Domestic Violence from your children - a chance to give the police some feedback?

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I've posted on here before about being on the receiving end of domestic abuse from my son. :( It seems to have stopped now (after I called the police and had him arrested) so I'm not looking for support at the mo... BUT I'd really welcome people's responses this...

I met a senior police officer at a public event last week, who was talking about DV and has some responsibility for police DV policy in a large police force... I plucked up the courage to go up to her afterwards and ask if I could 'phone her to give her some feedback about my experiences...

I am still trying to pluck up the courage to actually call her, but I want to talk to her about a few things:

• The need for better police awareness/training
• The need for alternative accommodation and/or support after a child/young person has been arrested (I was expected to have my son back home immediately, even tho' he had assaulted me)
• The need for support for parents afterwards

I'm thinking... I could also pass on feedback/thoughts/experiences from ^otherY people who have experienced domestic abuse from their own child... Does anyone have any thoughts or stories about what happened to them or what they might have needed from the police, which they'd me pass on?

I know it's a massive taboo: people really, really don't like to talk about their experiences... But if anyone out there is feeling brave, I reckon this could be a real chance to influence the police response to other parents who are unfortunate enough to go though what we've been through.

I'm watching a friend go through hell at the moment, she has a son with MH and severer disability issues, get very little support when she is getting beaten,

they don't and can't handle the late teen, but leave her to deal with it, despite knowing he is really dangerous,

he keeps saying he's going to beat her, then does it, going to smash her, then does it, he keeps making suicide threats, takes large overdoses, ambulance won't take him until police get there, they take him to hospital won't section him, return him to her,

he now keeps threatening to kill her, but because there is no where to take him that deals with mental and physical disability anywhere in the whole region, she lives with it, hugely stressed teen, needing help, and no way of getting it.

so please do get them to address this, please. and thanks for being brave,

Very sorry, talking from no experience at all. But you were brave enough to ask this police officer if you could call her and it sounds as if she said you could. So my initial reaction is that you should call her soon, and say what you've said in your OP and ask her what feedback would be useful.
You could then come back here with more specific questions that people would find it easier to respond to.

i see this from both sides of the coin - i m a police officer and i have a son who has special needs and has, on occasion, been violent and aggressive toward me.

the problem is that the police is seen as the "every" emergancy service.....often we end up picking up the pieces after every one else has washed their hands of someone - including the NHS and mental health.....

we dont have magic wands, we cant conjure up placements to house young people with issues, often social services will not work with us, and very very often the buck stops with us as a service - we are supposed to deal with criminal matters - but we end up dealing with criminal matters, housing, social services, nhs, mental health and everything in between, we seem to be the last port of call when all else fails and we dont have the answers, resources or facilities to house people, sort out their issues, sort out their mental health issues, its very very difficult.

i am currently dealing with social services for my own son, he is 20 with autism, he has hit me, stolen from me and been very verbally abusive toward me at times, yet there are no services that can help - the police could deal with criminal matters, put him before a court for hitting me, and stealing, but wouldnt be able to solve the wider issues because its not really the polices job to do that....

i sympathise because i have been on the receiving end - but i am also a police officer and i understand the limitations of our service.

can I ask you something Vicarinatutu,

what do you think would help the police deal with situations? I understand how hand tied you are,

we spent a whole three days with the police last week, dealing with the issue, they had to come out every hour, they were parked outside friend's son's flat all night, as he phoned in suicide threats to friend, the police would go in and deal with it, off to hospital back again, a lot of man hours, for one guy who needed sectioning,

there is no incentive financially for different service to cooperate with each other,

the police were sympathetic , but there were no option but to keep returning a very disturb man back to a place where he keeps trying to kill someone.

Women abused by their husband's have same issues. My friends husband was arrested and charged by police then let out next day to go home and police didn't even bother to warn her first.

because we as a service only deal with the criminal element nailak - we cannot just keep people in the cells indefinitely! we have to charge and release them, what else are we meant to do with people? we are only allowed to hold a person for so long under PACE, once the investigation is complete we let them go.....im not sure what else people expect us to do?

we can set bail conditions, but police bail is not really worth the paper its written on if a person takes an abusive man back into the house - we cannot dictate how people live their lives after they leave custody. we can deal with their criminal behaviour, gather evidence and put them before court.....the rest takes a multi agency approach and depends on the risk to the partner from them as to how much we can do after that.

last week i dealt with one case where we set bail conditions not to return to the home address - she had him back within an hour of him leaving custody - she was on the phone pleading for him to go home within minute of us releasing him. we set bail - but she helped him break his bail conditions!

the problem lies with peoples expectations of what the police can do, realisitically.

quote - ive no idea. more money, more funding, more services for women who are abused, more education, and the biggie....earlier intervention, earlier diagnosis for kids with SN, none of that will happen - our budgets are being slashed as we speak....we have lost officers and are not getting them replaced, on friday night, we are down to 3 members of staff on our team to police a district. its not safe for us. its not safe for the public, and no one cares, and we just get the blame ultimately, as a service because we are teh last stop.

