Sayings a child wouldn't say

[Lucky34]

Hi

I'm a step mum to a 10year old DSD and have my own DD (6). The ex has never been receptive to us or my DD and we have had to & still continue to persevere to have the agreed contact time. Holidays are still a nightmare ....

The DSD is very much coached that mummy's team is the best & we just need to be tolerated (that is until we are needed when DSD is ill, home schooling etc). I've always taken the approach that our home is DSD home & they are not a guest & they are our family. They are told not to tell us what happens at their home but we know fine well DSD is interrogated on return from our home.

My issue comes when I hear sayings/statements/threats said by DSD to either myself or ex or both & it's obvious they have overheard it or it's been said to them. Obviously outwardly I try to act like normal but inwardly it really infuriates me & I think about it for days or weeks.

I just can't understand why you would want your child to say such mean/vindictive or nasty things to their other family.

We've tried to address it by saying we don't want to hear that in our home, addressing it with the ex (pointless & I actually think she garners some joy hearing about it), ignoring it, trying to inform the inaccuracies or the fact it's not nice because..... all has had limited success.

I guess I'm asking is how do you deal with it? I can't be the only person experiencing this & maybe someone is doing something ive not thought about.

I know the common sense approach is to just ignore.... but I don't want my DD to be impacted by hearing these comments, also they are untrue & hurtful & I don't think I should accept that in my home. The main outcome is that I'm finding I'm just retreating from DSD and I know it's not their "fault" but that's just the reality.

Thanks for reading if you got this far

[quote Getyourarseofffthequattro]@candles1298 I'm sorry but frankly that's bollocks. I think it's fairly obvious what's happening here, op clearly isn't stupid is she?

You've clearly no experience of this so why you'd think you know better than op whom is actually living with this situation is beyond me.[/quote]
I have experience if my Dd telling her dad she doesn't want to visit.
She tells him that when she's old enough she will no longer be going. She also says things like "I only need to be here for x days then I will have x days with mum mum" and I can say with complete honesty that none of that has ever come from me

@candles1298

*If this was my DD I would be horrified and be addressing the issue. Lord knows people make enough excuses for bad behaviour and wonder why they grow up and struggle in the real world.

If a child gets used to playing games between parents, what do you think they will do as adults ? Hardly a Stella quality in a adult surely.*

Or maybe the OPs DH should try and get to the bottom of why his DD doesn't want to spend time with him and his family instead of dismissing it as rudeness

My own Dd probably behaves similarly and I don't actually blame her given the situation at her dads. Other than gentle encouragement to spend time with him I stay out of it as it's for him to sort. However the years I've been accused of turning Dd against him.

It's always easier to blame the mother than it is to actually sit down and face the fact he could possibly have played a role in the that his child may not want to spend time with him and his new family

I mean we will have to agree to disagree.

As I previously mentioned as a parent I would be showing my DD how to appropriately display her upset/anger (if she indeed was acting out as some form of unresolved hurt) and not ignore it or encourage it because that's not what is best for my child. I am responsible for helping my child to manage her emotions in a healthy way and I don't think encouraging/ignoring rudeness (even if deserved, which we do not know that's the case here) is a good form of parenting

Any parent who does this (in my opinion) is allowing their own emotions to influence how they parent and side step what they need to do for the best of the child. It's not the greatest form of parenting in my view and yes my ex cheated and shacked up with OW so in theory I could wash my hands of it but you know it's not gonna help my Dd in long run...

So because your daughter doesn't like her dad, ops mustn't either. Okay

Thank you for some of the tips on dealing with comments & hurtful sayings.

I purposely asked about how to deal with comments/sayings that you are perfectly aware a child would not come up with or say themselves.

We are obviously still dealing with the challenges faced with step families when the parents are unable to co-parent in a civil manner & there is no communication.

The relationship between my DH & DSD is actually very good but he can go a bit "Disney Dad" to overcome the negativity that we "hear" from DSD.

I find that DSD is more settled & natural when we have her for longer periods of time (holidays/long weekends). I also find that this is when the ex seems more disruptive and all of a sudden we get challenging behaviours & like I say .... hear comments that she wouldn't normally say.

I appreciate the comment about not saying "in our house" because you are right, I am then comparing and that is what I'm trying to avoid.

