Co-parenting with a cheater

[Ss770640]

Hoping some of you can guide me.

Long story short she had an affair at work, denied it, lied, moved out. Zero apologies, zero remorse. She still sees the OM. After 5 years marriage. 12 year relationship. Continues to lie about the reasons for leaving.

I am now forced to co-parent with a cheating STBXW that literally broke our marriage, family and my heart. 1 son 4 yo. For a guy she's known for less than 12 weeks.

She acts happy. She IS happy. As far I know.

1. How do you co-parent with a spouse that shows zero remorse at the destruction she has created? She literally acts like it's a normal day.

1. Im always there for my son. 50/50. How do I co-parent when I literally don't ever want to see her again.

Just last week I had to drop my boy off whilst the scumbags car was parked out front.

Tips appreciated. I have to deal with multiple levels of betrayal.

On the bright side, the settlement figure she's expecting will be far smaller than she thinks.

My ex cheated on me left me with a one year old and didn’t see him for a while, he sorted his act resumed contact and 9years old had a solid relationship with ds. Times a healer and you won’t always feel the way you do believe me. I’m happily married with more dc and so is ex as far as I know. It does get easier just keep it simple and try not to engage in disagreements. We rather disagree and mostly communicate via text about ds can go weeks without texting but only do when needed.

OP - am so sorry it sucks and is v hard.

You learn to bite your tongue, smile and take so much shit from your EX you wonder whether what the hell you did wrong in life to deserve this much shit.

But you do it for your child, you will bend over backwards, facilitate shit, pay for stuff and listen to how bad a parent you are.

when you want to scream, you do not, when you do scream, you will be called irrational, mad ,crazy controlling and the evil EX and all the time you wonder what you did wrong and can not come up with an answer.

It gets better in some ways but worse in others. This is not something you ever wanted for your child but you will be expected to step aside and let a stranger parent and think they have as many rights as you do. You will feel sidelines, replaced and hurt more than you ever considered you could hurt.

but when your child hugs you and tells you they love you - you know it is worth it.

There is no justice, there are no winners, there is a lot of pain and the hope that your child sees how mcuh effort you make and learns as they get older to appreciate how bloody much you did for them and never understand how hurt you were.

Rise above it and put your DC first. Time is a healer.
I too was once where you were. Now? I am friends with my ExH and for all he did, he's an amazing father. For that I will always respect him.
My DC as a result have navigated our divorce with as little collateral damage as possible and I have no regrets over how I rose above how I felt and put my pain aside.

Get counselling though. The pain needs to come out.

I agree that counseling can be a big help. It will allow you to get it all out in a safe and supportive environment.

It's a case of 'fake it til you make it'. You don't have to be friends or 'make nice'. You just have to be 'professional' as you would on your job with a nasty client or customer. Don't be rude, don't lose your temper, rise above. Deal only with necessaries of child arrangements, no chit chat on the doorstep. As hard as it is, her 'bit on the side' has to be ignored as does anything either of them do or say that is not directly regarding the children.

Maintain your dignity. You will be very glad in the end that you did.

I can’t speak from personal experience but maybe some counselling would help?

Your EW cheated on you - she might have been a rubbish partner but that doesn’t necessarily make her a rubbish mother.

I’m with a man who left his EW. I met him 3 years AFTER his divorce. His EW is incredibly bitter over 7 years later. She has told the children daddy had an affair with me (this is not the truth I only met him years later). My point is her bitterness is all consuming. My advice would be to learn some techniques to deal with her as best you can.

Good luck.

I've seen first hand how bitterness destroys a life.

One of my parents still rants about the other 40 years after divorce.

I guess the question I want to ask is, am I bad parent if I refuse to be friends with my STBXW? Anybody co-parented via text or handover book? Can you recommend a visit schedule so I don't have to interact with her?

I literally want nothing to do with her again. Too painful. An emotional jail sentence for the next 15 years.

Her steadfast refusal to admit being wrong, her continued lies and zero regard for my wellbeing is a big weight on me.

I will call relate and see if they can help.

