Passports for SC

[PeeAche2]

My husband and his ex wife are not on friendly terms.

We usually holiday abroad but she does not as she doesn't like to travel. So because only we use them, my husband pays for the kid's passports when they need renewing.

The court order says that the passports must be kept by the mother and so usually this means my husband sends her the money for the renewal. The court order does not say that father isn't allowed to renew the passports or that mother may prevent father from taking the children abroad. The CO does expressly say that the father may take the children abroad whenever he pleases, as long as mother knows where they are and it's during his contact time.

This year one of the passports needs renewing and mum is refusing. As I understand it, anybody with parental responsibility can apply. But I also read that a RP can block the application if they wish.

Does anyone have any experience with this? Husband has no problem with doing the application himself but, as we've already lost the money that mum has pocketed, it would be an awful blow if this application is cancelled too. It would also mean my SD can't come on the holiday which would spoil it for the whole family.

A few years ago, mum reported the passports as stolen while we were mid-trip and they were confiscated at the airport on the way home. My husband had to report to the police station with a copy of the CO and evidence that mum had posted us the passports herself. So, I don't exactly think this will go smoothly... 🤦🏻‍♀️

Is it true that anyone with parental responsibility can apply for a passport and, can RP block application / cancel the passport if she wishes?

Nb: nope, we can't apply secretly and keep the passport for ourselves because this contravenes the CO. My husband is far too anxious and rule abiding to do that, even for a few months.

Thanks.

1. Apply for the passports to your address

1. Get a variance on the court order to say the passports reside with you citing all the reasons you've given here.

You will need mothers details to apply for one, and yes I believe she could block it.

Why a parent would do this I don't know but there we go. Some people are like this!

I agree you need to go back to court to get the court to approve him applying and sorting the passport and the fact she has to comply. And apply for the order to vary that you keep them due to what's stated above. Doesn't stop her reporting them stolen again though! But if you have the CO to back it all up you should be ok.

Honestly how could she deprive her kids from going on holiday. So selfish

I obviously do agree with this. But I've come to know her fairly well and I understand that she doesn't see it as deprivation because she doesn't like travelling herself and just doesn't "get" it. She genuinely thinks her children would be better off at home. And obviously she knows that if we go without her, my husband will have to forfeit his contact days for that week.

I'm not saying it's logical, but I do try to understand her position and motivations.

I find it very difficult to believe any court would give a variation to a CO that "favours" the father. Even if it is actually better for the children.

In any case, this won't be resolved before August so I think I got my answer! 🤦🏻‍♀️ TY.xxx

I think the passport office are inundated. I wonder if you would get it in time. The way I think is I want my daughter to experience things I never had as a child. X

Sadly yes the Mother could cancel the passport. You will need Mothers details to apply as well. I think rather than a variation to the CAO you may want to consider enforcement of the order. The passports are being used by Mum to frustrate contact as per the CAO - i.e. Dad is allowed to take kids on holiday but this requires Mum (who holds the passports) to cooperate on the passports and ensure they remain in date. Indirectly she's breaching the order by refusing to renew them. The court will not accept her view that it's no hardship - it is the mother is depriving the child of an experience with her Father. Whether she sees it as 'missing out' or not doesn't matter, that's about her and not the children - I mean I loathe travelling abroad but I can see the benefit for my child to go on holiday with her Father.

I mean who does this to their kids.....?

You put the mothers details on the passport application but you don't need her permission to apply. You may need to send the child's birth certificate to show you have PR and are entitled to apply for it

When I apply for my dcs passports my dh doesn't get notified about it even though I provide his details on the application.

It’s really unfair in the way that apparently mothers can apply for a new passport no questions asked. Not fathers though. I’ve got 3 dc and applied for their first passports and until recently applied for every single renewal on my own, I didn’t have an issue with any of them and my oh didn’t have to get involved at all. Recently though my oh tried to apply for a renewal for one of the children, the passport office refused to allow him. They actually contacted me and asked me to come to the office. When I refused (I literally couldn’t get there) and said this was discriminatory, they said they’d allow him to apply but I literally had to write, sign and screenshot and send them a letter saying I give him my permission.

If he's on the birth certificate then surely he has PR for them? Does sound discriminatory

While I appreciate the situation some people don't want to nor wish their children to travel. How does a UK court decide ? Just interested as in Ireland we are at the start of this legal minefield. I can see similar issues ahead

We have some experience of this. When DH's ex tried to report the kids passports as lost, the passport office called DH to ask whether he had them, and of course he did. She was only doing it to be spiteful. The reason they called him was that he was the one who took out the passports so she couldn't automatically cancel/reapply, in answer to your question.

They put a note on the account to say that she'd done this and that if she does it again, to always call DH to verify before cancelling.

I know this is slightly different but hope it gives some reassurance that she can't call all the shots.

@Marblessolveeverything both parents have to appear in person with the child/children at their local Garda station when applying or renewing a minors passport & both have to sign the application. Sorry if I'm stating what you already know.
You can have a clause stating both parties will agree to children being allowed passports and travel written in to a separation or divorce agreement.

@Magda72 Thank you I am at the beginning so that is helpful. Conscious there appears to be very little case law here.

Your husband can apply for ppt if he has parental responsibility.
however if the children's mum applied for them previously- so ‘signed’ by her your husband will need to prove pr - if he is on the bc it can be done this way.

you are quite right though the other person can attempt to block the application.