Skin care. Help a clueless newbie!

[KickAssAngel]

I'm 53 and have suddenly realized that I look it! I live somewhere where summer is hot and winter is harsh and I rarely even use moisturizer, in spite of spending hours outside at weekends, except in the absolute coldest weather.

As you can probably guess, I'm unlikely to suddenly spend time faffing around with multi step skin care routines, but I should do something to protect my skin and get my youthful glow back. Does the following sound OK?

Morning: moisturizer, eye lift cream, then SPF in the summer.
Evening: remove make up, glycolic pads cleanser, moisturizer.

I've spent hours reading reviews and looking at possible products. I can't deal with a 6 stage program, so I'm hoping this is enough to even out skin tone and prevent further damage. What do people think?

Also, any particular brand that you love? I'm in the US so can't get hold of Boots own etc but big name brands are available.

Anything is better than nothing. If you're happy to start with what you've found then go for it. No point buying products you'll never use. The skincare routine that will make the biggest difference to you is the one you can be bothered to stick with. I'd start with budget brands and if you're not happy, try more expensive ones.

Thanks for that.
Does my selection of the wide range if products sound reasonable? I keep reading about retinol but apparently that shouldn't be used with glycolic acid.

Hi OP, sorry in advance for the essay - hopefully some of it is useful to you.

The first thing I would recommend is using a high SPF all year round. UVA rays (which are responsible for skin ageing are present all year even in winter). Find one you like and use it everyday. It's the best thing you can use to protect against UV damage, which accounts for the majority of visible skin ageing. Unfortunately, as you are in the US, lots of chemical filters are not so widely available there, because they haven't been approved by the FDA. But there are some good mineral sunscreens.

Second thing I would recommend would be a Vitamin C serum. Timeless Vitamin C is a great brand that is available in the US, sadly no longer for sale in the EU. I would recommend using it in the morning before your sunscreen as it's an antioxidant and helps protect against sun damage. Will also help improve hyperpigmentation over time, and generally gives the skin a nice glow.

Retinol is great to increase cellular turnover and increase collagen production (both of which decline as we age) - use at night time after cleansing. Actually I always recommend people skip the over the counter stuff and just use tretinoin, as it is the best ingredient for improving your skin. It's basically a really strong version of retinol. However, it is prescription strength skincare (you can get it from your dermatologist, or from subscription services like Curology in the US) It can be a bit much for some people, there is usually irritation at first when using it, and can be difficult to get. Over the counter retinol is fine to stick to if that suits you better. There are loads available at all price points, find one that suits you.

You are correct that glycolic acid would not be good to use at the same time as a retinol product, so maybe use that once a week at night instead of your retinol product. Using glycolic acid pads every night may be too harsh on your skin - mine is sensitive and it would be so irritated if I used it every night.

Also, you don't really need a specific eye cream. Waste of money as far as I'm concerned.

Here is my routine, simple and takes less than 5 mins in the morning and 5 mins at night.

AM
Vitamin C serum
SPF
Moisturiser

PM
Cleanse with gentle cleanser
Tretinoin (or retinol product)
Moisturiser

Once a week or so I skip the tretinoin and use glycolic acid. Also occasionally I use other serums like niacinamide or peptides, but they are 'nice to have' and haven't been shown to do that much.

If you are worried about doing too much stick to the basics - SPF, Vitamin C serum, and a retinol.

Also, if you are interested in doing some more research, there is a brilliant US based Youtuber called Angie - her channel is called HotnFlashy.

She started looking into skincare at 50 and has loads of videos with great advice. She does use a lot of products, and also does lasers etc. but obviously that's not for everyone.

But she is great for recommending US brands, and has some cheat sheets etc.

The first thing I would recommend is using a high SPF all year round. UVA rays (which are responsible for skin ageing are present all year even in winter). Find one you like and use it everyday. It's the best thing you can use to protect against UV damage, which accounts for the majority of visible skin ageing. Unfortunately, as you are in the US, lots of chemical filters are not so widely available there, because they haven't been approved by the FDA. But there are some good mineral sunscreens.

