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10 year old lied about her dad, now we can’t see her.

53 replies

Humbledmum · 23/11/2024 12:19

Hello

This is my first post and I’m really needing some support.

Last week we had my partners daughters over for the night - They are 11 and 10 and our routine is they stay with us 2-3 nights per week on a set weekend rotation.

I have two older girls at home, who are at uni and sixth form. Two kind and chilled kids who have their own life and a great relationship with their father and step mum.

My partner and I have lived together for five years, he moved in with me and our arrangement with his children was agreed via a court order after difficult contact barriers with their mum.

His children are two lovely, and firey wild girls who are very different to how mine were at that age… They can be quite fierce and mischievous at times and can often (or always) be quite reluctant to taking any responsibility, as a member of the family, or for themselves. For instance, they will simply refuse to help out in the house by cleaning their room, or picking up their clothes, or brushing their teeth, or taking showers. They are very confident to say “no” and mean no!

Now that they are getting a bit older, it is not uncommon for us to pick them up from school and they smell quite strongly of B.O, or their hair is matted and greasy. Personal hygiene is one of the biggest battles we have with the girls, (and I say “battles” lightly, as you will understand in a moment)

(Before I continue, I’d like to just add that we have tried all kinds of gentle conversations about personal hygiene. We have bought lovely bath and shower items to encourage and tried to set a bath/shower and bed routine etc etc etc)

Anyway, so last week the 10yo was asked if she’d like to take her shower first, or second. She said neither and told us she’d had a shower yesterday at her mums (they don’t bath or shower at their mums and after he text to ask, she had told us she hadn’t)

Her and her father got into a bit of back and forth about not telling lies and his daughter started getting so angry with him, screaming that she hated him and he was a lier and everyone just lies to make her do things. He said “okay, take this up with your mum” and asked her to call her.

She then argued with her mum for about 20 mins, begged her mum to come and get her because she hated it here and she felt scared and unsafe, and when her mum refused she told her mum that her dad had grabbed her, threw her and really hurt her. This did not happen, but of course mum had no choice but to come and remove her and her sister from our house. I think I would have done the same had one of my children ever said this to me.

This is not the first time an extreme lie has been used to get mum to pick them up. There has been a few occasions where they have told mum we have tried to hurt them, usually after they have been in trouble for something.
They have also accused teachers and other kids of inappropriate behaviour in an attempt to get out of trouble.

This makes it really hard for us to ask anything of them. Because of their reluctance to do anything or take any responsibility, and their extreme efforts to get out of things, their father is quite terrified of their mum stopping him from seeing them. (Which has happened with her other children and their father)

Their mum has now said she doesn’t want the girls returning to our home as they feel unsafe here with us and she’s happy to take us to court if it comes to it. This is a regular threat, but you never know when she’s going to stick to it)

Please help. I don’t know what we are supposed to do. In this situation, and how to manage the girls when they are allowed back.

My home used to be such a calm and positive environment when my girls where growling up, but it’s so hard to maintain that in this situation.

Thanks for reading.

OP posts:
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BeMintBee · 23/11/2024 22:57

Wonderi · 23/11/2024 22:48

He said “okay, take this up with your mum” and asked her to call her.

Why did he ask her to ring her mum.

He is their parent just as much as the mum is and of course ringing the mum is going to escalate it.

The mum wouldn’t be now trying to stop contact if he had just parented his own child.

I was wondering why he passed the buck and escalated the situation. Sound like these girls have no consistency from either parent.

As others have mentioned there is a lot to be concerned about here and both parents are failing them by not getting to the route of these frequent accusations

Foodie333 · 23/11/2024 23:00

Singleandproud · 23/11/2024 15:40

Let it settle, the girls are bound to fall out with mum and wants back to yours. When that happens I'd pick them up with their swimming stuff and go straight to the pool. Even if they don't wash the chlorine will do it's job.

I'd be concerned about the underlying cause though, most children don't happily go around smelling for no reason. Sometimes it's because of sensory issues, sometimes it's through trauma so perhaps unresolved things from the divorce or their younger years, sometimes it's because they feel 'safer' dirty and that can be a sign of SA. Either way with the personal hygiene issues and the lying then child needs a GP visit and a therapist to work through whatever she's struggling with.

Agree 110%
and do wonder how these girls are perceived at school, by peers, staff, other parents. I would imagine they are not welcome many places.

The combative, odious behavior is maybe a way to keep people away so they don’t get rejected.

