Treating Arthritis in elderly piggy - any successes?

[occasionalposter]

One of our piggies has developed arthritis in her hips (apparently). She finds it difficult to move about easily but is still cheerful and eating well. Both piggies will be 7 in June.
Our vet suggested we could try Metacam (? sp) if she can't move around to get to her food, but warned that she isn't sure it will work and it might have unwanted side effects on liver and kidneys.
Has anyone any experience of this problem and/or any advice?

I just googled Metacam side effects in GPs - there's alot about cats and dogs .

One page about rats is very anti ( And I know rats ain't guineas and guineas ain't rats)

Side effects are liver and kidney problems- so UTIs, peeing problems, metabolism impaired if the liver isn't functioning.

And one page warned to only use for 3 days.

It's a can of worms!

What about homeopathic treatment for your GP? (I used Omega Oil and Evening Primrose Oil for my moggies eczema when prednisilone didn't help.It was out of desperation).

If one of my guineas was 7 (and I've had an elderly pig years ago, IIRC 8yo) I'd have to really sit and weigh up the pros & cons

Quality of life she's got now?Is she in pain?Is she enjoying life?

Will the medication help her enough to over-ride the side effects? Don't forget getting the medication into the GP!

Anything else (like low dose painkillers or herbal) to ease her pain?

Or let nature take it's course and when it's time, say goodbye.
I'm assuming you've got 2 old(ish) pigs here, what happens to pig 2 after pig 1?

No experience, no real advice.
Google and read all you can Forewarned is fore armed.
Is your vet a cavy savvy or mainly cat'n'dog?
Have you contacted Cambridge Cavy?
Or Google Peter Gurney. I read some of his pages, he uses alot of different things to treat GP ailments.

When did guinea-pigs get so complicated?

Good Luck.

Thanks 70, it is difficult becuase we love her very much, but she is old and she will have to go sometime. At the moment she is still eating and seems quite happy: she doesn't squeak in pain when she moves around and she is moving around the run and will come over for titbits. I suppose we just want her to be comfortable; as you say medicating her isn't easy and if it isn't going to help it won't be worth putting her through it!
I will look into homeopathic - I have tried reading up but it is tricky. I did wonder about other painkillers, apparently Metacam is a non-steroidal anti-inflammatory so there ought to be others, but nothing is licensed for use in GPs
Our vet seems sensible and experienced though I don't know that she is GP expert.
I am worried about what will happen to piggy no. 2 - she seems healthier, although she has a cataract in one eye which might be the result of diabetes...... she will be lonely if she is left by herself, but I can't see how we can get another GP to keep her company! After all, she is 7 too and we can't really have a never ending procession of GPs each acquired to keep the last one company......

7 is a really good age for a GP, I reckon anything over 5 is a bonus.
But the side effects (or possible side effects) -kidney and liver complications would need treatment to ease the symptoms. If they can't pee or find it painful to pee, how would you know? You can't watch them all the time!

I do sometimes wonder with vets who they are doing it for. I know there are advances in animal medicine, and you feel like you want to try your best. But it's a question of weighing up.
(When my cat got to 17 yo, she was losing weight over the space of a year, eating aa bit, still out and about, but it was like everything got too much .And she had hyperthyroidism which can cause blindness and heart attack according to vet. Her kidneys were starting to fail as well, age related. Vet did offer medication, but I thought "Who's it for? Not for her .More for my benefit".
But they don't want you going back in 2 months and storming "My cat/guinea-pig/rabbit could've lived another year if you offered her XYZ"

We had an old lady piggie (the last of 4 females) who was IIRC 6 yo.We wouldn't have tried matching her up TBH, she lived with her daughter and we had another mum/daughter pair.
When she was on her own, it was for another 6-9 months. She was a free-range indoor GP, and would walk into the kitchen to be lifted into the garden. The only 'problem' she had was her teeth grew long because she didn't chew the bars for attention. Less competition so she didn't have to make the effort
So unless you were prepared to keep them side by side if they didn't 'gel', and then you have the single guinea problem again. (Unless you got an old lay or old neutered boar for them to be "Bah Humbug" together,albeit in seperate pens if they needed.

I'd probably see how your GP went, hopefully in the nice weather she can get out in the sun to excercise and warm her bones.
Watch her weight as well, not easy if they like their food though

More research going on into cat/dog/rabbit meds and not Guinea-Pigs.

I find it difficult finding stuff online, alot of it is American, so some stuff not available over here.

And some meds not transferable across species. (what works for rats might not work for GPs)
GPs are quite different from other small pets (rabbits aren't classed as rodents, I read on SFA site)
Rats,mice,rabbits, ?hamsters all have shortish pg and small,nekkid,closed eye babies.
GPs cook them for 9-10 weeks and they are ready to rumble.
GPs are the superior race!

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Cider vinegar works for arthritus in horses (but they are a bit easier to get food into).

