Manners....

[BlueLights22]

Hi,

Long story short my partner of 3 years has 7 year old girl (8 next month) who I have a great relationship with and for the most part love spending time with, however she is severely lacking in the manners department....
As a few examples: yesterday it was my partners birthday and we went out for lunch to a country pub, Instant tears because there was no play area.
She barely ever says please or thankyou of her own volition but does when she is reminded.
Her dad told her she could have some pocket money for Easter instead of an egg as she isn't keen and she has asked where the money is today....
I took her to.the park over the weekend and have bought various treats/taken her places during the holidays with no thankyiu.
Just general behaviours like this which I find hard to witness because I know that if this was my own child I would be trying to nip this in the bud! I DO NOT discipline her at all and act only as a friend towards her, if I have an issue with anything I tell my partner and let him deal with it as I don't feel it's my place to be parenting her however I do not want this behaviour to escalate into something that causes a rift between myself and the little one or myself and partner. I think part of the problem is because he has her only 50 percent of the time he doesn't want to spend the time telling her off and because he doesn't act as it is happening it doesn't really have much effect however I fear this will only get worse if this is the attitude.
My question is how am I best to deal with this without telling her off or coming across as attempting to parent her? I really want to do my best for everyone but it's tough to know your place in being able to say anything!!

She sounds like a normal 7yo tbh. Do you have any children of your own? I'm guessing not.

No I don't which is why I've taken to asking for advice on here from people who do. From reading on other forums on here it's also a no no for a non parent to do any form of parenting/discipline so when I am looking after her on occasion what am I best to do about this behaviour? Because surely just taking it isn't a responsible option and if parent was present they would be dealing with it?

If you can’t discipline her, either because you don’t want to or because your DP wouldn’t back you up, then you can’t have time with her on your own. That would be the case if she was your SD, your niece, a friend’s child.

There are as many different views on this as there are people but I’m a parent figure to my DSC, I do all the parent stuff as they were little when we got together, DH supports me completely and it’s what works for all of us. 50% of the time is plenty to have “real life” rather than Disney parenting. But it’s up to your DP if he wants to be a laidback lax good time dad instead of a dad who wants to help his child grow into a pleasant well rounded person who is lovely to be around. I don’t agree at all that it’s normal for a 7 year old to never say please or thank you. I don’t have a clue what my DSC are like at mum’s but DH and I say please and thank you to each other and to the DC and expect the same back. I think a lot of it is modelling the behaviour you want your DC to have and when I cook DH says thank you and my DSC do the same. If he does stuff for them and they forget I say, with a smile, let’s thank dad for xxx and they do. That’s just day to day stuff so when we have a special day out or give gifts etc appreciation is taken for granted!

But as above, if your DP doesn’t care there’s not much you can do about it as you have to let him take the lead and you’ll be banging your head against a brick wall and create ructions if you try it by yourself.

None of my business but if having children together is on the cards, you need to be very sure the way he parents is in line with own views because it won’t go well if he’s a committed Disney dad to DSD and will either take the same annoying approach to subsequent DC or he’ll treat them more harshly as they’ll be there ft while DSD gets special treatment because she doesn’t.

1. There is no “only” about 50:50 care. Who does he think will be parenting his child, including the not so fun bits, if not him?
2. You don’t owe DSD anything. She needs to understand this. You might buy her treats or take her fun places if you want too, but nobody owes her these things. No please/no thank you/no treats.

I had a chat to the above effect with my similar aged DSD when I got fed up of the lack of manners, whinging and whining for more all the time. I stuck by what I said and she gets it now, we are the best of friends and have a lovely time together. She is a lovely natured child anyway though, so can’t take all the credit! Standards of behaviour just weren’t being set for her by her parents. I told DP I wouldn’t get involved in any parenting as such, but I would NOT accept cheek and bad manners towards me. Which I think is fair enough. He gets it now, too.

My DSD never says thank you for all those things; it does grate on me at Christmas and birthday but as otherwise she’s a lovely child I try not to let it get to me.
It’s up to her dad to instill it in her asking if she’s said thank you and reminding her. That’s not telling her off and is just a general part of parenting.
I’ve been involved in DSDs life for 6 years now and I will tell her off if DH isn’t there but when he’s there I see that as his role to be honest. We’ll talk about how to address a behaviour and I might address something from there but I don’t want to take over the parenting role from him

I had this initially with DP's daughter, buy have always insisted my dc say please and thank you. Eventually it rubbed off on her, probably because she saw them doing it and being reminded when they didn't.

I have two DSDs. They’re nice enough kids but even at age 13 and 15 we still struggle to get “please” and “thank you”. It’s always been a problem. My 2 year old has better manners.

I pull my 9 YO DSD up on manners. There’s no excuse for not saying please and thank you especially at that age!

My DD is 4 and I’ve always made a point of making sure she says please and thank you and making sure she’s grateful.

I have a niece whose 10 and she’s never said please or thank you 😬 drives me crazy. She has more meltdowns and tantrums than a 2 year old of age doesn’t get her own way. By not disciplining her, you’re doing her no favours.

