'Queen Bees and Wannabes' - is it really like this?

[MeanMom]

Have just read most of this book as my DD is not in school at the moment, partly because she doesn't feel she 'fits in' with the other girls. A teacher told me DD 'expects too much from her friends' - so was hoping the book would help me help her (IYSWIM)

Subtitle is 'Helping your daughter survive cliques, gossip, boyfriends, and the new realities of girl world' - but it's not about learning to not want to be in one of the stupid cliques and just be yourself, it's about what you do if you are in a clique and someone who is supposed to be your friend is 'mean' - what you say and who you go to (parents then teacher) when they won't stop when you ask them to. (not much use if school then say 'you expect too much from your friends' - back to square one:( )

Is this really what it's like in the UK? Do you have to be in a clique and change yourself to fit in to your allocated place within it? (eg Queen Bee, sidekick, messenger,target)?
And what do you do if you have a DD who is outside of the clique desperately trying to get in but never ever will (Aparently you can't be in a clique if you have disabilities - which, though minor DD does have).I read this book hoping it would tell her how to be herself and not worry about what the other 'girls' think - but it seems unless you fit you are doomed to be friendless?
Are high schools really all that horrible in UK now? What can we do about it?

No, of course all girls aren't like that, but there does tend to be a gang of girls who are like this in most schools. The trick is avoiding them and finding the girls who are happy to be themselves.

In Year 8, at the school I work in, there is a group of 7 or 8, with 4 or 5 on the periphery - the remaining 35+ year 8 girls are perfectly "normal", though they do have to put up with a fair amount of stick from this "in-crowd". (for handing in homework, not having a boyfriend, not wearing the right labels and all that crap).

From what my DD says, in her year of 300 pupils (boys and girls) the girls do tend to form lots of different groups. There are definitely the "popular" people, and the gradations down. When her particular friends were mean, she found she had other friends to hang out with, which has made her stronger. Even though she has "made up" with the original group, she still hangs out with another group, and has yet another that she can hangout with.
That book is fairly accurate, and was far more accurate of her experience in primary, where there was a distinct queen bee. We could spot a lot of the other characters too. I also knew them when I was at school, and even now you can spot them in the playground Mums.

However the teacher at you DDs school sounds as if she was/is a queen bee herself, or just hasn't got over her own school days, so lacks empathy. Is there anyone else you can deal with to help your DD? Or a different school which is more pro-active towards social problems? Because it isn't that there is nothing that can be done to help.

Finally it does tend to get better, at least in mixed schools by about year 10 ish.

My dd is yr 10 and was always on the outside. She has mild issues which stopped her joining in certain activities.
Now in yr 10 she has a lovely group of friends who are not in each other's pockets, which I like. I have no idea who some of them are as it is not cool to bring friends home for tea. But she enjoys meeting up with them for cinema/shopping.
What has helped is oing to anmusical theatre group at the weekend, where she has met great teenagers.....some of them from her school who she previously didn't know very well.

Queen bees are everywhere..not just the UK.

It's an American book and I think their schools are much worse for this kind of thing.

I've been wondering whether the effect of Americanisation is starting to be felt? There seem to be so many programmes about American school life, all with the cliques, the jocks, the cheerleaders, the rich girls, etc. It's nothing like memories of my own school days. Yes, we all hung out in various groups which didn't intermingle much, but there was no bitchiness between the groups, we just understood that we were separate but not rivals.

The group I used to mix with in school was a mixture of types, some academic, some sporty, some rich, some poor. Looking back I can see we were probably the 'in crowd' but we didn't set out to be that way, it just happened naturally.

I haven't read the book, but I think it's worthwhile encouraging your daughter to be her own person, to start looking at the long game rather than just to next week (difficult I know!).

At DDs school there is a small minority who form a clique with Queen Bees and Wannabes, but they're highly visible because they flaunt the latest mobiles/hairstyles/shoes/ limousine parties/ manicures/ as little school uniform as possible. The majority are in one or more fluid groups - the netball team, the school orchestra, girls who are neighbours out of school, the drama club etc. The majority manage healthy friendships, but the "in crowd" are less healthy because money, possessions, physical appearance and status are all important. I think it's hardest for the Wannabes whose parents simply can't afford to give them the Queen Bee lifestyle.

