Do you think we could come up with an adjective that's less offensive than old ladyish

[AnneDroid]

(Is adjective the right word?)

And this isn't a TAAT before anyone gets in a tizz.

I'm just fed up of clothes, shoes, cosmetics, hairstyles being described in a derogatory way as "old ladyish"

The hon, I agree with you but I think it’s meant in a more derogatory way on here. Eg “are these shoes completely minging and old ladyish?” It doesn’t seem to be meant as “are these shoes ok for my age?”
I myself am 40 so not an old lady yet but I do feel this ageism on these boards. If I constantly saw threads about clothes being middle aged and awful then it would make me feel a bit down, like I should be wearing clothes for my middle aged demographic only and that I was not allowed to wear anything fashionable or pretty or frivolous etc. Just comfort and classic clothes for my age

Speaking as a 48 yr old who has started wearing Hotter shoes, I agree Paintbox!

Without meaning to sound too “fun police” it is important to note that ageism is the same as discrimination due to race, sex, gender, sexuality etc within the equality act but for some reason she jokes and comments are still widely accepted as ok. I’m sure it’s just a matter of time before ageism commands the same feelings as racism, sexism etc

Yeah, that's fair enough paintbox. :) (Replying to your first post there.)

I think I just get a bit annoyed sometimes at the opposite, which you also often see on these boards, a kind of militant refusal to accept that anybody might ever want to take their age into account when dressing. You know the kind of thing when a poster asks "is this too young/old for me?" and six brusque responses of the "Wear what you want! Why do you give a fuck what anybody else thinks if YOU like it?" type - which always makes me wonder what the point of S&B discussion boards is, is nobody is allowed to solicit opinions on taste.

FWIW I definitely don't think that dressing "for your age" is an inherently unstylish thing to do, rather the opposite. My mother is in her 70s, so long past middle age, and frequently wears fashionable, pretty and yes sometimes frivolous things! Frankly, these days I genuinely think she looks better than I do. But I also think that part of the reason she looks so wonderful, and is such a style inspiration to me, is that she takes her age into account rather than ignoring it. M&S Classic Collection with its droopy baggy T-shirts etc is not for her! But she does choose to cover up a lot more, pays more for expensive tailoring and fabrics (and alterations, where necessary), and takes her changing skin and hair tone into account (e.g. she now avoids black as it drains her, and goes for rich navies, browns or jewel colours instead). Dame Helen Mirren, I suspect, adopts the same approach and looks tremendously stylish and elegant.

FWIW I am a little younger than you and have been shopping at the shoe shop frequented by all the rich old ladies in my town for the last 15 years because the quality and comfort of the brands they stock is unparalleled and I couldn't possibly go back to the flimsy crap peddled by the other shoe shops after getting used to these. :D I'm usually much younger than everyone else in the shop, which is fine. I just select styles rather carefully to avoid anything where there is a really obvious clash between my age and the demographic the shoe is designed for.

Frumpy

Matronly

Helen Mirren looks better in rock chick gear than rock chicks do. She is a stunning woman. Truly ageless.

The hom, yes totally. I dress different to how I did when I was younger and I am fine with that. You are right that on here we do often see people saying wear what you want, age is not important. For me it is, I wouldn’t wear a crop top at 40 even though I did when I was 20 and I doubt I’ll be wearing a mini skirt at 70 although I do now. It’s all about balance like everything in life!

Helen mirren isn’t ageless, she’s old and it’s ok to say she’s old. It’s ok to BE old

Agree, Helen mirren is old and it is ok to be old. She is also stylish. It is possible to be old and stylish. I think we often forget these things on s&b

My mother often frostily referred to various fashion choices as “ I’ll advised”.

I am here, thank you

Of course we don't suit the same things at 60 as we did at 20. If I had to give a single piece of style advice it would be to keep on reviewing your wardrobe all your life because your body shape will change, your skin tone will change, your hair colour will change and your tastes will change.

But that's not really what this is about is it?

I have never once seen 'old lady' or 'granny' used in anything other than a derogatory way on here. Usually it's shorthand for 'plug ugly'.

Secondly, although we do change, old or middle aged women are not some amorphous blob.
We don't all look the same.
We don't all suit the same things.
We don't all like the same things.
We don't all lead the same lives.

I would say most of us share a preference for better fabrics to compensate for loss of muscle tone, and that a lot of us like to cover our arms and knees. That really is about it. Believe it or not, we don't all even like the same shoes. Talking about us as if we do, is not only a bit ignorant but also not very helpful for anyone wanting advice.

As for a replacement word - do we actually need one? Why not just ask, 'What do you think of this?' 'Do you like it?' or as Mumnset would say, 'Is this naice?'

Cates... comfort at the expense of style.

Yes, Helen Mirren is old, but there is a timelessness about her, for me. She seems above fashion, above age. That said, she looks better with every passing year, I think.

Ill advised 😂

I was on a thread this morning which referred to a coat as "a bit Hayley Cropper" which seems to me to be a perfect description of something unfashionable.

The word I would like people to stop using is invisible! I have noticed on here that women in the 40-50 age group often describe themselves that way! I think it’s a really defeatist word and a bit depressing, as though we are totally worth not noticing, I know a lot of women do experience that feeling of invisibility, some embrace it, I get that, but it just seems to be the automatic go to word when that age is reached, the more it’s said the more it’s accepted by women themselves. Visible and proud here!

Floisme - thank you, you've explained something I've only recently come to realise but haven't been able to quite pin down: the need for better quality fabric that skims over my looser, less toned, body.

The difficulty I find is wanting to look casual yet stylish but some of the better quality stuff is also cut differently in a way that on me (5ft 2") doesn't look as I want to look - ie things can look frumpy and I have to try on loads to find anything that does me any favours.

Yy Floisme & villageshop it annoys me so much the casual ageism & that if you are older you can’t possibly be stylish or even god forbid have a reasonable figure.
Village I have the same problem, I’m 4ft 10 & have a very small frame it’s really difficult to find clothing that drapes/fits as it should.

You're welcome village. I agree it can be hard to find stuff that's both modern and in a forgiving shape / fabric. I used to really like Whistles - in fact I still do but I sacked them because the quality for the price was just outrageous. I do find good underwear makes a big difference to how clothes hang on me - with the right bra I can sometimes still get away with cheaper fabric. And I've started having things altered a lot more to get the right fit.

I have no suggestions for the old ladyish substitute but am replying to say YES to the need for better quality fabrics. The worst one for me is that thin, clingy stretch fabric - jersey I guess, but not the thick stuff that drapes and holds everything in and flatters. So many times I see a lovely top in exactly the right shape for me but know that it will look awful because it’s made of that fabric that clings to every lump and accentuates lack of muscle tone. I often shop with my friend who is a bit older than me but adopted her children so has never been pregnant. We wear the same dress size but her stomach and torso doesn’t have the same slightly doughy look that mine and the rest of my mum friends have - and we all excercise more than her so I think it’s due to not being stretched by babies. Anyway, she can still wear stuff made from those fabrics but the rest of us can’t. It has made me think about the importance of good fabric for women who are past the first flush of youth. I wish more designers would take it into account.

Old is someone 20 years older than you. I agree dowdy or frumpy is better than old ladyish

Old- older than my brother (9 years older than me)

Young - younger than my sister (3 years younger).

My yardsticks move through life with me.