DD's temper getting dangerous--please help

[Lemonsponge]

My 16 yo DD flew into a temper this afternoon after school. Triggered by something unbelievably minor. She ended up walking out of the room, went to her room, then I started hearing crashing. She had tipped furniture over, there is stuff all over her room. I told her to get it sorted before her dad comes home. Told me to fuck off, slammed the door on me (all the filler has come out from the side of the door because she slams it so much and so hard). Then called me back. Just so she could ask me, would I prefer it if she does SH (which her DS does). Followed by repeated door slamming. Have lefet her to calm down for now but not sure how to handle it--be tough (get this fixed or else) or be more gentle (do you want me to help you sort thing sout now you have calmed down?). I am a bit worried about not goingn in there to see how she is in case she does hurt herself. Hope someone can help.

don't know what 'SH' is - but a common solution on here is to remove the bedroom door. She can have it back when she starts trying to solve her problems.

also remove all heavy furniture, again she can do without.

SH = self harming?

Id also say remove the door and any other furniture if this is the behaviour she has.

Does this happen regularly?

I had this with DD at that age. Apparently living with her parents was 'hell on earth'

DH calmly removed her bedroom door without saying a word. She also had to live with the dump that was her trashed bedroom because I didn't see how the clear up was anything to do with me!

She grew out of it by 18/19 ish.

there is no point trying to sort this out with the state that she is in - best to do this in 24 hours time when things are much calmer

I would be tempted to take the door of the hinges at another time to prevent damage, and explain she an have it re hung when she can sort out her temper.

Also talk about emotional blackmail and the pitfalls

I do think you have down all the right things in keeping clam and not reacting well done

Your instincts were sound: walk away and don't try to deal with her at all while emotions are running so high. Some other time you need to talk to her about ways of managing her anger and frustration without smashing things or self-harming. A punchbag might be useful...

SH?

I was a teen once but didn't ever get that bad pretty extreme.

This is the second or third time she has pushed over furniture but she did more this time. I am worried this is getting out of hand. She has these temper sessions where the slightest remark that upsets her triggers a major meltdown. She has been havin counselling at school but I'm wondering if it is making things worse. Can't get is straight in my head that she says, when my DS cuts herself, she gets all this love and concern, but when I do something to let my anger out and avoid cutting myself (she says she would never do that), I get told off. It's like saying to us, if you don't give me more attention, I will wreck the house or start harming mself. ivykaty, can you explain a bit more about emotional blackmail "and the pitfalls", not really clear what you mean about that. She did calm down yesterday, then came and said sorry and that the original thing she got angry abour was only the trigger but she doesn't know what the really big thing is that she is getting so angry about. Then at bedtime, wanted a chat and stomped off in disgust when I said, this really isn't acceptable behaviour, I don't expect you to behave like this. In two minds about taking off the door--could this make things worse?

I know taking doors off is popular round here, but I really wouldn't. It might work well as a shock tactic when a teenager is just having a bit of a strop... But in this case, she seems distressed, and personally I don't think you ever solve or help emotional distress by adding to it.

Yes, it could make it worse.

As someone has said, sit down and have a talk with her when you are both calm. Ask her if there is anything she needs help with and listen. There might be other MH issues she is trying to deal with on her own that she is not able to ask you/tell you about. Could she have an eating disorder, for example?

I would say you are concerned for her safety and do not want any more damage to your house. Let's make a list of things you could use as distractions from painful or negative feelings (you can look these up online). Things like watching a film, drawing, listening to or playing music, something else creative, going for a walk, etc.

Also, reassure her that you will get her specialist professional help for whatever she needs, but that you would need her to tell you if there is something you don't yet know about. (If there is something else going on, she might think you know already, she might sometimes think it's obvious to everyone).

Eating disorders are motivated by a disorder in the insular in the brain. It causes painful and unpleasant emotions. Children discover that self harm, binge eating or restricting their diet can relieve these feelings.

It terms of pulling over furniture, can you give her a soft ball to throw in her room instead?

And she has a point about 'acting out' versus 'acting in'. In our society, we do definitely seem to prefer people to keep their emotions to themselves, and we are much more sympathetic to those who harm themselves than those who express their emotional distress and harm others. If you think about it, CAMHS support is now almost exclusively for young people who harm themselves, whereas those who smash things up tend to get dealt with through the criminal justice system.

It is so hard to stand in someone else's shoes in difficult situations like this - and of course I don't know your kids or you at all - but I think that in your position, I would be agreeing with her that it is better for her to smash things than hurt herself or others, but that it's still not ideal. I think I'd explain (or remind her) that violence is frightening for other people, can cause damage, and can get her arrested. I think I'd reassure her that lots of teenagers feel overwhelmed by powerful emotions, and that the teenage years are a good time to learn to deal with these. And I think I'd tell her I accept that she needs some sort of outlet for difficult emotions, but that it would be better to find a less violent outlet that she can carry on using throughout her life... I'd help her explore things she thinks might work - anything from a punchbag to sport to oil painting might do it, depending on her personality.