The only thing worse than a spoilt, rude child is a spoilt, rude adult.

Manners are just cultural expectations, they're not in built-in. You don't know you're supposed to have them unless you're taught them. If he has never taught her manners, she won't know she is coming across as rude. How could she know if she isn't taught?

Agree with others who suggest saying please and thank you to each other to set a good example.

To be honest she sounds like a normal 7 yo. They need reminding at that age. You hand them something and if they don't say thank you, the normal response from a parent is "what do you say?" ...that usually prompts a thank you reply from them.

It's very normal of her to ask for the money on Easter Sunday, as that was promised.

When you got all the treats for her, you should have prompted a thank you as described above...or another thing is to say "what's the magic word?" .

Children forget easily at that age and it's not uncommon to remind them multiple times in a day.

With my own DC, when they were younger, I would often warn them in advance, especially on their birthdays to remember to thank uncles and aunts for gifts as soon as they receive them.

My DC sometimes say I don't give them a minute to breath before they say thanks.

I can assure you having volunteered with kids that age and having my own, she is normal. Just keep reminding her with those 2 phrases.

I think it's very important for children that age to have manners. But, you know, it needs to be taught otherwise how are they to know?

I have two DSCs (4yo and 7yo) and DH and I have been trying hard for months to get them to say please and thankyou. Their mum is doing the same when they are with her. Our approach has been : 1) first we tried a 3-minute rule, where if they asked for something and didn't say please, they had to wait for 3 minutes and then ask again, nicely the second time. 2) this worked a little, but they were still lacking, and we had told them ENOUGH TIMES over the weeks/months... so now they don't get what they want full stop. E.g. 4yo says "I want my bracelet on" and I say "sorry, you didn't say please, so no bracelet" .. this way they understand the consequences and are slowly but surely learning/remembering. We also make fun of them sometimes, e.g. when they say in a whingy voice "I'm thiiirrrstyyyy..", we say "Oh that's nice, thankyou for letting me know", until they ask in a polite way if we can please get them a drink.

My advice would be - talk it through with your DH, both sit down together with your child and explain why manners are necessary, and set some ground rules.

We only have them 3-4 nights in every fortnight, so even less than you OP, but that's no reason not to discipline. Children would otherwise just get more and more spoiled as time goes on, that'll only make your own life more difficult. My DH does sometimes let them get away with more stuff as he doesn't want them to hate coming to our house if we're nagging all the time, but he definitely doesn't let them run riot either.

"From reading on other forums on here it's also a no no for a non parent to do any form of parenting/discipline" :
I don't think this is true at all - I don't think there's anything wrong with a step-parent doing some disciplining. The children have to know that it's your house they're are living in as well as their father's and that you all have to have some rules to make it a lovely place to live.

Well I don't think it's normal for 7 year olds to have no manners and not be pulled up for it. My 7 year old knows to say please and thank you, and if he didn't he would be told every time. Your DP sounds a bit Disney.

What I've found works best when teaching manners isn't to remind them when they forget but simply to ignore the response. Eg "shall I pour you some juice DSD?" "Yes"....... "Where's my juice?" "You need to say please" works much better than "Shall I pour you some juice?" "Yes" "Yes what?" "Yes please" which just becomes a little ritual and doesn't teach them anything.

I think backing off discipline is recommended to step parents as a last resort where there's a lot of conflict and they are not being backed up by their partner. Unless your DP is adamantly opposed to teaching manners and undermines you if you try then there's no reason at all you can't be involved in teaching manners to a 7 year old. It'll be much more effective coming from the both of you.

Thanks for all your responses some very helpful tips here! It's difficult to know where you stand on being involved with someone else's child especially when you are not a patent yourself, but as has been said above it makes our home a better place for all of us if we are singing from the same hymn sheet! Feel a bit more confident about it now, thankyou

It sounds fairly standard 7 yo behaviour but that doesn’t mean she shouldn’t be taught to have manners.

I take a fairly gentle approach but in a few ways. I remind and don’t do things till he says please. Or sometimes I say as if I’m DS “thank you mummy for kindly getting me the juice” then say “no problem at all, DS”. Also when he does say thank you or please, I sometimes give him a quick kiss and cuddle and say “thanks for being so polite, I’m so proud of my super polite boy”. Just so there’s positive reinforcement too not just constant nagging.

I think it’s also really important to model the behaviour and say please and thank you to them so it becomes normal - it’s easy to forget in the rush of life when I’m going “just put your shoes on, we are late for school!”. If DS gets a bit ungrateful, I remind him that not all children get outings/treats etc and that he’s really lucky to have so much.

I sometimes say “what are you grateful for?” Just before he goes to sleep. Sometimes he just says something silly! I always say what I’m grateful for that day and I think it sinks in a little!

You could have a discussion with your dp on what you could say to her about it just so you know where the line is in his head on what you can say.

I would not worry too much, my 7 year old can sometimes be like this, I just sit and look at him until he realises what was wrong, and then he says please, thank you etc.

As for giving her money instead of an egg, why has he not give her it considering Easter was over a month ago? She asked a question and I would of as well. Your other half should not make promises to a child if he is not going to keep them.