Just been informed that Ex Wife is moving to Scotland, Can she do this?

[tigereyes1817]

yerblurt, I have emailed you. on fnf email.

As subject line states, we received a letter this morning form herself stating that she ntends to move to Scotland in 3 weeks time, towork on an ongoing relationship with her partner.

DSD already lives 2 hours away and we colllect her every other weekend and half the holidays. If she moves to scotland then this would be in eccess of 4 hours in a good run.

We know that she needs us as much as we need her, and she has siblings here but none with her BM. We are really desperate to do someting as, althoough this is what she states in the letter we do not belive that this is in the best interest of DSD. No where soes it state that DSD has agreed to this nor does it states that she even knows and is happy with this, I do kow that if she understood the full extent of this move then I know that she would not be happy with this at all, but she is still a couple of weeks from being 6 years old and does not fully understand everything. We don't so there is no way that she does.

Anyway does anyone know where we can go from here. We DIY in Court as we can not afford soliciotr fees. and get no where we warned them of this years ago and nothing was done. Now looki we are 3 weeks off loosing our precious girl, and no idea how to help her.

Any help or advise.DO you think we could go for custody?

I am almost 100% sure she can't move to Scotland. My partners ex wife tried to do this and was told by his solicitor that she could not without going through the courts or with his permission. I think its something to do with Scotland having different laws to us or different courts or something. Mind you that was 10 years ago so things may be different now.

My advice would be to get to your local court a.s.a.p to get some sort of emergency order to stop your wife from removing your child to Scotland. You will be able to do this in the short amount of time you have if you start the ball rolling tomorrow, you shouldnt even need a solicitor initially, just get straight to court and ask the court administrators the best way to proceed. Best of Luck

I assume her father has parental responsibility, in which case he can object.

if you have parental repsonsibility you can do more than object - for £80 you can lodge a petition with the court to stop the child being moved.

Obviously this whole thing hinges on what's best for the child so if she is settled in education etc., then the best thing would be to maintain that.

What's your relationship with her like now?

We've been told we have to pay £175 for the court to start but this doe not garantee us that we will stop her from moving. We have not got £175. We pay a fortune in CSA we also pay all the travelling cost to and from where she lives now. We have also found out that it is actually 5 and half hours drive at least. so 11 hours non stop in one day. Just can not be done. She had threatened this since finding out she was pregnant and we have voiced our concerns several times.

It is a nightmare. DH wants to go for custody as we know DSD has told her BM that she wants to live here with us. But I don't know if this is the answer. Don't get me wrong I would have here today for good and not look back. But I am also aware that she is not quite 6 yet so is very impressionable. Wants to be where the best offer is!! type thing. Our children are gutted and have told DH that he must do everything to stop her from moving to Scotland.

Head is a spin as we getting ready to collect her which by the looks of it is going to be her last weekend with us. Not only this but we have booked to go away as we always do in the summer and have booked for DSD, So yet again she is going to miss out. Also the fact the EX is moving to WORK on an ongoing relationship, what if this does not work out, which is likely!!! We are also aware of this partner letting DSD down on a few occasions.

So what is the right thing to do?

Anyone got any money spare?

If you can't afford the court fee you need to fill in form EX(shit can't remember the no but court website www.courtservice.gov.uk will tell you). It's an application to waive the fee. You can download boththat form and the application for a prohibited steps order (C1) from the court website.

Once you've filled in both forms, take them to the court. Explain to the clerk at the counter that you need the district judge to consider your application to waive the fee pronto due to the fact that the child may be taken out of the jurisdiction within a couple of weeks.

When you fill in the C1, you need to state that the order you're seeking is a prohibited steps order. You don't need to file a statement with it.

Ask the court to expedite the listing of your application to a date no later than 10 days from now.

When you get to court on the hearing day, the district judge won't be able to hear significant evidence from you as it'll only be listed for 20 mins or so, but will, in most cases, send your dh and his ex to meet with a Cafcass officer there and then and depending on how that meeting goes, will usually get you into court again an hour or so later to decide whether to make an interim p.s. order stopping the ex from removing child from jurisdiction.

The matter will then be adjourned to give Cafcass time to meet everyone involved and file a report recommending whether the child should be removed, and if so what contact arrangements need to be made.

(sorry for rushed response, am on way out to court)

TBH I would stop paying the full CSA amount immediately (as a temporary measure, I am not endorsing you stopping paying it IYSWIM)) just so you can fund the £175 to start the ball rolling.

Only thing I can think is that you go for custody and at the least settle for full school holidays but I@m no legal beagle so for you and dsd.

Coming from another angle. DH's ex threatened to move towns when they first got divorced, he was v. upset, but it didn't eventuate. Now with her new DH they told his DD that they were going to move across the country. DH obv. v. upset again, wanting to stop it, but we discussed it and thought well we'd have her all the holidays instead of alt. weekends and he shouldn't stop it as her mother wanted to get on with her life. Also if we ever wanted to move somewhere else, then we would be free to without her having an opinion about it IYSWIM.