I would question this. It's only very recently that so much sunscreen use has come into vogue with the science in terms of the chemicals and minerals in them being absorbed by the body in its infancy. The sheer amount we are advised to apply for this reason is concerning. Plus if you read the directions many only last 1 and a half to 2 hours in terms of effectiveness and then the filters (chemical and mineral) actually begin break down which can result in them actually increasing the damage the suns rays can cause. Unless you buy a longer lasting, more robust, formula.And look at the UV forecast unless you are particularly sun sensitive sunscreen is not needed for UV levels of 2 and lower. Unfortunately Tretinoin and similar products will increase sun sensitivity.

However, it must also be acknowledged sun is damaging to the skin. I personally would offer more moderate advise, though and less copious use of product. Apply only when the UV levels are 3 or higher unless you are sun sensitive and wherever possible make efforts to cover the skin with clothes and a hat so less needs to be applied overall. Don't go for products that increase sun sensitivity unless really necessary.

Oh and you need to apply the actual product as directed (liberally unfortunately) . It's doesn't work very well otherwise.

It's not so much that it has 'come into vogue' it's that UVA is far more damaging to skin that previously realised, whereas before it was just about sunburn.
Added to that many people see sunscreen as a beauty product, preventing premature ageing, so it has become more of daily use, rather than just on holidays.
If you are worried about chemical sunscreens, then mineral ones are available. Mineral sunscreens contain zinc oxide (which is also used in nappy rash cream as it is soothing to the skin) or titanium dioxide, and both don't absorb into the skin, but sit on the surface and reflect back the UV rays.

It’s been mentioned but worth highlighting specifically that retinol makes your skin more sensitive to the sun.

So you must get your SPF products sorted before you add retinol to your routine. This is also the reason you use retinol at night.

If you are worried about chemical sunscreens, then mineral ones are available. Mineral sunscreens contain zinc oxide (which is also used in nappy rash cream as it is soothing to the skin) or titanium dioxide, and both don't absorb into the skin, but sit on the surface and reflect back the UV rays.

I've read, even Zinc oxide can break down and increase the sun's damage if combined with chemical filters in formulations.

link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s43630-021-00101-2

And zinc oxide by itself still breaks down after about 2 hours. So a long lasting robust formula or frequent reapplication is necessary. There are also concerns with nano particles in Zinc Oxide being harmful.

So whilst I use sunscreen where necessary (uv levels of 3 and over), I aim not to over use it and seek to cover up as much as possible in strong sun instead.

So whilst I use sunscreen where necessary (uv levels of 3 and over), I aim not to over use it and seek to cover up as much as possible in strong sun instead.

Although in saying this, I don't use the Tret...

Your routine sounds fine, OP.
Kiehl’s and Clinique are great brands.

Like I said, mineral sunscreens are perfectly safe - what you are talking about is if they are combined with chemical filters. In the US where the OP is you can buy pure mineral sunscreens, they have loads of them.

Also, new generation chemical sunscreen filters have come a long way from oxybenzone. I and many other people use chemical sunscreens everyday without issue. I feel that my risk for skin cancer, and the damaging effects of the sun are a bigger worry for me than the chemicals in sunscreen, but obviously everyone must make their own choice.

Also, new generation chemical sunscreen filters have come a long way from oxybenzone. I and many other people use chemical sunscreens everyday without issue. I feel that my risk for skin cancer, and the damaging effects of the sun are a bigger worry for me than the chemicals in sunscreen, but obviously everyone must make their own choice.

I have an annual angst every year when buying new sunscreens as soon as the UV starts to increase. The sheer amount of product we are advised to wear necessitates at least a passing interest. I look up pretty much every ingredient and there are absolutely still issues. (My choice has settled on Ultrasun as it is one of the more robust and marine friendly.)

It interests me that you state you are worried about the damage to the skin the sun causes yet still use a product (Tretinoin) that is known to actually increase the skin's sensitivity to the sun for the purpose of 'anti-aging'. It's a marketer's dream...sell one product that requires an increased reliance of another. Both require regular use to work. All they have to do is convince us an aging skin's appearance is intrinsically bad...

faretheewell
It's really a surprise to you that people want to prevent or improve the appearance of wrinkles? This is the Style and Beauty board, every day there are posts asking about this very topic. Maybe it doesn't interest you, but it sure does other people.

I use tretinoin and can see for myself how it has greatly improved my skin, and I use sunscreen as a precautionary measure to counteract the increased sensitivity and try to stay out of direct sun. I'm happy with the results so far and will continue to do so.

I'm not quite sure how this back and forth is beneficial to the OP - if you want to discuss the merits of and issues with sunscreen you could start a new thread.

