couple of subjects to improve his chances in the others. Slightly different scenario but my DD 15 has a medical condition that has meant she has been unable to do most of the physical work for sports studies. School have agreed that since she will get a poor grade, she can drop it and spend those lessons in the library doing work for other subjects.