How do some women always manage to look so put together and downright gorgeous?

[Beigecurtains]

Is it just 'inbuilt' style that they're born with? If so, I'm incredibly jealous!!

My friend always looks amazing and really stylish but I find it really hard to put my finger on what it is that makes her look special. She's not overly tall, and is slim but not skinny (size 12), and certainly doesn't spend a fortune on beauty treatments/products or clothes, or having her hair done.

Her outfits are usually fairly simple; just jeans with a nice top usually, and she wears accessories such as a necklace or a large scarf. She always wears make up, but again it's fairly simple, nothing garish. And hair in a bun or just down and wavy.

So on paper she doesn't dress particularly differently to probably 90% of other women, but she always manages to stand out.

How do some women do this? I'd love to know the secret so I can stop looking like a bag lady

I try

I think I need to outsource more...

I think I'm holding up up pretty well, I'm not ashamed to think that. Not that I'd ever be arrogant enough to Real Life that thought, of course!

I have a first appointment with a celeb dermatologist - highly recommended by a fab friend - tomorrow. Am hoping for results!

I am outsourcing as much as I can since going back to work.

I swear by botox administered with a very light touch of course.

I have no issue with outsourcing per se but can find if hard to identify suppliers who live up to my exacting personal standards...

I observe people a lot, at airports for example, and Northern Europeans have a tendency to choose comfort over style. Tricot/t shirt material in tops rarely looks very good (it shows every lump and bump) when you are a bit older. Italian mature women tend to wear tops that have to be ironed (shirts, blouses) and they have things dry-cleaned a lot. Northern Europeans love cardigans (easy to get wrong - too tight or baggy) and voluminous scarves, Italians prefer a more structured approach to jackets, coats and accessories. Northern Europeans pick jeans based what is the current prevailing style, and theirs tend to run a bit short or are very tight. (I never saw anyone here wearing cropped jeans, whereas up North 7/8s and capris are normative.) Italians pick jeans based on their personal shape, wear them ultra long and balance them with footwear. Northern Europeans wear trainers and flat, rubber-soled shoes - Italians suede and heeled boots. Northern Europeans rely a lot on black or brown as a neutral, Italians use navy-gray-camel-cream-forest green. Italians tend to balance their shape and are very precise about hem lengths - the length of your top is enormously important - Northern Europeans wear a tight top with tight bottoms or everything is loose and baggy and bunched over hips to add a Michelin tyre. Italians often also have key basic items tailor made (ever wondered why Italian men look so good? It's relatively affordable here!) and they use cobblers and alterations tailors a lot as well.

These are overgeneralizations and of course there are exceptions on both sides. I haven't fully mastered Italian style and have my personal comfort-oriented leanings, but these details can make a big difference.

Bonsoir, whose the derma? I'm going through second puberty and a paper bag is not 'grooming'.

I'm in Herts and can travel. PM if you don't want to out.

Yes, finding good people to out-source too is hard. But I'm in a village and neighbour knows everyone which helps a lot.

bonsior is your dermatologist in paris or London?. I just saw a celeb dermatologist a couple of weeks ago,and I'm very happy,with my consultation.

Oooh what did he say Santa - any top secret tips? And did he accidentally mention which 'natural' celebs have a lot of 'help'

I think it's good to balance your hair with your outfit, so loose/flowing hair with tighter clothes and bun/up-do for unstructured outfits.

Tshirt - Lol!! I feel the same. I have the attributes that many of you mention. I'm tall and slim, look after my skin, hair and nails, spend a bit of money on clothes and a lot of money on shoes yet I always look a bit dishevelled. I think I'm naturally just a bit scruffy. I have a friend who's in her 50s, a size 20 and can't afford to buy clothes unless they come from the charity shop or primark and she always looks groomed and smart and lovely and well put together. I've pretty much given up to be honest. I'm resigned to looking scruffy!!

I'm far from 'put together and groomed' however have loved that everyone has added stuff to his thread so I will pipe up too.

I work full time. Work wardrobe consists exclusively of fitted dresses (I'm five ft six and size 12) from Warehouse, French Connection, Oasis etc. I chuck on a long necklace and a statement scarf to bright them up. They are almost all black, however most of them have detail. The one I wore today is a Warehouse one with ruching to the shoulders and part way down the arms I'm no good at describing it but it's fab . Tomorrow will be a black French Connection batwing style dress. So basically simple and smart but funky but brightened with scarf and necklace. I always wear heels unless I'm travelling around London all day in which case I wear black leather boots from Aldo. Black mac / trench coat.

On my 'off' days I wear skinnies with a pretty simple top, again with some detail to make it more interesting. My favourite at present is a simple long line navy one from H&M with 3/4 length sleeves and ruching (again) on the hip. I throw a scarf on, normally wear tan ankle boots with buckles more French Connection or tan mid length boots from Mango. Parka to keep warm.

Hair (blonde, medium length) I always pile on top of my head in a messy but controlled bun. Pinned to tame if necessary. Make up consists of Bare Minerals foundation (light application...I don't trowel it on), blusher, highlighter and mascara. Eyelash curlers are your friend.

Shit that was way too long. Sorry.

Brilliant thread! I've learned a lot :)

I'm surprised there hasn't been more talk of fit! I think it's absolutely the most important thing. I think most people just buy whatever even if the fit isn't quiiite right because honestly well-fitting clothes are really time-consuming to find. But once you find the brands that suit you well, you can just stock up. My rule is I don't buy anything unless I feel stylish in it, a tshirt will make you feel stylish if the fit is perfect for you.

I've also learned to pay attention to fabrics - I look for only natural fabrics. 100% silk or 100% cotton still look fab years later.

Bonsoir, please report back on your derm appointment. I do lots with my skin (bit of botox, hard core peel etc) but I've never had great skin. It cant be coincidence that all the celebs typically have amazing looking skin. Kylie for instance may have a bit too much of a frozen look going on (depending on your views) but the quality and evenness of her skin is incredible.

Rudy, that outfit sounds fabulous! Ignore the clown comments.

Yes, cursive, fit is important. I get most of my clothes altered to fit. All department stores offer it as a free service over here and anything I buy elsewhere gets taken to a dressmaker near my home.

The clown comment was about Audrey on Putting Me Together, not Rudy! Sorry if that wasn't clear from my post.

Can I ask about scarves - colleagues look lovely in these, and I would really like to invest in some. But how do you tie or fasten them? And could anyone recommend a good place to find them, please? Also statement necklaces, where to buy? I am quite small and when I try scarves or necklaces I always feel a bit drowned.