I think step mums are an easy target at times and the tips on how to rise above it and productively deal with it has been very helpful.

@Getyourarseofffthequattro

So because your daughter doesn't like her dad, ops mustn't either. Okay

I didn't say that. I said there is nothing to indicate that it definitely is coming from the mum. It is possible for a 10'yo to say those things without coaching (and I know from experience as my 8 yo says similar)

Of course it's possible @candles1298 but I assume op knows this girl better than you do.

Even though your daughter is uncoached, I'm surprised that you're happy that she is acgively rude to her dad. I wouldn't tolerate that personally.

@Getyourarseofffthequattro

Of course it's possible *@candles1298* but I assume op knows this girl better than you do.

Even though your daughter is uncoached, I'm surprised that you're happy that she is acgively rude to her dad. I wouldn't tolerate that personally.

I wouldn't say she's rude to her dad. She's being honest about her feelings and emotions - which given his parenting don't seem unjustified

I've been there.

As one example I'd get
You're not a piggy are you? Mummy says you are but I love you.

We knew that whatever we did during contact something would be wrong. 30-40mins after drop off DH would get a call and be told off about something. Things like using public toilets if we were out, s dirty mark on clothes, taking SC somewhere mother didn't like.

We tried so many things- we had clothes so we could change her from the white tracksuits etc SC came in and not worry about getting them dirty etc. we ignored anything negative and made a joke out of other stuff.

SC would get so upset at home time. We knew they would be getting interrogated about every aspect of their time with us.

As they got older mothers attitude started to change the SC personality and attitude towards us. Sc was becoming more and more rude. We had children by this point and sc had choices to spend time with dad alone, with siblings, as a family or with me and DH together.

It was exhausting.

Unfortunately the alienation worked and when dc was about 13 refused to come over anymore. We haven't seen them in years.

I'm not sure based on those specific comments that I'd take it she's being coached, but you know her/her mum obviously, so maybe she is. To me, they sound like a child who is playing one parent off against the other.

I love the way you speak about her (I wish my DS's stepmum spoke like you!), but she is treated differently to her sister as she doesn't live with her Dad all of the time. There's diddly squat you can do about it, but that's a fact of her life, and this might be her playing up a bit about it. My DS was an absolute little sod at that age and used to say horrible stuff to me and his Dad (we were separated). It needs nipping in the bud though as none of you should have to put up with that, and like you say you don't want your DD picking up on it and thinking it's alright!

Sorry I don't have any advice for you as it's a tough one to deal with, if she's just trying to manage her own feelings then you don't want her to feel she's not entitled to be trying to have those feelings - she just needs to find a way to deal with them IYSWIM, but hope it's a short phase and she'll grow out of it and start being a bit more pleasant...

It took ex and I a while to get it sorted, a bit of gentle "we know it's tricky, but you need to find a nicer way to say you aren't happy" kind of thing. In the end we contacted school and they helped with a bit of pastoral care (ELSA I think it's called) which gave him chance to talk about his feelings.

Obviously this could all be irrelevant, and she could just be being a bit of a madam

Good luck!

Ok so had a think about this thread.

Disclaimer is my SD is non NT so she says some things that can be considered v rude so this advice may not fit perfectly but. So Often she parrots rude/horrible things and watches to see what reaction she gets without really getting the social implications of her words. She does this to everyone btw - school was nightmare as she consistently doing this at school.

I have often found when I sit down with her or in the moment saying. That's not very kind thing to say, if I said that to you how would you feel, and would you then want to do x with me because I had made you feel bad. Making her walk in the shoes of the person she's hurt is often a good way to build empathy. Some kids just don't make the leap into why they should be nice without having it spelt out.

Often children say things without the context or knowing the consequences past getting a reaction or the impact those words will have on the relationship .

It's worth while doing this repeatedly and both you and DH will have to be a united front on it. Now DSD tells other kids not to say xyz because it's hurtful and they will be less likely to be treated/will lose privileges if they do.

The only other advice I can give comes from my mother and I suspect probably born of the situation we grew up in. I would repeatedly tell ask her why she was so nice to my step sister (the one I mentioned previously) and she said that when someone's repeatedly unkind they often need the most kindness. I didn't get it at aged 5 when me and her had a typical sibling fight. But now I get it, because in essence all my sister was doing was mirroring the level of kindness she got with her mum, and my mum knew she would grow out of it eventually.

