Double cleansing - with what?

[umberellaonesie]

I am 35, acne prone skin managed by the pill and Aknemycin plus (tretinoin, erythromycin) nightly.
I cleanse morning and night with lush ultrabland removing with hot cloth.
I use forever living propels cream as a night cream and whatever daily moisturiser I have lying around (clinque, nivea, okay).
But recently my face is just meh. I think I need to change things up but terrified if aggravating my acne.
So any top tips now I am older, what could I double cleanse with?

Quite the reverse. I'd posted twice now to say that whilst I disagreed we're all different etc. - which was a nice way of saying that we've all got our own opinions and there's nothing wrong with that but let's agree to disagree.

But you kept going and then picked up what I'd written about miscellar water - which does rather feel at odds with what you're now saying about different opinions! I'm also well aware that this is style & beauty

So at this point, yes 'good for you' because I'm not going to continue posting on this thread as whatever I write seems to be at odds with what you think - which is fine except for the fact that you seem unable to agree to disagree! I'm not arguing anymore as it's derailing which isn't fair to the OP so I'm out.

Good luck with your skincare OP. Do post an update and let people know how you are getting on. There is lots of good support here and I have found it invaluable for learning the ins and outs of getting the best out of skincare products.

I am not on antibiotics and have had 5 courses of roaccutane over the last 20years. I will not subject my liver to any more. Whomever said I should stop antibiotics and go roaccutane obviously doesn't have acne. It is a very serious drug which has horrendous short term and long term side affects and should not be considered lightly.
As it says in my original post I have acne prone skin but it is well managed with hormones and I use topical retinoid which includes an Antibiotic. ( as that is the only product our health board will prescribe.)
I am looking for something to nourish and keep my now aging skin in tip top condition as my current routine is lacking. My skin is dull, dry with redness.
This has been really helpful thank you. Lots of ideas for serums and toners.

Come over to the new skincare thread and have a browse of that, some v knowledgable people on there
https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/styleandbeauty/2840483-Ditch-The-Foundation-Embrace-Some-Fantastic-Skincare-Instead

OP I hope you get on okay.
Your first post said this I am 35, acne prone skin managed by the pill and Aknemycin plus (tretinoin, erythromycin) nightly.

Erythromycin comes are pills too (not just cream) so that's what I thought you were taking as an AB. You didn't say you'd have Roaccutane 5 times. If you had I'd not have suggested it.

I don't have acne, but one DD does and I've been involved in her treatment for over 10 years, including many appts with dermos. She has now ditched oral ABs as they were affecting her guts after so many years on them. I was trying to help you- no need to be rude.

Hope you find something that helps.

As I said you don't have acne. I do say in my OP that my acne is managed. I was not looking for advice about acne. As I have 20years experience of managing my own acne not someone else's, as you say you have good skin so have no experience.
I was looking for advice on a skincare routine that would suit my skin type.
You were rude to make assumptions about my skin and offer advice I didn't ask for on a topic you have no experience of.

no acne but maybe an anger issue! Lot of other people advised about managing 'your acne'. So rude.

Have a lovely weekend.

And learn to read please- DD had / has had acne for over 13 years. I've helped her manage hers via ppts with dermos. As explained in all my posts. :)

Turned out nice again, 'asn't it?

If you want to try a facial oil, Clarins do one for oily skin. It is delicious smelling and really works, even though it is a bit counter-intuitive putting it on.

Op I use miceller water (garnier, pink) to get MU off, then a mild cleaner like cetaphil for oily skin.
I use a toner with salacylic acid like Clinique 3 and then a moisturiser gel like dr organic's snail gel.

I have cystic acne, had it for years, back acne and on my chest and neck too, went on the pill, the antibiotics, but the pill sorted it to a level I was happy with, so stopped looking for medical solutions, so never went on roccutane.

I have oily skin now, and I try not to use stuff for acne prone skin.

I also NEVER drink milk or eat beef as that sets it off.

Now in my 40s I have sometimes hormonal acne on my jaw, but find that Clinique, or when I'm low on funds, clearasil toner seems to keep that at bay.

I use a good concealer, Clinique airbrush and dermablend to cover the spots, scars and hyperpigmentation.

My skin breaks out if I touch it a lot, or if I wear wool. Or if my hair annoys it.

I use a Chanel foundation with spf.

My skin is clear, except for the occasional spot on my jaw, and it's oily and has pores. This is the way it is.

I think the miceller water (pink one, for normal skin) mild cleanser (cetaphil for oily skin), toner with exfoliating salycilic acid and then the all over snail gel made a big difference. I don't use serum, or heavy cremes, or anything special on my eyes, just the gel.

Occasionally I use a lactic acid mask, (dermatological) and I use a fresh daily flannel to pat dry. Occasionally, once a week I'll use a little baby hairbrush to wash my face. The really soft ones.

So I suppose I use exfoliation to keep the pores clean and don't put a lot of oily heavy cremes on as I'm prone to oily skin, blocked and open pores and I don't want to exasperate things. I never use a mattifying creme or anything like that as they cause a flare up.

I have absolutely no wrinkles and look about 20.
I've no sun damage either as I've always used spf.
Eucerin do a great 30spf in a non greasy creme (with lactic acid) for summer.

Hope this helps.

