All these skincare threads...

[FannyFernackapan]

Are figuratively making my skin break out and weep.

Loads of people putting glycolic acids, retinol, BHA, 5% salicylic acid etc etc etc on their faces. I honestly can't believe half of what I'm reading and I think the long term effects of this won't be good. It's such a 'new' thing and I really couldn't disagree with CH more on some of her ideas.

I'm obviously not a facialist. I'm 43 years old but am pretty much wrinkle free and have 'normal' skin which is probably dehydrated now that I'm knocking on a bit. I put time and effort into looking after my skin and I DO use some faintly heavy duty stuff ( a pumpkin enzyme mask once every few weeks and a sweep of Alpha H maybe once a week now ) but I truly believe that as you age you should look to nourishing, moisturising products that add glow and lustre as opposed to harsh chemicals that you may think are doing 'something' because they're making you break out, but I fear that all they're doing is stripping your skin and ensuring it'll be sensitive and prone to inflammation forever more .

Im not advocating a return to a quick swipe of Simple toner and a blob of Nivea and I love my high end products - namely Eve Lom, Algenist, Oskia, Omorovicza etc but all this daily chemical applying concerns me.

Anyone agree? Or are you all going to flame me ?

Thanks for your concern.

Sorry im going to disagree. You're lucky to have wrinkle free normal/dryish skin which doesn't need much more then "feeding"

Im 32 and have had acne all my life so now I have spotty and scarred skin. I need harsh products to force my skin to fix itself. I don't use them daily but I do use them regularly enough to have an effect. It's taken me a long time to find a method which works and keep my skin under control and im sticking to it!

Oh don't mention it mama or am I not allowed a different point of view ?

Hmm, I'm not sure that even with acne scarred skin that you need to 'force' it to help heal it. And chemicals won't heal it anyway , not in the long run

So you aren't a facialist or skin care expert and what you do works for your skin. Other people have different skin with different issues.

What ever works best for you ! We can agree to disagree I guess :)
Since following advice on the skin care threads my skin has never looked better ! Introducing hot cloth cleaning , acid tone , serum and retinA my skin is clearer , glowing and less lined, I have had lots of compliments so far ! I think the trick is to take it slow and steady and not overload with everything all at once .

I know that people have different skin with different issues.

I still stand by chemicals purchased online from Korea is probably not the answer in the long term

How would you know? If skincare (pretty much all advanced skincare whether its from Korea or elsewhere is " chemicals" ) works for the user then it works. Do you only use lanolin?

My skin loves an acid, thinking about cracking open the sulfuric next!

Yes and no. Do I think CH gives some good advice? Yes. Do I think she also talks rubbish sometimes? Yes.

Like you, my skin's always been quite good, and it's genetic really, so I can't take credit for it - but on the whole I've tried to treat it gently. I think a lot of the products raved about on here are at best a waste if money and at worst quite damaging, because they contain a high percentage of alcohol and fragrance. However there are active ingredients that really make a difference and the various acids etc are among them.

I love the S&B discussions on skincare, they are interesting and fun. I've made some tweaks to my routine and my skin's looking much better for it. I have learnt which ingredients don't agree with me and which ones tend to work. I don't spend more than I can get away with afford and I don't slavishly believe any 'gurus' - it's my face! Others may have totally different favourite products etc and that's great

The thing that drives me crazy about skincare is all the differing advice and options. To try all these different methods, and give enough time to really see if they work, would take years and cost a fortune! I wish I was prepared to give it a go but I just stick to a face wash, exfoliate with a brush, then moisturise. My skin's not perfect but it's not awful either. I just don't have the money or perseverance to try out all these different methods.

All these skincare threads? If you're referring to the Amazing Faces quiche, there are 2.

I think each to their own, but I use acid nearly every day and my skin is much better for it. I agree it might not be for everyone, those who are particularly sensitive, for example. However, I see that you do use acid yourself, just not daily. The ones you use are much stronger than the daily ones and you don't use them that often, but I don't really see how it's that different to using a weak one every day.

Oh, and it depends on the type of acne scarring as to whether or not retinols, etc., will help. I don't bother because I have boxcar/ice pick type scarring, but retinols can definitely help with dark marks and lesser scarring.

'I love the S&B discussions on skincare, they are interesting and fun.'

I agree. I have learned loads from hanging out here and I'm really glad I discovered Caroline Hirons because following her double cleansing advice is one of the best things I've ever done for my face. I'm also impressed by my REN acid toner (although it's not one that CH rates).

