What would you do ?

[Standards]

Hello everyone...
I've just this moment joined Mumsnet to garner some opinions which will be gratefully gathered and embraced. Thank you in advance, I hope...
My husband and I have a 15 year old son, a single child. He is bright, articulate and funny. He has been badly bullied throughout his entire school life and has few friends. He has, over the past year, carried out some inappropriate behaviour at school, acting on his own. Each time, he has denied responsibility but each time, there is overwhelming evidence that he has done such things. We know and the school knows. He is fortunate to still be there.
The last occurrence, late last year, shocked me and I didn't know how to relate to him. I met a counsellor, on his behalf, who advised that my son needed therapy. This echoes what I, and others, felt. My son has decided he hates me, is rude and disrespectful to me ('I wish you'd die.' 'I hate you.' 'You're psychotic.' etc.) and has changed from a delightful chap into a sullen, obstructive, sarcastic young man.
My husband has been unsupportive of me and has treated our son like a little emperor. He attributes his behaviour to 'low self-esteem' which is probably accurate. But the way to raise anyone's self-esteem is not to praise them for every single thing they do, in my book. His father doesn't discipline him, allowing him to be as rude as he chooses to be, to me. Consequently, the two of them have become as thick as thieves, affectionate with each other, laughing at each other's jokes and marginalising me. Before all this occurred, my son and I were extremely close so I am feeling the loss very keenly.
My question is: with a husband who doesn't support my firmer standards of responsible parenting and a marriage that is, now, on its knees, what would you be doing in the circumstances, re the disrespectful and unacceptable attitude my son is displaying towards me, in the knowledge that he won't engage in conversation with me?
Apologies for the length of this - there is much more between the lines but this is the outline.
Many, many thanks.

Sorry to hear you are going through this Standards its difficult enough dealing with teenagers without having a partner who undermines you.

I think you have to try and take the long view with difficult teenagers - it might be easier now to let them have their own way but in the long run to grow up as decent human beings they need to learn to treat people with respect and that bad behaviour has consequences. Your DH is behaving like a 15 year old himself instead of being an adult.

Is there any possibility of family therapy?

Thanks so much for responding webwiz. It's really appreciated.
The idea of Family Therapy is one which appeals to me. With both husband and son in denial, though, there is no chance of either of them attending. My son considers himself innocent of all things and my husband sees no need for that sort of thing. Their arrogance is breathtaking. In fact, when I returned from the therapist I had checked out and related verbatim what had been said to me, my husband's response was 'What else did you feed him with? What other words did you put into his mouth, then...?'
I'm afraid that's a no go. Lovely idea and just what I would like to take place. And yes, my husbnad is trying to be his son's best friend. To me, that's not what's needed. Parenting is needed from both of us.

Is there another male member of the family or close friend who could have a word with him and at least make him see his treatment of you isn't acceptable? You may find counselling/ therapy for yourself useful in dealing with the situation and helping to keep your sanity. You don't say what his behaviour is but it sounds more than usual teenage acting out.
Tell him his behaviour is unacceptable and then walk away.
Am going through hell with 15 yo DD, it's bad enough even when DH and back/ prop each other up so I really feel for you.

I really don't wish to be negative Brightspark1 and thank you for your post. As I type, I have just asked my son to stay outside, having been extremely offensive to me as I drove him home from school, and he is shouting 'Open the fucking door, you bitch!' to me.
What to do? I left him out there to cool his heels while I kept my calm and held my stance.

He had said he never wishes to speak to me again, smart-arsed every single gentle thing I said to him in the car about his behaviour. As he has said he doesn't need or want my love, I have withdrawn my 'services' from him. Tomorrow he can walk or catch the bus to school. Hardly a hardship, is it?! How long do I leave him outside the front door? I'm actually a little frightened.