And because both your daughters are struggling with this, lemon, I wonder whether there is a wider family issue? Could there be something going on that they're both angry about? Maybe not - as I said, the teenage years are just sometimes overwhelming - but I would consider it. This might be a situation where family therapy, rather than individual counselling, would be the best approach. You could ask your GP about it...

I wouldn't take the door off. Yes it seems a practical solution to the problem of her damaging it. But bedroom doors are psychologically important for creating privacy space boundaries and managed separation , etc which is what the teen years are really about.

take the door and replace with a curtain.

She needs her privacy which she should have and the curtain will provide but she also needs to learn that she can not go around banging doors and damaging property and expecting to get away with it.

Let her clean up her own room, she is old enough to do this and might think twice about doing it again next time. Don't threaten her with your DH and don't hide this from him, he needs to know as well how bad it is getting.

I think you all need family counselling rather than individual sessions. Obviously I don't know you or your family but it sounds to me that the SH is impacting on her just as much as if she was doing it herself.

there is a difference between anger and self harming and your dd sees the two things as the same.

emotional blackmail is where she say would you prefer I do this than that and then your answer is projecting her life choices onto you rather than her taking her own choices on herself and that it a slippery slop to travel as she will never feel in control of her own life is she uses that type of trick.

It would be better to get her a punch bag and hang in her bedroom or buy her some running shoes or a bike, exercise is a really very good underrated way of getting rid of feelings of anger because it changes the hormones produced in the body and this is can be very helpful at 16 if you can convince her to try it next time she feels frustrated and angry to walk away get changed and run, cycle or hit a bag and use the energy she has on that rather than using the energy to destruct. It would really help her feel better about herself

I definitely think you need to do both - have some tough consequences - something that really hurts her AND do all the therapeutic counselling-type conversations.

If you only punish you can end up in dead-end of mutual resentment and if you only counsel you can up in a dead-end road, too.

Counselling is helpful to help someone to understand themselves, keep a good relationship going and to find bigger solutions. But it is pretty useless in helping someone curb anti-social behaviour. Only repercussions do.

So, you always need a two-pronged approach.

I agree with your dd actually, in that my dd has been quite aggressive and it occurred to me recently after reading threads on here about self-harm, that actually I'd rather dd shouted or was rude to me than self-harmed. I haven't self-harmed personally, but have suffered from depression, and I know that turning those negative feelings inwards - whilst more socially acceptable - isn't a solution either. I think your dd is just trying to explain to you that to her, the rage is her way of expressing the same emotions your ds does through self-harming ie very strong emotions, that are difficult for her to handle. But just as you wouldn't 'punish' your self-harming child, I don't think you should punish one who's clearly stated this is her way of expressing the same feelings.

Your dd clearly is unhappy but the negative emotions are coming out as rage. But again, looking on the bright side, it's only her own room and possessions she's destroying, not yours - so quite considerate in a funny way. As it's her room, personally, I'd just ignore the mess - she can clean it up if it bothers her. And don't give her any breakable presents!

As much as you can try to get her to have enough sleep, eat properly (B vitamins are good for stress), and regularly, and take exercise. And try to get outside on sunny days. Little things, but that are all essential to build up her ability to calm herself and stay calm.

And then look at counselling, as others have suggested. And don't forget yourself - it sounds like you must be under huge pressure, with two children acting out in different ways. Look after yourself, treat yourself get counselling for yourself if you feel it would be useful.

Good post, freeezing. I agree with all of that.

Thank you all, especially flow and freezing. Sory not to have replied before but have been working and then Christmas. It turned out that she had a counselling session the afternoon before all this happened, and that during it she had got very very upset about her sister's SH. (Soemthing had happened with our other DD about a week before...which had meant me and my DH giving that DD a lot of attention...thankfully that does seem to have helped my other DD.) But during the counselling, this DD (the one I am writng about), had cried and sobbed about what her DS was doing...and I suspect the session then just had to end because the time was up and yet she was still in a state. Long story short, once we were able to talk this through, she calmed down a lot. I helped her with her bedroom, left her to finish the tidying and do the vacuuming and she has been great since then. Onlly small event has been yesterday when she had a bit of a wobble about school work and her future.

It's funny, it came out to my other DD, the one that does SH, what this DD had said, and I think it helped her too to understand what effect her SH is havin gon the wider family. fwiw, they both have an older DS who thankfully doesn't seem to have any of these sorts of problems, she is a high achiever and we have wonedered whether DD2's SH problems are in part the result of her feeling she has to measure up to the same standards, but can't.

What exactly is family therapy, how do you get it and do you have to pay for it?

Family therapy/counselling is like individual counselling, except all members of the family attend - or as many as are willing. It's often considered useful when there are complex problems in a family, or when behaviour within a family is affecting more than one person.

There are lots of different types of family therapy/counselling, and some of it is free, though there is usually likely to be some charge.
Relate do it and so do lots of other private therapists and charities. You can find out more and (I think) check that any therapist is reputable via the Institute for Family Therapists. In some areas, GPs will refer families to CAMHS, then CAMHS will provide it or refer families on, and then it is free - but several people here have gone privately because that speeds things up a lot....