3 AS levels or 4?

[GetOrfMoiiLand]

DD is attending sixth form in September, she is studying 3 AS levels - History, Geography, Media Studies. Her head of sixth form wants her to study an additional subject at AS (and going on to do 3 at A2) - this will be either Biology, ICT, Photography or Business Studies.

DD and I really want her to concentrate on the 3 AS and not take an extra one. She is not interested at all in any of those subjects, and I think the jump from GCSE workload to a level will be a significant one. I would rather she concentrates on 3 subjects she really wants to study. She is dyslexic and therefore essays etc take her longer than anyone else - she works very well but I don'y want her to be demoralised by the workload if it proves too much.

Are 3 AS levels enough?

Forgot to add, that there is loads of incorrect information floating about on forums about entry requirements. ( even here on MN). The best thing to do if you are in any doubt is to contact the Uni admissions Departments and get the to confirm things to you in writing. Eg, I would not be too sure that media was not a good third A level unless I had checked with an official University source. For example, Sheffield explicitly excepts General Studies so I very much doubt it would disapprove of Media Studies.

Thank you very much everyone.

Yes, it is a small sixth form hence the infuriating option blocks, however she would like to stay at that 6th form as they have been a tower of strength in assisting her with her dyslexia, and giving her tools to cope with the large essay workload. Plus she also moved secondary schools mid year in Year 9, understandably she doesn't want to move again.

The ICT is not an a level, it is a Level 4 BTEC which I don't think is very helpful, so I think either biology or business studies (but business studies looks incredibly dull and I wouldn't imagine is valued very highly).

I wish to god she hadn't chose media because I think it is a waste of space personally but she has had enough of my sighs of exasperation about that.

She has only recently thought about university - for a few years she has wanted to join the forces at 18 - but currently is looking at mid-range and ex poly type universities like Hull, Oxford Brookes, Brighton, University West of England, Bath Spa etc.

Loshad
Point d). Is a very good point indeed.

Level 3 Btec.

Point d is a very good point indeed.

ds has just confirmed that if you do a subject at a2 - the final year of a level - then your as result doesn't count at his uni

you really have to look at want you want to study - as much as you can at this stage and then choose your options for your interest and ability and also what uni you want to choose

Media studies is fine, especially if she enjoys it

(maybe not so good if she was looking at Cambridge )

OOOh no, not looking at Oxbridge or Russell Groups. (I will have to say this quietly, it is probably a crime to admit on mumsnet that your child isn't going to a RG university )

Yes some of the universities she is looking at do not accept the AS scores as part of the tariff.

shock, horror, she's not going to Oxbridge or a Russel Group Uni, I presume it must be Harvard then.

Oh no just re-read ....soooo many typos

actually it's just that I am rubbish at spelling Accepts NOT excepts etc etc

My ds has just finished his first year of a levels and only did 3. He should be ok getting in to uni as us dropping one subject to keep it as an AS and starting a new AS in his 2nd year in September. His tutors have advised he shouldn't have any problems getting into uni. I would say it depends in how bright your do is. A levels are very hard do if your dc is super bright they may be ok trying 4. My ds is clever but not an A* pupil and he's found it challenging but really enjoyed his first year at college

She will have ALOT of free time with 3 AS levels. DS2 just done 4 AS at 6th form college. He still had the whole of tuesday off and finished at lunch time on fridays - not exactly a taxing timetable!
Some history degrees will prefer 2 of your A2s to be essay writing subjects.

Hull is NOT an ex-poly. It is a proper red brick University. With excellent facilities and outstanding teaching. Often overlooked, largely because of he city itself.

I did say* mid-range and ex-polys.

Hull looks great tbh, that is top of the list for me. Entrance critiera not too exalted either.

I did say* mid-range and ex-polys.

Hull looks great tbh, that is top of the list for me. Entrance critiera not too exalted either.

Sorry jumped in without reading properly. I stand corrected. It is a great University

Nothing wrong with ex poly's either.
You just have to check the course, post qualification employment rates, drop out rates etc,etc. ie the same things that you need to check for any course.

It can make a difference. I once phoned a uni on behalff of a student. Said student had 10 GCSEs but had to resit English along side her A Levels, meaning she couldn't take 4 subjects for AS. She had only been in the country 2 years so not suprising she got a D in English.

Anyway the uni she wanted to go to wanted something like AABb - the small b being the AS level. I felt she would cope well with the course but even explaining that she was EAL and the college couldn't (?wouldn't) accomodate her they would not budge.