Reject everyone before they can hurt you with rejection.

Their mum has a lot of responsibility for current situation, if not 100% responsibility.

Agree, back off, let mum & girls have their power & control right now. But be sure girls know they are loved and accepted.

AllYearsAround · 23/11/2024 23:00

Counselling maybe? Sounds like they could benefit from having someone outside the situation to talk to?

Orangewinegum8481 · 23/11/2024 23:13

Does their mother have another partner?

Greyrocked · 23/11/2024 23:19

I’d be worried about neurodiversity/sensory issues or sexual abuse by someone else.

Theunamedcat · 23/11/2024 23:19

The mum should have just collected her when she asked she clearly wanted to go home she shouldn't have felt the need to lie just to get attention

Theunamedcat · 23/11/2024 23:21

Also speak to the school about the hygiene issues

sunflowersngunpowdr · 23/11/2024 23:21

A lot of "We's" and "our's" in there. Maybe you step back and detach yourself from your boyfriend's issues with his kids.

Floralnomad · 23/11/2024 23:24

Your partner needs to go back to court and get supervised contact , you should stay well away .

Bobbybobbins · 23/11/2024 23:32

Lots going on here, clearly some very troubling behaviour from the girls, some suggestions of neglect/abuse. I would encourage your partner to communicate with the school.

PrawnAgain · 23/11/2024 23:46

Theunamedcat · 23/11/2024 23:19

The mum should have just collected her when she asked she clearly wanted to go home she shouldn't have felt the need to lie just to get attention

I agree with this. DSDs have always been free to go between houses as they please as long as a parent was there to look after them (remembering when 14 year old dsd declared she would stay alone at her mums while her she her step dad went away with her younger sister coming here - hard no).

Why did she have to lie to her mum to go back there?

CarrotsAndCheese · 24/11/2024 00:00

Octavia64 · 23/11/2024 18:02

You have bigger issues here than just not washing.

In cases where children have been abused it is quite common for them to make accusations but not necessarily against the person who actually is doing it.

They want help but are too scared of the abuser to name them.

This, combined with the not washing (also common on abused children as they "feel dirty") would have my alarms going off.

I would be extremely concerned that someone is abusing them,

I would in this situation absolutely back off from making them wash.

Buy dry shampoo/body wipes if you have to.

I would prioritise finding out what is going on, and would be working on the assumption one or both is being abused.

I'm afraid I think this post is probably bang on the money. Obviously, it's best to have supervised visits now, to protect yourselves, while the children are helped with some sort of therapy to get to the bottom of what's causing their behaviour.

M3ganne · 24/11/2024 00:13

How do you know these claims about your DH are lies?

The problem is that 80% of what they say could be lies and 20% the truth BUT because there are so so so many lies it’s hard to believe them when they tell the truth. The boy who cried wolf I guess

Tittat50 · 24/11/2024 00:13

Greyrocked · 23/11/2024 23:19

I’d be worried about neurodiversity/sensory issues or sexual abuse by someone else.

I came here to say this. It isn't just a problem with washing you mention, there's the aversion to teeth brushing and being wild and an eagerness to say no to everything.

Before I get ripped a new arsehole by those who have no experience - this sounds incredibly like sensory issues. It is incredibly common with many I know including my own child to absolutely hate showers and teeth brushing to the point they will avoid at all costs. The overwhelming desire to say no to everything; seeming to be wild and chaotic - that's my son; Autistic (PDA).

There may be SA here, but I think it's important to consider all possibilities.

Appreciate the above doesn't solve the problem you're having though. Hope some resolution can be arrived at. So dangerous to be accused of things like that by kids.

ContactNightmare · 24/11/2024 00:15

How disturbing. I am worried for these children. Some of the comments here about them are repellent.

OnlyinBlackandWhite · 24/11/2024 00:21

I don't have any advice on the step-parenting front, except I would protect yourself and your daughters from any further allegations, they can't come unsupervised to your house.

On the washing front, this is very common I think with 10-11 year old girls as they hit pubertal development earlier these days than in the past (only prior to age 8 is it considered early onset now) so they have a longer time when they are growing up and starting to have body odour before they start their periods. Both mine were soap-dodgers at this age, they just didn't see the point, whereas once they were 12/13 and interested in attracting others, they realised that having nice hair and not smelling was the way to go. I think 10/11 is a very tricky age for girls.