No, I wouldn't say you were a bad parent for refusing to be 'friends'. You'd be a bad parent if you badmouthed or otherwise communicated to your DC your feelings (ie making faces, using a 'tone' when talking about her, putting down her plans for her time with DC, etc). If you can't be 'positive' you need to at least be 'neutral' iyswim. She is still the DC's mother, even if she is no longer your wife.

Her steadfast refusal to admit being wrong, her continued lies and zero regard for my wellbeing is a big weight on me

This is what needs to stop. You need to stop talking to her about this. She will never admit anything. Why would you want to bang your head against this stone wall. All it will do is hurt you, it certainly doesn't damage the wall!

And (sorry, this is cruel) she is no longer responsible for your 'well being'. You now need to become totally self-reliant when it comes to your own happiness and well being. This is a good reason for you to get counseling. You may also find that she's a bit more concerned when you stop badgering her to admit her faults. Yes, she was absolutely wrong to cheat, no two ways about it. But I have a friend who felt as you seem to, for years. All it did was drain her of happiness and damage her children because she couldn't get past what he 'owed' her for cheating.

Yes, you certainly can arrange things where there is no direct contact between you. For the time being it would probably be the best for all concerned, including you. Are there relatives or friends who could do the handovers? And you're perfectly within your rights to tell your stbx that you prefer to handle things by text/email. BUT, your son still has a right to speak with her by phone and you'll need to be able to give him a neutral reason why you are no longer taking him to mum's.

You need time. And healing. The 'time' is guaranteed as we none of us can stop the clock. The healing is something you must do for yourself.

When your son starts school would your access schedule allow you to collect him after school at the start of your contact time then drop him back at school on the Monday (or whatever day) morning?

Don’t let your DS be the one typing about his one parent who is still bitter and ranting 40 years later. Get some help so you can move on with your new reality.

100% agree with you all.

I don't bad mouth. Am always amicable.

But for sure there is an element of retribution I'm expecting. Least an apology or admission. I didn't even get contact from the in-laws!

I expect I'll get neither. Need to learn to accept and progress.

My dilemma is I'd never associate with a liar, cheat and shitty person. Now that person is my spouse.

Anchored to her shitty behaviour for the next decade. Sigh.

Maybe closure is over rated.

On the bright side I now get to eat crisps with my boy in bed and watch cartoons.

My biggest worry is ongoing communication which I'm forced to do, will not allow me to heal or let go.

Chicken n egg

@Ss770640 I have been in your position! The cheating, the lies, the complete change in personality is all hurtful! Hardest thing I have ever been through! BUT. I am now 15 months on and I am so much happier! I know it doesn't feel like it now but time is a healer and things get easier! But you have to learn to accept the situation and let go of the bitterness! I too felt bitter, angry and hated him for what he had done! But I hated how it made me feel so I made the conscious decision that I would not let it turn me into a bitter person and I am so glad I did! I rose above and maintained my dignity and I am so glad I did! I still had to see him to drop my dc off, and It was hard but it got easier! We will never be friends but we remain amicable for the sake of our child and we co parent well. He is a good dad!
This all doesn't happen over night it takes time and takes a lot of effort needs to be invested into yourself to enable your happiness! You just have to make the decision that you want to be happy and not bitter! Sending lots of hugs I know how you feel xx

My advice is to get to a mediator. Hammer out how contact works best (because you will need to communicate over schools, homework, discipline, behavioural issues).

In the beginning I could barely look my EXH in the face because of what had happened. But with the help of a mediator, we were able to put in a structure over contact with boundaried communication. There is a parenting portal called my family wizard that avoids direct texting/ email if that helps you.

My other advice is to let go of seeking closure. I to this day have not sought an admission, an apology or anything from my EXH. Nor did I ever hear from his family. But I don’t expect to. I accept that our marriage wasn’t perfect, that he made the choices he made and as a result of that, we are no longer together. I don’t expect his family to contact me, why would they? Their loyalties lie with their child.

Finally - and I can say this as a result of my own situation. Let go of your judgement. Life is complicated (I’m not condoning affairs at all) but you have a choice. You can either let go of your feelings and co-parent with someone who has acted in ways you don’t recognise and has a value system different to yours. Or you can hold onto this ‘judgement’ and it will (potentially) win over good intentions.

