DD aged 13 is spending day at BF's flat with no adults. Help please!

[Cuddleczar]

My daughter, 14 later this month, has had a BF for 4 months. Recently she has been round to meet his mum, and he has come to meet us. He seems nice; he's also just 14, mercifully not older. BUT she is spending every waking minute when she is not at school on her BB messaging him or on Skype, and last few weekends have been spent going out with him (during the day). At least once she has gone back to his flat in the early evening and no adults have been there. His mum is a youngish single parent, probably I am old enough to be her mum, and I don't know her, just a glimpse at parents evening. Today, DD told me she was going round to BF's flat for the day and his mum would be at work, it would be just them. I said she knows that I don't like this...we have had the conversation about what could happen. Her view was 1) I am totally not ready for sex yet, you don't need to even think about that and 2) if you are saying that, you don't trust me and you don't trust him. I tried to explain that it's not like that, I know from personal experience what can go wrong in that situation and that is why I don't want her to find herself in that situation. We had that conversation at breakfast time and then when she was leaving mid-morning, her dad asked her where she was going and it was "OUT!" followed by a speedy exit out of the house. My DH says, "Why didn't I know about this...are you telling me we have completely lost control of her now?"

This is all on a background of many months of her gradually withdrawing from her family--sitting silent at mealtimes and not staying at the table for any longer than she can avoid, not coming out with us, not watching TV with us, not going to bed at a reasonable time (up texting BF), not doing her HW on time (too much texting). There are times when it feels as though she has lost all respect for the rest of her family, although if I get her on her own she does open up to me and I think she is honest with me about where things are at (ie on the BF front). But she has no communication with my DH at all (would love to know how to rescue that, too!).

It has taken us rather by surprise--we have two older DDs, 15 and 17, both working hard for exams, neither of whom have had BFs yet for various reasons, and because they have waited till they are older, they will be more mature when they have to deal with relationship issues.

On the other hand, I have known of several couples during my life who met at the age of about 14 and went on to marry and have children and live happily ever after. So I know it can happen at that age, and she does talk about "Could he be the one?". And, while I know what can go wrong, I also know from experience that parents sometimes worry about things (sex) happening when in fact you know you are not going to do that and it is nowhere near happening.

So the worst thing is I do feel very worried that we shouldn't allow her to routinely be round at BF's flat with no adults present ALL DAY!!!! However much I trust her, it is just plain wrong. My DH also wants to punish her for her rude behaviour this morning, perhaps by removing her phone for a while. Not sure how to handle it...need to get some messages home to her...but don't want to drive her further away...urgent advice please!

"Today, DD told me she was going round to BF's flat for the day and his mum would be at work, it would be just them. I said she knows that I don't like this."

Your 13 year old child "told you" she was going to spend all day with her boyfriend alone, unsupervised and you "said" "I don't like this"?!?

Start parenting her would be my advice. She is a 13 year old child, not an 18 year old.

Well, I am of the view that if they are going to have sex they will and if they aren't, they wont. You have discussed it with her and hopefully she's being honest when she says she isn't ready. I would talk to her again and say (if you haven't) that no matter what you think (that she's too young) that when she decides that she is ready, that you will support her and help her get the right contraception for her, explain that condoms alone are not enough protection but are essential for their health (etc etc).

As for her general behaviour, it sounds well within the 'normal' range (you seem to have been lucky with the older two).

I would say 'tread carefully' - if DH comes down like a ton of bricks you will 'lose' her and it will make things worse. I would calmly explain to her that her behaviour this morning was unacceptable and if it happens again the result will be 'whatever punishment you see fit'.

Good luck.

Ouch, uruculager, my knuckles are hurting from that rapping!

But this is what I meant about it having taken us by surprise. Our older two are really (though I say it myself) perfectly behaved and incredibly sensible and have somehow turned out that way without really any need to pull rank on them or lay down the law. This 13 YO is also very well behaved--biggest sins are a bit too much make up, too much texting and seems to have taken her eye off the ball regarding school work...but her teachers love her. She is also taller than the other two (and me) and I think we forget how young she is. There's also that phenomenon where younger children in the family seem to grow up much faster than the older ones did when they were that age...by the time the 13 YO is 14, you have had two others who have been doing whatever it is for several years and they didn't come to any harm etc etc.

I'd be interested to know, uruculager, what specific parenting activity would you bring into play here?

I would have told her she couldn't go. Explain again that it's not that you don't trust either of them but situations like this can get out of hand. Could the BF come round to your house? Sometimes you just have to say no.

DS1 had a very serious and intense relationship with a girl starting when they were both 13.
He got totally fed up with me doing "the talk" and going on about how things can get out of hand even if you don't plan to have sex. One rule I stuck rigidly to was they weren't allowed in our house or hers without adults present.
I never actively disapproved as she is lovely girl and they both work hard at school but I did think he was missing out by having a serious long term GF so young.
He thought she was The One and they would live happily ever after.
They broke up amicably after two years.