You could post on Guinea-Pig Forum or Rodents with Attitude if it's safe for GPs and would it be effective.
Or those Nelsons Homeopathic - Arnica is a painkiller.
Don't think they'd like Cod Liver Oil. With their vegetarian principles an'all!

Agree with 70 be very careful. Be careful as there are not many GP savy vets. There is one called Pets and Vets in Hertfordshire that has a GP savy vet and a rodentologist that you can talk to/see. Alternatively, speak to a GP rescue or Chrissie at Gorgeous Guineas - they may be able to suggest something. There is also a brilliant site here..post on the forum

www.guinealynx.info/forums/viewforum.php?f=2&sid=e440f3f4a64e6a5e44174d1fb1f9725c

Second joining Cambridge Cavy Trust - they are great. I will not do anything without talking to Vedra. Also, Peter Guerney website is good and I could be wrong but I thought you he mentioned that you could give GPs pain killers.

Thanks, there is some interesting stuff on that forum Silver - particularly about herbal remedies that I might try. I will look up Peter Guerney as well.

Piggy has been moving about more today than recently but this may be becuase I have been keeping her warmer.

I've not had experience of it myself, but what about offering her white willow branches occasionally? Willow is safe for GPs and contains low doses of salicylic acid, which is a pain reliever and anti-inflammatory. Dandelions (both leaves and flowers, iirc) and chamomile are also pain-relieving and anti-inflammatories and also safe for GPs. Nettles may also help.

Obviously these may not work for your GP, but surely anything that doesn't have the side-effects of Metacam but still gives her a better quality of life is worth a shot!

Just bear in mind the Ca:P ratio as anything with a lot of calcium should only be offered occasionally to prevent bladder stones. Also, dandelions are a diuretic so shouldn't be fed in large quantities.

Ooh, more good ideas! Thanks. According to Peter Gurney I can give her Potters Tabritis herbal tablets which I will try to get tomorrow.

Interesting that dandelions are pain relieving and anti-inflammatory, (I knew they were diuretic) by coincidence I have given her quite a few dandelions yesterday and today, and as I mentioned she has been quite active today!!!

There is a willow tree just over the fence so I may 'borrow' a few twigs...

We give our dog Potter's Tabritis if he gets a bit limpy on the recommendation of his breeder and it has always worked a treat, so hopefully it will work for your girl :)

DoesitwearingWellies how the Dickens are you. Haven't seen you post for aaaaaages.

Does Willow (like willow twigs) include Weeping Willow?

My neighbour has one that practically covers the bottom half of my garden with it's branches. Of course there's loads of leaves, so I haven't put their run there.
And if I hold GP2 in the garden he nearly morphs into a giraffe trying to reach the branches.
Does he know something?

Have you still got the 5 boys?

I'm very well, thanks 70isa. Kind of drifted away from MN for a while and have now floated back. How are you? Your boys?

I'd imagine weeping willow would be fine as it is still in the Salix family, just as you can give crab apple branches which are part of the Malus family (like the domestic apple). I often think that GPs know when they shouldn't eat something and generally try to avoid eating it, so perhaps GP2 is trying to tell you something!

Unfortunately we just have the 4 boys now :( One of the original pair (the sheltie) died late in January. He'd lost weight and hadn't eaten, had a drink or passed poohs the night before so off to the vets he went first thing. Vet said they could feel a mass in his abdomen. An x-ray and US scan showed no blockages or masses, but v. enlarged kidneys and a lot of free fluid. He died at the vets due to the stress of it all :(

DD said she wished she'd just asked for him to be PTS after the consult as she felt awful putting him through the tests when he was so weak, but I think you just get caught up in the whirlwind of it all and the battery of medical jargon. He just went downhill so quickly as he'd been quite happily munching away at the brussells tops, kale and carrots DD had bought them 2 nights previous :(

Poor boy was he the one with the broken leg?
I know you have one that was seperated from your 2+3 groups to heal.

Shame for your DD going through it with him, but yes you try what you can, and the vets now offer so much more with regard to diagnosis.
Unfortunately there's not alot they can do surgeywise for GPs given their size and possibly his age.

But she was able to find out what was ailing him, and wasn't left asking "What was wrong? And what if?"

The boys are good thank you. I'm steeling myself to go out (Thunder and Lightning ) they are in their hoghouse.(Warm and dry) and DD wants her GP1.I'm trying to conince DS to give GP2 to me

They don't conduct electricity ,do they?

No, he wasn't the one with the broken leg...that one is still on his own unfortunately as he winds up one of the other 3 (both were in the group of 3 IYSWIM?), but he's fully healed and very spoilt as he's on his own. They both get on fine outside together in the run, they just can't live together!

The three that are living together seem to be getting on fine despite one of their group missing. TBH, I don't think they even noticed he was gone :( I think DD was also shocked that he was only 19 months old, even though it has felt like she's had them forever!

We've just had the T&L here (barely though, just one flash of lightning and a clap of thunder!) and a v. quick downpour. Luckily DD got the pigs in just before it started. Unless they are carrying umbrellas, I don't think they are any more conductive than we are