At the end of the day, those outwith the "in-crowd" seem to be the happiest.

Fotunately the cleverer girls realise it's better to think for themselves, and establish solidarity with others who do the same. They become interesting individuals who have minds of their own.

But the "follow a (demented) leader" mentality is very common indeed. If you go onto AIBU and Chat here you will see it in all its glory.

themarriageplot - you would think the 'cleverer' ones would work it out, yes.

Unforunately they are all clever (allegedly) at DDs school - it is selective grammar all girls (what have I done!).

So - if all girls aren't like this but my intelligent daughter wants to be in the 'in crowd' but will never be because she's too weirdmature- how do I help her to not mind this? All she does is worry about the right hair, clothes, shoes, bag, size boobs. This is not how I am, I don't want DD to be like this(and nor does she really)

I thought the book would help - any clever MNer know any thing that will, please?

But the book does give strategies, doesn't it?

The answer is, broadly speaking: be yourself; be proud to be yourself; feel sorry for anyone who is too silly to be themselves - ie Queen Bees and all their Wannabes.

Be political. Understand the important things in life.

(Hint: not make-up.)

I would also help her to "do" fashion in her own style. Give her money to do so.

DD is in year 9, and is not even one of the Wannabes. Unfortunately she seems to be alone in this, and there have been several very upsetting times when one of her "friends" has got in with the In girls, and have left her for dead. She is fiercely loyal to friends, and being treated like this has been very hurtful.

I am really proud of her for her loyalty and maturity in seeing through these shallow little madams.

In the end she seems to have found her own way with a small group of uncomplicated and uncool, and very nice girls. Frankly I'm glad she's not obsessing about her hair, make-up, and which handbag she carries her school books in. Yearning to be cool can lead to some very undesirable behaviour.

Agreed, OneHand. Much safer all round if a girl decides her own path.

worldgonecrazy is on to something here, I think. The Americanisation of British schools is a big part of this, Gossip Girl in particular has had a huge impact.

I don't know Gossip Girl, but the film Mean Girls is a good antidote, if rather vomit-inducingly American. It unpicks how queen bees and their wannabes operate, and how a relatively decent girl can nonetheless get sucked in.

My point exactly - can anyone help my 'relatively decent girl' to not be sucked in?
Please?

I'm not sure I can help - have you looked at the strategies in the back of the book? Could you get her to watch Mean Girls? There WILL be other girls who are outsiders, or who are favoured and dropped at the queen's whim. Can you invite them round? Can you speak to the teachers about it?

We have been told that Yr 9 is particularly bad for this, and that when they get into Yr 10 they have to knuckle down to GCSEs and get serious about academic work. But it may be that the queen is, in fact, a bully and the school needs to do something about it.

Schools do know that picking on a child with disabilities is wrong. Probably the other girls on the outer edges are similarly "different". The school must have a bullying policy - look it up and get the school to act on it.

If this is going on, they can do whole school teaching on diversity - but they must mean it.

teens want to fit in - I got the impression from somewhere it is because this is their generation and they are growing up with this generation and will become mature with this same generation and so they are learning how they need learn what to do, even the loners will at some point need to fit in somewhere. Adults can make rules but they can't manipulate the group in the same way as prison warders make rules but still the prisoners make their own structure of hierarchy amongst themselves that the wards can't change until one leaves.

Self confidence and making friends outside of school with will help as it makes school become smaller and therefore the issues at school smaller. As we all know school is a distant memory after about a month of leaving, so making school a smaller part of the teens social life will help.

Clubs, drama and sport all help with all confidence and making friends else where

I hate to say but reading that book made sense of a lot of things I observed in my mixed comp back in e dark ages. Also there may be a popular group, but similar rules also run other groups, although as even the book notes if the "Queen Bee" is nice then it is much less unpleasant.
As always with girl bullying, it tend to be so subtle that it is hard for adults to really know what is going on.

I wouldi really really recommend outside interests. Guides and then Drama helped me through senior school. Guides, choir and youth group is doing the same for my DD.

Thank you.