I do know it's not easy to approach the other parent when you don't know them. You'd probably do it like a shot if it were girl friendships. You may find that the boys mum is as concerned as you in spite of her youth?
Agree with mumeee. Invite him to your and make him very welcome, let them have "supervised privacy".

They will probably just play computer games all day , not all teenagers are sex mad.

Your DH needs to back off , or she won't tell you anything in future.

She wants you to trust her, hence telling you they will be there alone.

Phone boys mum and ask if she knows they are using her place when she is out, she may or may not be aware.

If it was a 14 year old going to a female friend's house how would you feel?

She is bound to rebel a bit, with two older perfect specimins.

I agree with Usual.
She's not lying to you about it. She's being open about where she is. She's been prepared to have a conversation about you worries about sex. I wouldn't be pushing her away, but I guess it comes down to how much you 'know' her and feel you can trust her.

tricky one. What you really don't want is her fixing up an alibi with a girlfriend and going anyway (if not now in a few weeks) that would be a really unsafe thing for her to do and she would do it I'm sure if she was determined.

I'd like to think having had the talk, and thought about it that she can go and all will be well.

From the "relationships" I've observed within D1s tight friendship group at that ages they'd be holding hands and watching TV/gaming.

However I also have 2 "practically perfect" biggies and a 12yr old fiesty DD2 who worries me silly that we could be in your shoes in a year or so.

I'd be interested to know, uruculager, what specific parenting activity would you bring into play here?

That is really rude & uncalled for. You have posted on an open forum asking for help. You might not like all the replies, but there is no excuse for being that rude to someone who offered their opinion.

Not meant to be rude at all, sorry if it was taken the wrong way. What I meant was, how do you, in practical terms, respond? What would others do and say? After all, you can't "lock up your daughters"; you can't physically stop them from walking out the door...or, if you do manage to do so by heavy sanctions, then you risk "losing" them as others have pointed out.

Anyway, an update. We told her when she came back from the BF's flat that she was not to go again if no adults were present. There was a bit of a scene and some tears etc, but everyone had made up by bedtime and regained a calm footing. But I know the problem has not gone away. She says she accepts that they should not be on their own there again, because of the risk that things get out of hand. But I understand it is hard on them. She says all they do is kiss and hug but now don't have anywhere they can do that. (Yesterday in the park after school, they were spotted and other kids shouted out, get a room!...and I have told her that it really isn't a good look to be snogging on the street.) Yes, he could come round here but she says, "I wouldn't dream of doing that kind of thing here".

I do remember being in that situation at a similar age, and my mother being similarly worried (unjustifiably so). So what is left? Back row of the cinema? or "Just say no!". (Where have I heard that before?)

Thanks for all the advice above by the way.

She \TOLD you im sorry there is your answer your 14 yr old shouldnt be telling you everything , put your foor down It can be done honestly , and if she goes behind your back punish her ,

anything*

Well... I think at 14 you can expect a little snogging. Maybe all you can do here is keep talking talking talking? She accepts she can't be there alone with him all day (I wonder why she accepts that now when she didn't before?) Ask her what she suggests? Talk it over?

My teens seem to understand that I am trying to keep them safe, not ruin their lives and will often surprise me by suggesting things that I am more than happy to agree to.

You were not being rude op ! How odd

No advice I'm afraid but you sound like a good mum who is trying to keep channels of communication open which I guess is key in these situations .

You didn't sound rude to me either op ,but as the mother of three boys with the youngest much more confident than the older two I also am interested

Well, I think you have a good point Bletchley...maybe the way forward is to take every opportunity for chat/communication and ask her to come up with ways that she thinks she would stay safe. (And I am not saying that I will let her do whatever it is, but just as a method of getting her to think about what the risks are.) I do accept that we made errors by just letting her "tell" us what she was going to do...I am not going to let that happen again. I have also started clamping down on phone use and homework etc...and read something very interesting on another post about someone's DD whose room was a tip...they recommended parenting her as a much younger child and maybe that is what this one needs. She is possibly not totally comfortable with the amount of freedom that she has. And would feel better with firmer boundaries.

I feel much better now from hearing everyone's views. Really appreciate all the support.

Sorry!! :(

'I read it as what parenting activity brings you* into play here' ie if you aren't a parent of a teenager then, really... your opinion counts for nothing...

Sorry! Just had the usual bs on the step parenting board about how hard done by someone is because all the evil non step mums were against her (so not true) and a difficult day previous to that justifying justifying justifying... and I think my brain was a bit stuck there!!

Sorry again!

I must be an idiot.

If you dont want your 13 yo alone all day with her bf,don't let her go

If she is not doing homework because she is texting bf, tell her to turn off the phone whilst studying.

Same with not enough sleep, leave the phone downstairs when you go to bed.

Dont let her use Skype/bbm until homework done etc.

I have a 14 yo dd with a bf of 5 months.