Bitethehandthatfeeds · 24/11/2024 00:24

This is dreadful, don't have them in your home as before you know it you and your daughters will be accused. He sees them outside of your home and that's it. Sorry this is happening to you

ImustLearn2Cook · 24/11/2024 00:32

Looks like all the adults need to get together and come up with a plan on how to respond to these lies, back each other up and respond consistently each and every time. They will soon learn that they can not get away with this behaviour.

As a mum of course safeguarding my dc is a priority. However, lying and making these kinds of false allegations is not tolerated. In this situation I would have responded to my dd’s by saying that I need to check them for bruises and injuries. I can’t see any bruises or swelling or red marks or signs of injury. Surely if a man grabbed you and threw you against the wall you would have been injured. I would reiterate the importance of honesty, remind them that telling these lies would put them at risk of not being believed in future when they are telling the truth. Just like in the story The Boy who Cried Wolf. I would not give in to their demands to come back with me. I would get their version and dad’s version then back him up. Yes, you do need to have a shower and wash. I agree with your dad and stepmom on this. As for them telling these lies about teachers, both parents back up the teachers and the school rules.

When children successfully pit adults against each other they give themselves an advantage. When adults back each other up and take a united front then they have the advantage.

drspouse · 24/11/2024 00:32

To add to the potential sensory issues I would say maybe there is a shame issue - my DD had a bowel problem and hid any pants she had an accident in, and got very stroppy about it, because she didn't want to admit she'd done it. I can imagine this happening around developing in puberty too.

TinySmol · 24/11/2024 00:53

I wouldn't have them in the house again.

Marblesbackagain · 24/11/2024 01:45

LakeUtah · 23/11/2024 22:15

I wouldn’t worry about them coming over, they sound like horrible unhygienic smelly liars. Your house will be better without them around. They can get you and your DH in serious trouble.

The mum will soon get bored of them misbehaving and send them back around.

Seriously I really hope you are not where near children with that attitude.

We are talking about innocent children who obviously re being filed somewhere and that's your take , hang your head in shame.

Disgusting excuse of a human being victim blaming children.

caringcarer · 24/11/2024 01:46

MsCactus · 23/11/2024 17:23

I think you should ask for supervised contact. Even just to protect your DH against false accusations. You need a third party there

This and I'd also report to SS as being neglected as both not bathing and wearing dirty clothes. If they are allowed to continue not to shower, wash their hair or wear clean clothing other children will exclude them and even bully/laugh at them or call them names.

Bakedpotatoes · 24/11/2024 08:54

LakeUtah · 23/11/2024 22:15

I wouldn’t worry about them coming over, they sound like horrible unhygienic smelly liars. Your house will be better without them around. They can get you and your DH in serious trouble.

The mum will soon get bored of them misbehaving and send them back around.

This is a vile way to talk about quite obviously troubled children. Reported.

socks1107 · 24/11/2024 09:11

I've been here unfortunately. It's a hard place to be.
Some of the accusations we found out about after by accident and mum clearly didn't believe her either as she was still allowing her over. The lies and accusations were made about mum too and school teachers over the years. She also had Arbil personal hygiene and we tried everything like you, she was isolated at school and no one wanted to sit with her probably because she smelt so bad.
We are no contact now, she's an adult and I won't ever really be comfortable around her again. I refused to be alone with her at all for a few years prior to final things that caused no contact.

StraighttoCrone · 24/11/2024 09:23

I don’t think it is fair to compare them to your daughters because they have obviously had different upbringings. Also have you ever considered that they might have been exposed to some hostile scenes between your DH and their mum which causes them to panic and want to escape?

Your DH and his ex need to be united on this and come up with a plan to manage the lying and support their children. Sometimes kids do this when they feel pressured to come up with an answer without realising the implications or consequences of their actions and especially when parents are not united. One thing I learned from mumsnet was to ease up on questioning and instead just keep it light so instead of asking if they have showered (because the answer will inevitably either be a lie or not one that you want) just say once you have showered and changed we will do ( treat that they enjoy like pizza or movie). If they don’t do the thing then don’t make a fuss but just don’t follow through on the treat part.

In this case they do need to know the consequences of their lies- your DH could write a letter or explain to them (with mum present) that because of this lie he cannot now see them unsupervised. Let them know that there are consequences but that things can be fixed once they are ready. He could tell them what he expects from them re:washing and that this is for their benefit and that he is always going to be there and love them when they are ready to come home. You can not force them to return in these circumstances because it will only get their backs up and they will resist/lie again.