You can’t change what has passed. It is painful. I will never be the same person as I was before all this happened. I have immense trust issues. But. My DC don’t know about what happened and I hope they never will.

From time to time I think ‘he’s not a good parent, this isn’t what good parents do’. It’s an understandable reaction. But he is a good parent and maybe he was just desperately unhappy and wanted out. Fair enough.

Give it time OP. It does get easier, I promise you

Retribution is hard if you want it for yourself as you risk harming your child whose mother would then be someone suffering and he by default will suffer because she is suffering. Top tips - you disassociate from the person so that you will eventually end up as indifferent to them as if they were just another adult in your childs life - like a teacher; a health care practitioner their friends parent - able to show interest in their views as they pertain to your child but not particularly affected if you don't agree.

The best retribution in the face of betrayal is to live the best happiest peaceful life you can live. You cannot do that whilst holding anger, resentment, frustration that they are seemingly benefitting and indifferent to your suffering. Find your own spiritual/moral value base and locate yourself there - I feel there is always a price to be paid when you do harm to others but its not for me to hang around waiting to see it.

11 years on I spend minimal time with my childrens father, I have however come to think he is a damaged person who damages others if they are close - that comes from seeing the let downs he has given the children over the years. But that's his relationship with them. You have to recognise the other parent is that and how you relate to them has to be with the well being of your child in mind. How can he feel about himself and his life if he feels one parent hates the other? You have to learn an honesty and an acceptance - we don't share the same ideas about family life. Leave it at that.

Minimise your contact as others have said hammer out the detail make it clear you want as little relational contact as possible - she may see it that you cant let go move on/you have to reframe it as it is so I can move on and let go. Start your new life from now think of her as a neighbour you don't like, a work colleague who annoys you - are you going to take over your life or deal with it as an annoyance. Keep a diary of how you do manage to side step the dwelling in negative emotions and work out how to do more of the same. It can be done and you will know when you are there allow time though.

I don't wish harm or want retribution.

Just an honest answer and at least an apology. She blamed me for everything that she did wrong.

There's nothing unreasonable about you wanting those things. But it is unreasonable to not do your best to move forward when you don't get them.

We all have unanswered questions in our lives. Things that we'll never know the truth about. But you can't let it steal your happiness! If you do, she 'wins'. Although it's not really about winning, I just couldn't think of a better way to put it. And remember, if you stop asking her she'll stop blaming you (at least to your face). Why do you want to beat yourself over the head with that conversation anyway?

My dilemma is I'd never associate with a liar, cheat and shitty person. Now that person is my spouse

You aren't 'associating' with her, you are co-parenting. There's a difference and as time passes you'll understand what that difference is. And she's no longer your spouse in the true sense of what being a spouse entails. She stopped being that the day she chose to cheat. She's your soon to be ex-spouse. Yes, there will be a 'connection' of sorts for the rest of your lives, because you share a child, Only you can choose if that connection is an 'anchor' or an inconvenience. Remember that you do have a life ahead of you, one that you can choose to live in happiness and possibly with a new love. Or one you can choose to live in bitterness with that 'anchor' around your neck. Although my first marriage broke up due to abuse not infidelity I know which life I chose.

What helped me was:

• to keep as much communication as possible to being in writing (text/email) because it's very rare that anything really needs to be said in person. Plus when he would try to backtrack it was all there in writing. I have usually regretted the times when we agreed things verbally and not in writing...

• reducing handovers by dropping off at school as part of the school run and letting him collect at the end of the day and vice verse.

• mediating in separate rooms

Basically the less contact the better until time helps the healing process. But mine was also emotionally/financially abusive so that made things harder.

I've been where you are, almost exactly as my exP cheated and left me when my DS was 4. I empathise so much with what you describe. It's really horrible and you have my sympathy.

You've had some brilliant advice upthread. I think the crux of it is that you need to put your DS's needs first. I always told myself that for DS to grow up happy and healthy, he needed as good a relationship with both his parents as possible, and it was up to me to facilitate that. It really need help keep me focussed and sane. It also gave me great satisfaction to behave absolutely properly. After the first day I found out and I SCREAMED at exP, I have never yelled at him again, nor have I ever badmouthed him to DS.