So OP - have a look at the uni courses she is heading for and see what their requirements are.

Also be honest, if dd is heading for A grades at A Level she will easily cope with an AS, if she is heading for 3 D grades she won't cope so well.

If your DD does decide not to take a forth AS she could always consider doing an extended project. See for links. She could chose something History related which would give her lots to talk about in her Personal Statement and at interview. She could chose something that she really finds interesting. I don't know but I think she may be able to do it in her own time over two years. You would have to check. A lot of Uni's seem to really like it.

I personally would.

I teach at a very large 6th form college and last year one of my students actually had her offer from one university revoked (I think it was UCL) because she didn't have a fourth A level. It wasn't part of her UCAS offer, but it was one of their requirements (in the end, we did manage to get her in). Some universities (mostly red brick ones) do require a 4th AS as standard.

And if you're not looking at red brick, then chances are you'll be looking at a points offer - for which the 4th AS would help.

Most students do 4, it is manageable for the overwhelming majority of students. I personally wouldn't want my DD to start off with a personal disadvantage if it can be overcome. Hth

MrsLetch. This point exactly-
If you are going to UCL you need 4 As's and it is perfectly clear from their website that this is the case. However a 4th AS is not a requirement for a lot (probably most) History courses including other Redbrick Uni's For example, History at Sheffield does NOT require or PREFER a forth As and History at Leeds doesn't REQUIRE or PREFER it either
You need to check the actual Uni Course requirements and not rely on generic advice. It's also important to check the current entry requirements as they can change from year to year.

The fact that non Redbridge type Uni's often ask for a UCAS Tariff Point offer is relevant though, so you should bare that in mind.

Leander,

But if the student does not know for definite which university course they want to do - then their best option is to leave their options as wide as possible (isn't that the whole philosophy behind the informed choices booklet?).

We have 3,000+ students a year coming through our institution - with a huge number who think they know at 15 (when they sign up for AS levels) what they want to do for university, and then find out during their A levels that actually they want to study something (or go somewhere) completely different. I've known students who have had their hearts set on going to a particular university for years, get to the open days and then change their minds... If 8 years of lecturing at 6th form has taught me anything, it is to know that even the most steady of student can change their minds at a whim.

Yes, I gave one particular example of one student who struggled last year to get into university through not having a 4th A level. I wish I could say it was the only student... Unfortunately If I did that I would be lying. I have seen several different universities require a 4th AS. Not just UCL - that was merely the example that sprang to mind.

So given that the student had a rough idea as to what they would want to do at Uni, but we were not given any specifics I would still advise they play it safe and keep a 4th AS, If that is feasible. I would particularly advise this, as we have noticed over the past year that offers have been tougher compared to previous years. But hey, I only know what several hundred students feed back to me each year, so what do I know...?

Thanks very much everyone. I have decided that to err on the side of caution dd should at least attempt an additional subject.

I think biology would be best - with history, geog and media she has a lot of workload with essays, I think business studies would add a lot of pressure (plus would be as dull as bricks).

Anyway the school has broken up now (bloody early isn't it?) so will have dd speak to the head of 6th form on results day.

Hull looks like a great university - dd has had a more detailed look and it is definitely at the top of the list.

mrsletch. Sorry, I wasn't trying to dismiss you advice at all and obviously keeping your options open is very important indeed. You obviously have lots of experience in this. which I don't

I was trying to point out there are a lot of misconceptions and generalisations made and that it is worth actually checking with a selection of Uni's directly prior to choosing A levels. The op's DD is, currently, thinking of doing History, which at many Uni's including some Redbrick ones currently does not require a forth AS. Some DC's struggle with the workload at AS and dropping or not taking a unnecessary 4th A level may be advantageous for some students.

Many students have no idea what they want to do, many change their mind, some do far worse than expected and for some they really find their feet and do far better than expected. Doing a forth AS to keep your options open is a Very good plan but if the workload is too much I would say doing three A's well is also a good plan and, at present, a 4th AS is not a requirement for many Uni courses.

Having said all that, I think the OP's DD is doing the right thing in keeping her options open and also because she may be looking at Uni's that use the UCAS point tarrif rather than grade based entry requirements.

I would say, generally, that if doing a fourth AS is too much workload for a student. Then they are not suited to university study.

am NEVER allowed to offer such true advice at work so revelling in the opportunity now

OP of course I don't mean that about your daughter, she sounds (having already started researching Unis) just the sort of sixth former who should be applying.