thanks for the reply,

That was one of the things that got me last weekend, that at least two officers were taken up with this boy all weekend, a lot of man hours,

yet each time he was taken into hospital, no psychiatrist saw him once, despite the fact that he was a danger to himself and others, he also attacked one of his care workers,

there needs to be more joined up thinking and action.

we have the exact same issues all the time quote - currently one particular person is costing about 60,000 every few months in man hours from us, ambulance and nhs staff - exactly the same - we take them up to the hospital, they are assessed, they are realeased, we are called again within hours, we take them up to the hospital, they are assessed, they are released, we get called again within hours.....

we can detain someone under 136, but we have to take them for assessment, we have to stay with them while this is done, often for hours, then its all fruitless because they are assessed and say they are fine, they go home, we get called back within hours because they are once again trying to kill themselves, or someone else, and ambulance are standing off until we get there...
yet we get the blame for some reason. we just keep doing the same dance because no one will take responsibility and the psychiatrist is frightened of human rights legislation, so in the end we end up with someone in the cells who shouldnt really be there, but its the only way to keep them safe....
its ridiculous.

something has to change,

I got very familiar with 136,

my friends is in the NHS, she understands how it works, knows everyone, but cannot get them to keep him in,

she stayed here for days, with updates from him or police as if he had died, or killed someone,

two ambulance crew every hour or two, two police officers at his flat three days , two coming and seeing her,

it's got to be cheeper to have a better mental health access,

I have to say that my experiences with the police (DD running away, suicide attempt and assaulting me ) have been really positive. The have dealt with the situations sensitively and decisively, and are probably the only ones who haven't bullshitted me. The real problem has been with CAMHS who seem to think that the police have nothing better to do than sit waiting to be called out to deal with DD. I have worked in the NHS for over 20 years, quite a bit of it dealing with desperate and angry patients often with MH problems so I am no stranger to the workings of the NHS. But I have been astounded at the sheer lack of professionalism, judgemental attitudes, lack of understanding of teens and general ineffectuality of CAMHS services. Psychiatry seems to be all smoke and mirrors not the rigorous medical discipline you should expect. And the police are left to clear up the mess they have created.
There has to be a multidisciplinary, integrated approach to managing these situations, with proper support for the parents who are often left struggling to cope, their own MH deteriorating. I have always thought of myself as a pretty robust resilient person, but my experiences have brought me to my knees. Being frightened of your own child is an awful place to be.
DV from your own children is different from partner DV. You are responsible for your child's welfare and you feel guilty that your poor parenting has caused the situation in the first place ( others tell you different but it doesn't stop you feeling that way). As a parent you are just expected to cope with whatever is thrown at you by health and social services.
All the police can be expected to provide is a sticking plaster, which is useless unless health services deal with underlying problem. Mental health is a Cinderella service, it is not sexy, it doesn't generate income and is often the victim of funding cuts. So it isn't surprising that it isn't fit for purpose.

Wow. I was expecting to wake up to no response, or maybe one or two comments, so it's great to see a frank debate starting.

I agree, Brightspark - the police have been among the most straightforward and effective agencies I've had to deal with too. The attending officers on the three occasions I had to call 999 were practical and no bullshit, and on the third, when I had to decide whether to actually charge him, they were really great. It was the charging process that I then felt let me down - and one insensitive charge officer. I have already made a specific complaint about that and had a reasonable response and an apology from the Divisional Inspector, but I felt there were real 'policy' issues behind this - not just an individual mistake, but a system problem - which is why I want other people's perspectives.

The police in my area have come a very long way in dealing with DV - I have been involved in small ways over the years with influencing the way they respond to women's complaints, and support for children affected by DV. A woman experiencing DV from her partner would be asked about whether she felt safe to have him home, and would not ever be expected to if she did not... But I was not asked, and was told I needed to 'step up' and 'take some responsibility as a parent' when I said I could not have my son back. Yet he is bigger and stronger than any man I have ever lived with or gone out with.

I agree a multi-agency approach is needed, and most (perhaps all?) areas have multi-agency DV panels these days. I reckoned the police were worth talking to, because in my experience they do things they don't just talk (they are very 'action-focussed' and 'solution-focussed', as the jargon goes)... If they are persuaded there's a problem, they are more likely than other agencies, I believe, not to just sweep it under the carpet.

So keep your thoughts/experiences coming, and I will try to persuade them there's a problem...

in the case referred to she didnt want him home. but it was his house so what could she do?

They dealt with the DV badly and were insensitive with their comments.

More recently she is living in b and b with her 3 kids, and has restraining order out. He found her and came up to her. Her neighbour was with her. Whoever decides these things said not enough evidence to charge him for breaking bail as he told them she called him and asked him to come. That is easily checkable, and she has a witness.

Yes a multi agency approach is needed.