I've no idea about your specific products. There's not only one way to do skincare. You'll need to experiment.

I find retinol to be the work of the devil. I avoid anything anti-aging because I'm generally allergic to it. I use both basic products and some more expensive ones.

I decided by trial and error. It's not only about whether a product is "good" or whether it has amazing reviews, it's about whether it suits your individual skin and your personality/lifestyle (do you bother to use it or not).

I want to be properly clean, if I keep getting spots this is always the issue (experimenting with new products/unable to obtain usual products). I want moisture to combat my dryness and I don't want my skin to feel nasty, which for me rules out a lot of sunblocks and "skin enhancing" (in whatever way) chemicals.

I generally buy moisturiser with SPF in it, which isn't as effective as sunblock and I use a normal amount. If I used a teaspoon of sunblock (the amount apparently required for face and neck) I wouldn't be able to put my makeup on and would be a greasy mess.

Thank you, everyone.

I shall start looking at the UV levels - stupidly, I've never done that and in the summer we have properly hot weather. I also don't usually wear sunscreen on my face as it makes my skin itchy and spotty. I do sometimes use a tinted moisturizer with SPF, but that's really instead of wearing foundation. So, I shall get better about protecting my skin if nothing else.

I'm glad you're not all saying that I need a 6-step routine that takes half an hour and costs $$$. I actually had a consultation with someone, and she recommended a kit with 6 different creams/serums, and it cost $400. yikes!

I think I'll start gradually with SPF & moisturizer, then try either retinol OR glycolic acid, and let my skin get used to that.

I keep wondering about a chemical peel, but that seems so extreme, and how do you hide away for a week as your face peels off?

It definitely doesn't have to be complicated

Mine is

Am
Cleanser
Serum
Moisturise
spf if leaving the house (WFH)

Pm
Eye makeup remover (sensitive eyes!)
Cleanser
Tretinoin (skin and me prescription
Moisturise

On the days I don't use tret I use an exfoliating acid or a serum or oil, basically any of my nice fancy products I want to use up

I have a 6 step morning routine, it takes 10min during which I also do other things and costs very little. That person was trying to sell you their products. If you have a facial they always do this, they're on comission or have sales targets to meet.

OK - I've ordered a small thing of OTC retinol to start gently. Also a Vit C serum.
I have a tinted moisturizer with SPF so I should wear that more. I just checked, and we're having a warm November, with UV level 3 for the next week.

I also have make-up remover and I'll find a night moisturizer - I want to be able to try that in a sample before buying.

Let the glow-up begin.

It's really a surprise to you that people want to prevent or improve the appearance of wrinkles? This is the Style and Beauty board, every day there are posts asking about this very topic. Maybe it doesn't interest you, but it sure does other people.

@Farmageddon, it's really no surprise. The use of Tretinoin is pretty common because, yes, many people do like the way it makes their skin look. I just find it ironic that something that could increase the risk of sun damage and therefore in the long term actually age the skin is perceived as anti-aging. So long term it could actually increase the appearance of wrinkles! Which is right there on topic!

And the sun screen? Unless used correctly, as directed, that too could increase sun sensitivity and sun damage and therefore prematurely age the skin! Look at the directions on a lot of the products, a teaspoon of product on the face every 2 hours? If you wear makeup, how? So I choose the longer lasting stuff, look for marine safe formulas and wear hats and avoid strong sun (checking the UV - the hour by hour forecasts are most informative). But even that's not perfect.

So no, I don't go for products like Tretinoin which are known to increase sun sensitivity...no matter that they make the skin look good short term. So can a suntan. Yes, I might be motivated by the health concerns, it also very much is an anti ageing concern too since anything that can increase the damage the sun can cause is aging.

I’ve just moved back to the UK from the US and I really like The Ordinary. You can get it at Ulta, some of it you can even get at Target but not the whole range.

I have combination skin with first signs of aging and my morning routine is CeraVe salicylic acid cleanser, spritz my face with rose water in an atomiser bottle, then Clinique Moisture Surge, CeraVe SPF30 and The Ordinary Caffeine Eye Serum.

In the evening I use the same cleanser and the rose water, but then I use The Ordinary Retinoid Emulsion, Acure (Ulta or WholeFoods) Supergreens Serum with a gua sha tool and Vichy Mineral 89 eye cream (Target or Ulta).