Advice please re toys, rooms and sharing, or not?

[Atleastihavethecat]

We finally got to do Christmas with DPS DC and it was great. However, we also ended up looking after DPS nieces when the DC went home. I usually have no problem with this, and I usually enjoy spending time with them. This time was different. We found out that they've been squirreling things belonging to DPS DC out of our house - clothes, underwear, toys or just one piece of a set which is completely useless on its own. They also opened the DC's presents out of their boxes, lost pieces and used all of a brand new unopened painting set.

Dp is from a large family, and is in two minds. He's angry, but he also thinks that toys are for sharing, albeit only if they're opened already.

He has spoken with their parents about the taking things and both swore blind that they had bought these items. We are certain they didn't. It would be a massive coincidence for both sets of children to have ordered the same clothing from where I ordered some of these from - think Etsy and USA, compared to Primark and pepco. I'm not saying that there's anything wrong with the second option and use them myself, but a few of the missing clothing were special ordered for birthdays, and events. Or for the nieces to have the order of a castle but not the actual castle.

And this is the DC's stuff. To me, that's part of making them feel at home here. I think they should be able to say if they want someone playing with their stuff or not, and should be listened to. I agree that sharing is important but I also think ownership is important too.

For background, the nieces parents are separated. One parent has only introduced one partner to them, and that relationship is fairly stable. The other parent has introduced numerous partners, each only lasting a few weeks. The eldest finds this confusing, and is quite an anxious child. She would usually talk to me about how she's feeling about everything.

DPS dsis has also told us that this taking things is an ongoing issue with them, and that they've done the same in most houses they visit. I'll add that this was a completely unplanned sleepover. They literally just landed at the door with these children and asked if they could stay in front of them.

So aibu? And what would you do?

I'll also admit that my immediate reaction was that they would never come again. I felt that the parents were unhelpful, in denial, and massively disrespectful, especially by sending these clothes back in an overnight bag for the dnieces.

Having calmed down, I realize that there is a very anxious child who feels that I am one of a handful of people who listen to her and she needs to feel like she's being listened to.

How old are the children in question?

I blame the parents really. They know they didn't buy those clothes for their DC.

If they weremy nieces. I'd be doing a check of what they came with next time and when they leave.

I'd disguise it as "just to make sure no toys or clothes get mixed up"

They're 10 and 6. The clothes don't even fit the 10 year old! She's been pulling them on until they fit or rip.

To add insult, I actually keep some clothes here that do fit them as they have turned up with nothing, or a mismatch - two shirts, no trousers and that sort of thing.

So the children have taken the items and your DPs sibling and ex have pretended that they bought them for them?
I wouldn’t have them back to stay to be honest; when the children come again I’d say they can’t go to DSDs room and be conscious of what they’re taking with them when they leave.
I feel quite sad for your DSDs having their things taken.

I wouldn't have them back, your dsd's will be distressed while they aren't with you wondering what's happening to their things.

I has a friend whose child hid things in their bag and took them home, I had to stop the friendship as her ds took my sons favourite toy.

I'd have a discussion with the parents that you don't mind helping but you know these toys and clothes have been taken.
Point out they are from very unique online stores that you know they wouldn't have bought in sizes too small. And toys where they have only one item from a big set that lines up with the only one you are missing.
Ask for all toys to be returned or you will work out how much it will cost them to replace them.

If they keep denying and refusing get blunted with them and say they can not come into your house again. Even if they knock on the door and ask in front of the children you will not hesitate to turn them away.

I know it's a horrible situation for the children to be in but they need to learn what's right and wrong.

There's some serious dyfunction going on there.

Like I said..do a bag check on arrival and departure. ...and check what they're wearing.

I think some posters here are being really harsh! These children are young and if the adults that they have a sense of stability with turn and say, you’re not welcome anymore, that is utterly heartless behaviour.

Here’s what I would do.

