Changing your viewpoint on 'good'

[ISaySteadyOn]

I have realised recently that I hate clothes shopping because I equate looking good with looking slim. And I can't look in a mirror because I don't look slim.

I never have been, am not, and never will be slim. It's just not my body type. So how do I change my viewpoint and where would you start?

I don't want to end up in tears when I have to buy new clothes anymore. Or when I shop for someone else and see clothes I think are pretty and decide that I couldn't possibly wear them. I guess I am asking if I am alone in feeling this.

I agree it's engrained in Western cultures, and therefore quite hard to escape on a discussion board such as this. I think threads about 'looking expensive' are a case in point.

As for breaking free of that mindset, I certainly haven't managed it entirely but I think the first step is just to learn to recognise it when it happens.

I think it thankfully is one of the things that is changing with each generation. Would my 20 year old like to be a size 10? Yes. Does the fact that she's not put her off wearing exactly what she wants? No. She will quite happily wear oversized, tight, short, long, covered up or revealing. She's happy to go out with no bra on under a top, if that's what she fancies at the time. I find it really, really hard not to say go put one one though (I fail sometimes).

You can add young to that as well OP

having spent this morning catching sight of an old woman in shop windows as I walk past, I dont know who she is but she follows me everywhere.

I don't think all the "that would only look good on a tall, thin, young model" comments on this board help. It's a very restrictive mind set.

That phrase appears with such regularity on S&B that I sometimes wonder if it isn’t a single, spiteful poster - or maybe a cabal of spiteful people - who intend to make every woman here believe she should forget about looking good and just dig a hole in the ground and lie in it once she’s past 25.

It’s honestly not an attitude I’ve met anywhere else on Earth in 60 years …

I found that looking back over historical and worldwide fashions really helped to shift my mindset.

So for example at one point in history, bigger and yes fatter would have signified wealth and was 'good'. Bustles and ruffs and fat ankles and droopy boobs and oh all sorts of different shapes have been or are currently seen as fashionable or desirable somewhere in the world at some point in time.

You just need to work out what your own personal ' looking good' is and have the confidence to wear it :)

I was really helped by googling 'size 16 trends'. If I looked at 'curvy trends' I saw size 8 models with curvy hips. Not what I needed to see. When I started looking on pinterest and google for people my size and saw they were rocking their outfits it gave me confidence to go out and try those things on with that image in my mind. It's hard if you see something you like on a body, and that body is nothing like yours, so it obviously doesn't look like that on you. But the internet is vast and powerful, you can use it to shift your expectations and perceptions.

Ah, for the 17th and 18th centuries. I bet I could look pretty cool in a dress with stays. In my younger days, I had a properly fitted corset and it was amazing. More supportive than any bra I had ever had.

OK, you are all a nice, friendly bunch so I have another question for you. Do any of you ever have a vague feeling of feminist guilt for wanting to look pretty? That's one of my other worries. I worry that wanting to look good is somehow setting a bad example for my DDs and contributing to the objectification of women (hands up who has guessed I am an overthinker. Everyone? Well done!)

No, I don't feel unfeminist.
Sometimes I feel guilty about other aspects of shopping and dressing, but not that- more about my unhealthy personal shopping habit to get a dopamine hit. I see it as a feminist act to want to look a way that I feel happy and good about myself.

No I don't feel like less of a feminist and indeed for me looking good doesn't always mean looking feminine. But when it does, no I just enjoy looking pretty when I want to.

But having said that, it holds no real importance in my life, it's just something that I like to put some effort into sometimes and not others. It doesn't change who I am, and if it affects how others see me well that's on them not me.

I think there are times when I do something because I feel it's expected of me, like shaving my legs. It feels wrong not to do it and I feel like people will judge me if they notice so I do it, it feels conformist and yes part of that does feel anti feminist. I remember hearing on the radio that some woman tried to tell her teenage daughter she couldn't go to school in a skirt and no tights without shaving first and the girl replied 'mum you've been brainwashed by the patriarchy'. Wish I had that spirit!!

But at the same time there have been occasions where I haven't bothered to make myself up, or dress particularly nicely or shave and I've bumped into someone and the whole interaction is ruined by my feeling self conscious. So I also do it for me, to avoid that feeling. Which I suppose I only feel because I've been moulded that way over years.

It's hard to unpick really!!

@HarrietJonesFlydaleNorth username of the day! <3

That skirt makes me wonder whether you might like clothes from One Hundred Stars.

I follow a couple of people on Instagram that post videos of outfits i like, who are more my size.
I always think they look great in that, so I can too.

I remember reading a piece by somebody (can't remember who - possibly a fashion blogger) where she talked about how liberating it was when she realised that she was ALLOWED to wear clothes that didn't minimise her size or make her look like she was a particular shape.

She loved clothes, and it opened up a whole new way of dressing for her, where she could pick an outfit based on "those are great clothes which would make a brilliant outfit," rather than "oh but I can't wear that belt because it highlights my thick waist." So she wore the outfit including the belt (or whatever) and it was indeed a fabulous outfit. And now she just wears fabulous outfits every day.

agree about not buying cheap, fast fashion, it really looks awful on most people, unless you are thin.
This is the sort of sweeping generalisation that women are up against.
Thankfully, anyone worth knowing would not judge a person by their clothes size.

I admired it too …

@Beansandneedles @StrangeNew

Aw thanks!

When I've been bigger ( size 18) and tried something on and it's looked bad, I've equated it with my self worth. It looks bad because I'm fat and therefore a bad person. I've heard myself making self- deprecating comments to a shop assistant asking "any good?".

When I've been thinner (size 12 so not actually thin) I can somehow see that it's the garment being oddly proportioned, badly made, not suiting my personality. When I am big, the only "good" is looking less big.

Right now I'm mid sized (14-16) and buy clothes because they're lovely material or colour or detailing, a beautiful cut or drape- and I like them and feel good though not necessarily thin in them. People say I look "put together" which I never know whether it's a compliment or euphemism for fat person wearing jewellery😁

I agree with that, I thought when I slimmed down from a 26 to a now 10-14, I would look fabulous in any old thing

But no, Im so disappointed with how crap clothes are. It really isnt me!

I look good (although old) in well cut, well proportioned clothing (and there is scant little of that around), I look lumpy and shapeless in crappy cut stuff and there is lots of that around

Anything with too much stretch, these god awful jeans that are like leggings, even if they dont say they're jeggings they virtually are. They look awful.

Yes, I think whatever size/weight this idealised version of yourself is in your head that deserves nicer things/experiences/relationships/whatever, just stop it.

You already are that person, a few centimeters less on your waist doesn't suddenly make you worthy and vice versa. Don't spend your life postponing what can be enjoyed now.