Do think very carefully about how you choose to communicate with your ex now as it will set the scene for the next few years. I insisted on weekly phone calls with my ex to discuss DS, and put these in place quite soon after we separated as I knew that I had to keep lines of communication open and it was easier to do it in a formalised way at an expected time than be bothered by random calls or texts.

I'm glad I did as, 6 years on, we've got a fairly amicable relationship now. I don't think I will ever forgive and forget but we're able to do things like attend sports events and parents evening and have a civil chat.

Closure IS over-rated. I'm not sure I ever achieved it! I never had an apology and certain things (like treatment from his family) still really smart. But it gets easier with the passing of time. Try not to focus on your ex and the whys and wherefores. You will most likely never get the answers you want or need. Focus on yourself and most of all your DS. Do lots of lovely things like eating crisps and watching cartoons and make you and him as happy as you possibly can.

You don’t have to be friends with her at all. I have very, very little contact with my Ex. We never have to talk, although it’s not 50/50. Your child is younger, so it would be helpful to email how the child is, sleep or sickness etc. You can text arrangements.

You can even set up an online family calendar - there’s a website.
www.ourfamilywizard.co.uk/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI05LApJq-3gIVSbHtCh0AQg68EAAYASAAEgLkwfD_BwE this is one of them.

Keep things very boring, very matter of fact. If you are provoked ever, do not retaliate. Keep the routine very peaceful, structured and calm for your child. Don’t ask them about the OM. Any anger you feel, spill this out to friends, a counselor, to mumsnet. Not your Ex or OM or child.

Quickest way to move on is by being vigilant about your own feelings, do not look at social media, put away photos in a box in the attic for your child when older, clear out her stuff, do lots with your child and have very clear boundaries.

Our atmosphere is not toxic.

It's just I want nothing to do with the lying little cheating shit that she is.

I'm going to suggest the app.

I just want rid of seeing her.

The thought of playing happy families for the next 15 years is crap. And one i can't do.

Happy to parent on my own. I think I'll suggest email only from now on

But you also need to let your boy be comfortable talking to you about his Mum .

My EX was a dick and as my DCs have aged, they know he had an affair, they know he screwed up - he has told them. But they also know they can talk about their Dad at any point and I will not lose it be rude etc.

Their is a photo of them with him on the mantelpiece with all the other family rellies- it is important to them and as the adult you are going to learn to fake it till you can make it for their sake.He will love you even more when his understanding of everything changes.

It’s really hard. But you have to put your feelings to one side for the children.

My OH has a very bitter EW. It’s now starting to affect the children. Don’t let this be you....

The kids aren’t ‘allowed’ to talk about dad and what they do when they are with him.

They had birthdays recently. They won’t take their cards or presents home as mummy rips the cards up and puts them in the bin.

At parents evening recently (my OH has a separate appointment as his EW is so hostile) she saw him and shouted you can ‘F off’ - their 9 year old was with her at the time.

His 13 year old daughter was told she shouldn’t text or ring her dad as it upsets mummy.

Don’t let this be you.

They’ve been divorced over 5 years I should add. I can’t see it ever getting any better.

Hi @Ss770640 - I'm still waiting for an apology - 9 years on! My point is you'll never get one unless she acknowledges to herself what she's done. My exh has rewritten our entire marriage & break up (in his own head) just so he doesn't have to deal with the guilt of what he did.
As others have said get counselling - that's what I did & it worked wonders & I just had to let go of the fact that the person I'd give all my trust & hopes to for 17 years couldn't even do me honour of being truthful.
Don't be friends but do be civil & yes, keep contact with her to a minimum despite what she may try. Regular contact (which the spouse who left often seems to want) is like constantly scratching a healing wound so cut it off.
It DOES get better. Forge a new life for yourself slowly but surely & you will wake up someday free from it all.

The monstrification and rewriting history is a definite emotional defence mechanism. My STBXW has done exactly that.

After all you can't feel guilty if you hate your spouse.

Blame shifting and victim blaming.

Absolute worst character traits. They take zero responsibility. My STBXW laid all the blame of her affair onto me! And still denies leaving for the affair partner even whilst his car is parked in her (new house) driveway!

She has literally gone mad. To where I've questioned it it's a mental breakdown. Denial. Etc.