Although as I said teenage years were tough 😵‍💫 but she did come around.

It's really awful to see that in hindsight, that's not the common pattern that plays out most of the time.

If in doubt wine helps ! Xx

@candles1298 no, saying I've got x days with you and then I don't have to see you for x days is rude. Whatever way you dress it up, it's rude. If you're okay with your daughter being rude, fine. I wouldn't be.

I’ve been there and it’s not a nice place to be. It’s the start of parental alienation and if it isn’t nipped in the bud it will get worse.

Some examples in our case. The children aren’t allowed to call their dad ‘dad’. They are only allowed to refer to him as ‘him’. I am only allowed to be called ‘her’. Apparently the only time the word dad or daddy is used in their house a when mummy says ‘daddy is a pathetic excuse for a father’.

Christmas or birthdays the children aren’t allowed to take any of their presents home to mums as it upsets her so she throws them away.

Whenever the children visited they were integrated post visit. A vitriolic email word ten follow about something inconsequential mum wasn’t happy about.

As the oldest got older and the poison dripped in her ear for longer it got unbearable. She clearly didn’t want to come, despite being asked and always saying she did. The turning point was was when she was 15 and her phone was taken off her for bad behaviour and her dad discovered she had been taking photos of our personal paperwork and breaking into her dads phone & taking screen shots of personal messages between the 2 of us and sending them to her mum (because mummy asked her).

In our case the alienation worked. This was despite social services getting involved and the kids having counselling in school. The oldest (now 16) refuses to visit and won’t speak to her dad. Because apparently everything is his fault.

It’s exhausting. It’s also very sad that a mother can hate their ex more than they love their own children and use them as a pawn to punish them.

Good luck.

I think given DSD is being coached, I'd try reverse psychology or a different tac. So if she says 'wait till I'm older'. Smile & say something like 'ooh growing up is so exciting, so what would you do then when you are older, what do you think, what could we do differently?'. Not as a challenge but as conversation.

That way she knows you won't react to it & you're interested in her opinion. Right now, she won't appreciate what you're doing but later she'll see you chatted to her about & Mum told her what to say.

This is a child that does not feel happy or comfortable at your house

@NdefH81

This is a child that does not feel happy or comfortable at your house

Rubbish. The child's caught between a rock & a hard place. OP is trying to create a neutral environment & Mum is causing the disruption.

* I don't want to dislike the child either & I do try to rise above but I'm just finding it harder to turn the other cheek! *

How have you been with your partner?

How often do you have her over?

* I'm starting to see the development of a vindictive and manipulative child, coached by her mother*

Your other post today on another thread. A slightly different tone to this one

@NdefH81

* I'm starting to see the development of a vindictive and manipulative child, coached by her mother*

Your other post today on another thread. A slightly different tone to this one

But that's literally what she's saying here. Have you got anything useful to say or?

[quote Getyourarseofffthequattro]@candles1298 no, saying I've got x days with you and then I don't have to see you for x days is rude. Whatever way you dress it up, it's rude. If you're okay with your daughter being rude, fine. I wouldn't be.[/quote]
In response to the situation she's in I think it's merited. Are kids supposed to be excited to spend time with a parent regardless of how they are treated?

@NdefH81

* I'm starting to see the development of a vindictive and manipulative child, coached by her mother*

Your other post today on another thread. A slightly different tone to this one

I'm not sure what point you are trying to prove because I've been quite upfront that I'm finding it challenging being in the company of my DSD when I find her saying things that I sense are coming from her mother.

What is different in the two posts?

@NdefH81

This is a child that does not feel happy or comfortable at your house

Are you a step mother?

What situation is that @candles1298?

There is a big difference between excited and rude and many opinions in the middle. She doesn't have to be excited, but there's no need to be rude. And it's a shit parent that allows it.

No thank goodness. single parent for 5 years. Enjoy dating but the idea of bringing a man in to my childrens home or having to deal with children that are t mine sharing my home?

No chance

And if I didn’t think that before joining mumsnet, I sure as heck do now after reading all the unhappy threads from both sides
And that isn’t even inc the children involved