Making him walk to school and home is absolutely the right thing to do, don't get into an argument, just reiterate that he is being offensive. When you let him in, you probably already have, if he is physically abusive, phone the police. It is really hard to do,but I have had to do it when my daughter has attacked me, it was awful, but we were told that was the only option. Being scared of your own child is a horrible situation- try to tell your husband and makeitclear that you will not put up with this. You are a loving mum not a doormat or verbal punchbag

Thank you thank you Brightspark. He is still outside even tho' I have unlocked the door. He doesn't yet know. My brother is calling round in about 20 minutes to see if he can mediate. My husband will side with our son when he hears.

Please post to let us know how things go and you are OK. Hopefully your brother can talk some sense to him

I sincerely hope so. Thank you for your support. It is so sorely needed. I fear, however, that my son has shut me out and it may take years. I've seen him do the same with people of his own age and never dreamt he could/would do this to his own mother. It is incomprehensible and I worry about his state of mind. Thank you very much.

Would your husband listen to anyone in his own family? If they sat him down and pointed out that his parenting has resulted in an unpleasant abusive child? Or would he just ignore regardless? You are in a horrible situation:(

My DS1 was truly awful for a few years..so know how it feels, and it was worse with DH and so we had to parent separately, but in our case it meant DH butting out and leaving me to deal..(he supported me on this)

I wonder if, as he isn't respecting you, and neither is your DH.. you might indeed withdraw. Totally. Your husband is so totally undermining you that his behaviour is as disrespectful ad your sons..and he is supposed to be the adult.

Withdraw all services from your son.. lifts, money, support. If they are jointly rude to you in the home..withdraw whatever you do there.. do you cook for two unappreciative arses? If so, stop. I have done this with my son and it was surprisingly effective.. if he was going to be rude to me, then why should I cook him food (that he often failed to come home for) or wash his stuff, of ferry him around. I told him that I was not prepared to do things for someone who was behaving like a toddler and stopped. He thought I was joking until he ran out of underwear...

Hate to say it but I would also seriously be considering my relationship with my husband if he was belittling me in order to be my child's best mate.:(

What sort of involvement have school had? Has it just been in a disciplinary way or is there any support available?

I hope your brother is helpful. Keep reminding yourself that you are doing the right thing and when your DS looks back he won't have any respect for the way your DH has behaved even if it might seem like great fun now.

Dear people...
I thank you for your messages of support and thoughts. Well, my brother ended up picking my son up: he'd disappeared and was found two miles away down a country road. Fog and dark. He'd texted his father who rang me to find out what had happened (a ticking off for me, from him, as expected. 'Can't I leave you both for more than four hours without this sort of thing happening?' - yes, I know....) and told his father where he was. Now up in his room. Not a word has passed between us.

I feel it's all an elaborate game, somehow. Yet the stakes are too high for me to dismiss as such. My brother's advice (he has two older sons) is for me to step back and disengage with my son. Show scant interest, make little or no conversation then my son has nothing to rail against. Of course, this will cement him even further with his father, which is the downside.

But you are right, Webwiz and Medusa: if only my husband would put his foot down, support me in decent, firm and fair parenting and then we could show a united front. It could be so different. And yes, I am seriously considering my marriage and what it's all about. I have left twice, recently, as the situation has been intolerable.

I feel reduced, as though I have no parental voice at all. They have both taken it from me. What sort of parent would I be if I couldn't discipline my child/teen when necessary and what sort of person will my boy become as a result of all this? He was the dearest, most sensitive, charming, funniest little boy. I would never have believed he could transform into this snake in a corner. My husband has many issues, mainly to do with his own background, that he has never properly addressed. Absent father, emotionally distant mother. All adds up, doesn't it? No wonder he's scared of alienating his own son. Will he accept that? No - complete, hostile and aggressive denial, naturally.

Standards How are things now? Please keep posting. It might help you to keep talking and there's always good listeners here.

I have no advice standards, just wanted to send my support. I'm new here and joined because my 16yo DS has become unrecognisable to me. I'm sorry your DH is adding to everything. Please do keep posting.

I am sorry for your situation Standards. I do think that the real problem is your DH. Your DH undermines you at every turn and allows your DS to behave dreadfully. This doesnt mean that your DS is a dreadful person just that who wouldnt act out if essentially given approval for it?

Rather than finding someone to speak to your DS, is there someone who could speak to your DH?