1. I would sit the parents down again, minus any children and have that uncomfortable but blunt conversation. Stating that you know that these things were taken, there is no way they could have been bought by them and that you are there to help and support the DC and the parents. No judgement. Because these children have to stop this behaviour now. If they start doing this at school or with their friends. The repercussions will be huge. Don’t even mention cost of replacing things, I just think that’s crass amongst family and deviates from the main point.
2. Find some time to play/ relax with these children (when the SD’s aren’t there) and gently bring up that you know these things have been taken. That you love them, you’re not angry but it is sad this has happened. Empathise with them, say it must be hard, and ask what you can do to help. The first stage is getting them to admit (gently), or at least not deny it.

The children could be doing this for numerous reasons, control, attention, emotional anxiety. But it does need to be stopped.

If they continue to deny it / get angry, then I would restrict access to the SD’s toys/ clothes in their entirety. Lock them away somewhere etc. Or do bag checks as they leave.

There is no way i would abandon my nieces and nephews if they came to my house and started doing this. A huge part of the problem however is the parents and if they continue to keep denying it (and then as a result so do the children) you need to revisit it all.

The step children already have to live between two homes. How long would it be before this happening will stop them wanting to go to their dads?

They need more stability and reassurance that their things are safe when they aren't there. Tackling this slowly and gently doesn't seem to be working when the parents are just denying it.

lunar let’s get this into perspective shall we? These are toys and a few items of clothing. Yes it’s a problem, it shouldn’t be happening and it needs stopping. Have I at any point said in my post that it should be allowed to continue?

But your approach of stop them from coming is just heartless. Do you have a larger family? Are you close to your nieces/ nephews? Have you any idea if how sometimes it can help these things being nipped in the bud in a heartbeat if the adults in the wider family work together to tackle issues with the children?

If any of my nieces/ nephews started to do this, there is zero chance they would be banned from my home and treated like petty criminals. I’m their family and part of my responsibility is to teach them empathy, compassion, boundaries and much more. The way I display that is through my behaviour and my communication.

What life skills do you impart by simply saying ‘you’re no longer welcome in my home?’

And we wonder why this society is turning into an all about me bunch of navel gazers. Honestly.

I personally would lock away any nice or expensive stuff when the DN comes and be honest with your DP’s kids that you’re doing this because they are stealing from them. I also suggest a family meeting whereby you stress the importance of your DP’s kids telling you and him if anything happens during the DN stay — I guarantee that if they’re stealing from them, they’re probably bullying too.

The two sets of children are rarely in the same place at the same time. But I agree there's a lot of dysfunction in the dnieces lives. DPS family took a massive step back from his DC, due to the exs behaviour, which not only left a lot of stress for us to manage on our own, but meant that the dnieces were more or less the only children of that generation. They got a lot of attention, and as we work to solidify his DC position, making them feel at home, I think there may be some jealousy.

Apparently they are also bed wetting, waking up at night, and 'lying'. I have raised issues that the eldest has raised with me to the parents, but when the ex says it isn't happening and the child is lying, DPS sibling just agrees. There has been similar incidents in other people's houses, and they have lost at least one friend because of it. We're told the parents had the same reaction - complete denial.

I have also spoken with the 'step-parent' about things, but they're just finding their feet and finds it difficult to know where the line is between step parenting and stepping on toes. Especially as the parents relationship fluctuates massively, and they go from getting on well to screaming at each other in the street. The eldest has said she's gotten up for school or whatever and found some randomer in the kitchen, which she has said worries her that there's often strange people in the house.

There's also a well established habit of taking DP for granted. He says things and his family agree, then they just go back to taking the piss. They seem to think if they deny this for long enough, he'll back down.

I'm going to get some lockable toy boxes if that's a thing? I've tried hiding his DC's stuff in drawers and cupboards, but the nieces just look through it. The parents have told them that DPS DC room is their room when the DC's aren't here. We've been trying to tell them that that's not how it works. It's always the DC's room, but they can stay in it when they're with us.

With that level of dysfunction in their lives already, I'd worry about the effects of us stepping back, but I'm acutely aware that this is the DC's stuff, and that should be respected.

If DC aren’t there why not lock their doors and set up mattresses in the living room (or similar) for the kids?

Oh, that's a good idea! Make it like a camping thing!

Exactly.