I have had to do all these things.
She still talks to me about her relationship openly and honestly
And I know she is safe, homework is done and she is in bed sleeping not on bbm.

She doesn't tell me where she is going, she asks and I say yes or no, not I'm not entirely happy-and she goes anyway.

You are the parent, correct?
Therefore you make the rules.

You are her parent, not the other way around. Just say to her "no, X, you're not going to your BF's house. You can come & spend the day here if you want" if she still refuses then you know she will be doing something. If they spend the day at yours, you can keep an eye on them, but give them privacy!

In retrospect my first post was pretty abrupt. Sorry to dump and run! I agree with FarSide and funnymummy who I think have expressed the sentiment in more detail.

I disagree with usualsuspect and others who discount the possibility of sex. A certain proportion of 13 year olds will have sex - WHO puts the figure at 1 in 10 having full on intercourse with more doing "other stuff - and certainly many 14 year olds do.

I can't get my head around this view that at 13 she deserves to be treated like an adult, or should be withdrawing from the family in quite this way. She is still a child, regardless of whether or not she is taller than your 17 year old daughter.

You're not doing her any favours by letting her first relationship become this intense. You say you've talked to her about sex, but how much have you talked to her about relationships? Try to communicate to her the importance of managing her existing relationships when she enters a romantic one. It sounds like she lacks the social skills to balance her schoolwork with her family, her existing friends (if she spends every waking minute talking to him) and her boyfriend. She needs to learn that you can't just dump your family, friends and school work every time you get a new boyfriend.

I know the trendy opinion is that you can "lose" children by being too strict. You can very easily lose children by never having any rules, or failing to protect them.

Have you ever read her BBMs?

Also, you might like to invite him around for dinner to sus him out. It probably wouldn't hurt to try and talk to his mother about the relationship. She might not be thrilled that they've been together unattended, especially if she's such a young mother.

Good point, I allow my daughter and son, 13&14 to have bbm but they know they better be prepared for me to read it.

The phone goes off during homework, and dinner and doesn't go upstairs during the week.

I think op you may be a little unaware of what teenage boys are like if you honestly don't think, left in a house alone, that there would not be a strong possibility of one of them looking to take it further than kissing.

I don't think you will lose her by being strict, its your job to protect her and IMHO that included saying no to her going somewhere you are unhappy with.

My dd would never be allowed unsupervised all day with her bf.

Teenagers are in a real rush to grow up, I have said to mine on many occasions that they don't realise they lack the emotional maturity to deal with adult situations, they might look, and feel all grown up but tend to lack good judgement as this age and get caught up in the moment.

My dd talks to me very openly and honestly, and I like to think that when she is able to discuss most things with me, and still understand when I say no, I mean no and there's a reason for it.

It would be a shame if your dd ended up doing poorly at school or pregnant or with an STI, IMHO it's down to parents to do everything possible to prevent this.

Don't worry, ChippingIn, I saw what time your post had been made and worked out it must have been at the end of a long, hard day. And it is so easy to misread/misinterpret a post when there is no tone of voice or facial expression to help. I hope you are having a better day today.

I agree with a lot of what's been put up since my previous post yesterday. I think there is a risk of serious sexual activity and, consequently, a risk of serious harm...if not right now then still at a stage when it is still too early for all that stuff. All three of our girls have had repeated in-depth conversations about not having sex until they are mature enough etc to handle the responsibilities that can come with that, whether it is seeking contraception, having to deal with an unwanted pregnancy, needing treatment for an STD or having a baby. They all know that no contraceptive method is 100% and I believe they are all aware that having unprotected sex could land them with an STI that, at worst, could shorten their lives. I have told them I expect them to wait until at least 17 or so before having sex...might sound late to some but there is a lot of research that shows that people who lose their virginity earlier than that end up regretting it. So, yes, she has had plenty of talks about relationships...including the possibility that with some outcomes (such as pregnancy leading to a baby) you could end up with a long-term attachment to a partner or partner's family which you might later feel was unfortunate, to say the least.

I think you have a very good point, uruculager, about other relationships, including with her family. Her social skills have indeed been weak over the past few yearsshe has always found friendships difficult except on a 1 to 1 basis. I think I should work on that with her. I also agree with the bits about rules, FarSide and Fanjo, I think it is time for some more. I think we had taken our eye off the ball with DD3 because it has been such plain sailing with the other two, but now need to firm things upas I said earlier, I think the idea of parenting her as a younger child is a good one.

About BBMs, my DD1 (a highly responsible girl) has I know looked at some of DD3's messages and I know would have told me if there was anything to worry about. But I probably need to get to grips with that myself.

Finally, he has been round to dinner and was perfectly behaved and he seems a very nice boy. (Though, as said above, I am sure he is not above taking things as far as he possibly can!)

I would call his mum if I could but I don't have her number. I will either have to pounce on her at a parents evening, or go and hang around outside where she works!