I see where you're coming from OP because I find retinol pretty extreme and that's where I draw my line. However its true that everyone's skin is different and everyone has a different attitude to skin care. Much as I have read absolute rave reviews about the Tata Harper cleanser, I just cannot bring myself to spend nearly fifty quid on stuff that cleans your face, even though I could technically afford it. Other people buy it and love it and feel its absolutely worth it. Fair enough.

Thisishow, what sort of CH advice do you think is rubbish? Genuine question. She gets lauded as the Second Coming on here so would be good to hear a bit of balance!

Everyone should just use what works for them. I think 5% SA is a bit extreme but if it is effective for someone whose scarring is worse than mine, who am I to judge? The thought of using an electric powered brush on my face every day makes me cringe but they work for some people, so it's none of my business.

Lottapianos off the top of my head:
Using two different cleansers for double cleansing. Generally using several different products to do the same job.
Her love of expensive cleansers. How long does your cleanser stay on your face for? The whole point is that you're going to wash it off.
Her hatred of mineral oil. It's fine for lots of people, I believe (I seem to be able to use it without any issues). Essential oils can be irritating, too.
She nearly always seems to suggest that expensive products are better. Within reason, I simply don't believe this is true.
She chops and changes products and routines a lot. Obviously up to a point she needs to because of her job, but she seems to promote this. I agree with Googlers that it must be impossible to tell what is doing what, if anything.

I find it hard to believe that using glycolic acid in the morning doesn't make your skin more sun sensitive during the day. AFAIK she doesn't address this.
She seems to recommend a lot of products that are alcohol and fragrance heavy and come in a jar.

i don't hate her or anything, as I said before I think she gives a lot of good advice, too! I do find it odd that she is so revered here, but I love the threads anyway.

I find the op a bit smug and like my mother who disagrees with pretty much any skin care.

I've learned loads on here. Agree with others that hot cloth cleansing is brilliant. My skin on my face is near perfect since I've been doing this I just go through a lot of flannels!

Yes, the flannel industry is doing well out of us!

She absolutely strongly recommends that if you use any 'acid' product you should use a high factor sunscreen.
For every £60 serum she likes, there is a £4 one she likes too. That's why I like her, she is very honest about stuff and will say when something isn't worth the £££s.
I notice there seems to be a lot of misconceptions about the word 'acid'. Hyaluronic 'acid' is heavy duty plumping and moisturising. The glycolics/salicylics et al are a lot less harsh in the cosmetic doses than the dreadful 'scrubs' and harsh exfoliators that some people use.

What I don't understand, DrankSangria - genuinely, and happy to be corrected - is why it's not enough to use the glycolic at night. I essentially agree with her about hydrating toners - why not use that in the morning and glycolic/salycic at night? Agree SPF is needed anyway.

Agree some people don't understand the types of acid, also that some 'alcohols' are fine and not drying etc.

I don't disagree that she recommends a range of price points, but she certainly recommends a lot of expensive stuff and promotes the use of a lot of different items, which may be fun but I'm not convinced it's necessary.

Again, not saying I'm necessarily right, it's just my opinion.

The reason that two different products are required for double cleansing is that the first should be light and oil/lotion/gel based in order to remove make up whereas the second can be richer and more of a cream or balm. CH does say on her blog that it's perfectly fine to use the same cleanser for both cleanses.

The reason she doesn't mention spf much is that she generally uses foundation or moisturiser which already contains SPF so does not include it in her skincare regime.

Chemicals coming out of Korea ...

A lot of the latest innovation in skin and hair care is coming out of the Far East at the moment.

Just because it's not from a Western country, doesn't mean it's pumped full of chemicals (western products have just as much chemicals in them)

Digital perms are generally gentler on hair than harsh chemical perms and were first introduced in Japan.

Don't be so close minded about where the products come from.

Women the world over have used a lot of different types of traditional products and with the advent of the Internet, it's easier to share information and buy stuff from all over.

Yes, so if it's fine to use the same for both, why encourage people to buy two or more? I mean, if you want to that's fine - but it's not really necessary, let alone at Emma Hardie prices.

Your concern is a bit odd given you admit to using a lot of high end products and a 12% glycolic acid product.

Good for you, I'm happy your skin is lovely. In the meantime you don't own S&B.

BTW my opinion on Caroline Hirons is exactly the same as Thisisyouyoudisappear's. I view her as an entry point to good skin advice but always go with Dr Sam Bunting when they disagree.

What's this hot cleansing business?