Really what I'm trying to say, is instead of fighting it through, as Jammi says can be v. difficult and expensive, can you not agree with her mother that you will have DSD for all of the short school holidays and half the summer ones instead of the current arrangement. This could be a good first step and based on what I've seen in UK, school holidays are very frequent.

Technicallly permission of those with PR is needed but once the horse has bolted and all that...
If you intend to do something do it now.

Hi tiger, I've previously replied to you off-forum, but for the benefit of others I'll post my thoughts;

• Where in the country do you all live - your partner's ex and yourselves
• Are there any residence orders / contact orders etc in place - has it every been to court before, if so what happened
• Does your partner have PR
• What is the current parenting schedule (contact routine)

• If you are in England then she is removing the child from jurisdiction and the child's habitual residence

• As you have written proof of this I would make an emergency application to court ex parte for a Prohibitve Steps Order, Shared Residence Order, Contact Order

• You need to file this asap. Get a C1, fill it in. Take 3 copies to the nearest county court to the ex with the fee of £175 (pay in cash, most cards don't accept cards and you will have to wait for a cheque to clear. Cash means the application is filed that day)

• Can you not borrow the money from someone? If you can't afford the fee then you can apply for a fee remission on form EX160 (www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/HMCSCourtFinder/GetForm.do?court_forms_id=168)

• Your reasons for applying to court will be that it this removal of the child from her habitual residence and from the jurisdiction will be not in the child's best interests as it will be a drastic change in her circumstances; she will be moved away from her school, her school friends, there will be educational disruption, the change in circumstances of contact with her father and extended family means that in your view it is not in her best interests that this move be allowed.

• The ex has enrolled the child in a school, this has been done without any discussion with father, as he has PR, he should be consulted about such a drastic change in circumstances.

• Has the ex sorted out a job/accommodation etc?

• I would stress that this move appears motivated by mother's needs rather than the child's needs. You can provide all this for the child and maybe the court should consider a application for sole residence by father?

• why scotland? Does she have family there at all

• I think you need to urgently get advice from your local FNF branch and try and get an experienced McKenzie friend too.

Once the ex moves to scotland you will have a very hard job in reversing this - a new status quo will have been set in place.

The child will be in a new school, the courts will be very reluctant to change this.

This is why time is of the essence and you need to move quickly.

Fill in a C1, make 3 copies.

Get yourself down to the nearest county court to the ex's home when the court opens (usually 9am), find a court clerk and say that you wish to see the next available judge as you wish to make an emergency ex parte application, state that there is a child welfare issue and insist that they find out when a judge will be able to hear from you.

Most cases aren't heard at court until 10.30am at the earliest so that's why you want to get there early.

You will hopefully be heard by a judge for about 10 mins - this is your time to convince the judge why your case is urgent. You should prepare a 1 page with some bullet points to remind you of your application

i.e.

• why you are making this application to court
• why the judge should consider it an emergency
• what has brought you here today

You should say to the judge that you wish to make an application, you have your completed C1 form and you request Abridged Service (so that the court hearing is brought forward and can be heard in 10 days rather than listed for the usual 4-6 weeks)

• is there are a residence order in place or is it just a contact order at present.

• as the ex has made it clear her intention is move to scotland you will have to try and work out good reasons (to a judge) why she should not move
• bearing in mind that most moves are granted, you will have to present to the judge why, in the child's best interests, with reference to the welfare checklist in section 1 of the children act (1989)

www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts1989/ukpga_19890041_en_2#pt1-l1g1

To quote from CA (1989);

1 Welfare of the child

(1) When a court determines any question with respect to?

(a) the upbringing of a child; or

(b) the administration of a child?s property or the application of any income arising from it,

the child?s welfare shall be the court?s paramount consideration.

(2) In any proceedings in which any question with respect to the upbringing of a child arises, the court shall have regard to the general principle that any delay in determining the question is likely to prejudice the welfare of the child.

(3) In the circumstances mentioned in subsection (4), a court shall have regard in particular to?

(a) the ascertainable wishes and feelings of the child concerned (considered in the light of his age and understanding);

(b) his physical, emotional and educational needs;

(c) the likely effect on him of any change in his circumstances;

(d) his age, sex, background and any characteristics of his which the court considers relevant;

(e) any harm which he has suffered or is at risk of suffering;

(f) how capable each of his parents, and any other person in relation to whom the court considers the question to be relevant, is of meeting his needs;

(g) the range of powers available to the court under this Act in the proceedings in question.

... it could be argued that (b) + (c) applies - as the child's education is likely to be disrupted (although the judge may say that as the ex has already investigated schools and seems to have enrolled her in one she will be starting a new school year in a new school in scotland!)

... the child's circumstances are going to be disrupted rather drastically. She will be moved to another jurisdiction (scotland), away from her father and extended paternal family, especially her siblings (do you and your DH have children together or are there stepchildren)

... is there any good reason why this move should happen? What is the ex going to do for work/accommodation? These are the questions you need to ask.

I would be tempted to seek immediate legal advice - get to see some local family solicitors who will do a free initial 1/2 hour consultation first too, but get that emergency application in NOW

The longer you delay the more risk you take that the ex will just skip off to scotland.