Thank you **UnderbeneathsiesTheMistletoe really good to hear someone's first hand amount of managing their skin.
That is interesting as from what you are saying we have very different acne prone skin. So really good to see your routine and gives me a bit if understanding about what might work for me and what won't for me.
Going to get some toner with salicylic acid in today.

I'm confused about this too

Here's the thing: I am terrified of going near oil cleansers again. I used to oil cleanse as a "deep clean" treat for my skin at university when my acne was going through a really awful stage, using it once or twice a week. It worked pretty well for me, and I enjoyed it, but was very assiduous about only doing it before / during a bath to be sure of really getting it all out.

My acne got a bit better over the intervening few years but was always unpredictable, and then suddenly oil cleansing became all mainstream with The Body Shop doing their Chamomile range, and I got all excited and started doing it again, morning and night.

It was great for several weeks, and then... Boom. Not an uncommon story, I'm sure, but oh my goodness. I had a muzzle of spots. It was awful and took ages and ages to go down, and I'm sure it still hasn't properly recovered.

I still use it to get my eye make up off but I now use that Elemis tri-enzyme stuff straight on my make up. I know I should look into double-cleansing but how about that Micellar water stuff for me instead of oil? I honestly can't bear the risk of rubbing it into my chin again!

Found it.
So have introduced toner with glycolic acid and serum.
At when point do I do the retinoid?

Following for similar advice

Thanks to the Asian Beauty Reddit I discovered what a difference a low-pH cleanser can do. Try reading this blog post: www.snowwhiteandtheasianpear.com/2014/09/skincare-discovery-why-ph-of-your.html

So, since I wear BB creams and sunscreen I double cleanse. I use an oil cleanser first, like The Body Shops Chamomile oil cleanser www.thebodyshop.com/en-gb/face/view-all/camomile-silky-cleansing-extract/p/p000934 or this one from L'Occitane uk.loccitane.com/shea-cleansing-oil,83,1,29776,649983.htm (these are just examples of a type I like - I like those that can be emulsified and rinsed off OR removed with a wet flannel, depending on how much I feel like splashing that evening). After I use a low pH foaming cleanser (no higher than say 6 in pH). Companies don't print the pH of their cleansers usually so it takes a bit of detective work. I've emailed some companies to ask them (and the ones that say "that's a trade secret" don't get my custom any more...) and I've also made use of the spreadsheet on the Asian Beauty Reddit. Currently I'm using a very gentle one from Korean company COSRX, sokoglam.com/products/cosrx-low-ph-good-morning-cleanser.

Anyway, this post looks more complicated than it is. Treating my skin gently by using products that respect its pH and don't damage my acid mantle has helped a lot, basically. I've always had spots and I've had horrendous cystic acne these past few years. Since it's always been only on my face I've never wanted Roaccutane. My daughters are on it though with good results, but they had acne all over.

I'm with all other pps, Caroline hirons is a genius at skincare, I would recommend the Emma Hardie cleansing balm it is pricey but amazing it ast ages too so I guess that counteracts the price, I then follow with la roche posay toleriane cleanser, it is lovely and gentle. though Caroline H has just brought out a double cleanser pot in collaboration with pixi which I am just about to try :)

I double cleanse if I've been wearing a heavy foundation e.g. Estée Lauder Double Wear or MAC Studio Fix Fluid. I use The Body Shop camomile butter for double cleansing.

Hi OP, similar here - acne and dullness and just general meh skin in my thirties. Dr Sam Bunting totally turned everything around for me. And I was impressed, because even though she's a Harley Street dermatologist, she didn't push expensive products on me, she gave me great alternatives that can be bought in Boots. At the end of the day, not all skin is the same, and you will be sensitive to things that others aren't and vice versa, so you still may go through a bit of trial and error.

Based on her advice, I have the following routines:

AM

• Wash face in the shower using cetaphil and twice a week I use La Roche Posay Effaclar H creamy cleanser or Medik8 Pore Cleanse Gel instead of cetaphil, depending on which I have at the time.
• Vitamin C serum (Dr Bunting uses Obagi, but it's pricey. I get Medik8 C tetra online from them directly or on Amazon if it's cheaper)
• Moisturiser - something hydrating and gentle e.g. from La Roche Posay or Avene. Obagi Hydrate is good, but very pricey. The Medik8 Hydr8 Night is a good alternative, although not as cheap as La Roche Posay and Avene. If I need sunscreen I use the Medik8 one as it's the only one I've tried that doesn't break me out.
• Make up - keep it light. If you were foundation use the lightweight skin-like ones e.g. Armani Glow or Luminous Silk or Nars. I use Nars Creamy concealer and a light dusting of powder, e.g. Bobbi Brown or Laura Mercier. Dr Bunting doesn't like powder, but I can't do liquid foundation, I hate the feel of it, even if I'm really acneic and have a lot to cover.

PM

• If wearing make up I remove it with e.g. Clinique Take the Day Off Milk or Lancome if heavy (very rare), or an eye make up remover (the creamy Simple one) and Bioderma Micellar water if light (do this way most nights).
• Cleanse with La Roche Posay Toleraine Cream Cleanser, massaging for at least one minute and rinsed off with warm water (go straight to this step if not wearing make up).
• Spray of La Roche Posay Serozinc.
• Leave face to dry for 15 mins and then use my prescription tretinoin.
• Leave that to settle in before applying moisturiser (see above).

That's it. Made a massive difference. The Vit C serum in the morning is great!

Hope that helps