Would it be unfair of me to take my kids away on their own?

[bellendoftheball]

Apologies in advance if this is a bit rambling. I'm after some objective opinions please. My DP and I have been together for 10 years. He has 2 DC, now both teens, from a previous relationship, who don't live with us but come every other weekend and for part of the school holidays. I also have 2 teenage DC from a previous relationship. We have a 7 year old DS together. We have all been on a family holiday together every year since the teens were little, usually camping or (in slightly flusher years!) a cottage in the uk, and usually planned, booked and paid for in the main by me. I've been happy to do this as the kids have always got on really well and look forward to going away together. We would love to take them abroad but on our income it just isn't affordable. The other day my DP and I were chatting and I mentioned that next year, if I can afford it, I'd really like to take my older two away, just me and them, for a weekend city break somewhere in Europe, as they've only been abroad once (when they were quite little), and have never been on a plane. I'd probably book an apartment or something to keep costs down. It's all speculative anyway as it's dependent on me getting a better paid job with more hours, which is by no means guaranteed!
Anyway, to get to the point, my DP objected very strongly to my suggestion of taking my 2 teens away, saying that it would be divisive and that it was effectively selecting children to take on holiday. He said that the others, in particular his teens, would be missing out, and that as we're a family, any money that can be freed up to spend on holidays should go towards a holiday for everyone. I could see his point if he and our 7 year old were coming too, and his older DC were left out, but I just want to take my big ones away on their own, just once, before they're too old to enjoy going away with their mum! My 7 year old would most likely not enjoy a city break so I wouldn't consider taking him on that kind of break anyway. I explained that while it would be lovely to take everyone abroad, chances are that will never be affordable for us, and it's the only way my 2 will be able to go. I said that if it is so important to him that everyone goes that is fine but he should arrange it, book it and pay half. I did add though that that kind of isn't the point as I would really like to have that time alone with my children. He objected very strongly again both to me suggesting that he pay half and to me referring to my children as 'my' kids, and used the word 'divisive' again. He also said that I could spend quality time with my kids by taking them to the cinema, it doesn't have to be something expensive. I'm really gobsmacked, I can't see where he's coming from at all and frankly think he's being ridiculous to object to me taking my kids away for a weekend. I feel bullied and like he's trying to dictate to me how I should spend quality time with my children. I've always made a huge effort to include his kids; this would be a one-off. I've even suggested that he take his teens away on his own to even things out, if he thinks they would feel jealous, but he said they wouldn't like that as they like going away with everyone. Am I being unfair/selfish/divisive?What do you think?

Firstly; Why are you expected to pay the full holiday costs for the whole family? You have 5 kids between you, (effectively 2 1/2 each) so why aren't you splitting it 50/50?
Secondly; Do his 2 children never go on holiday with his EW, their mother? If they do, then their already up on your children, unless of course they go with their dad?
Really, you should take your eldest 2 because you're right, they won't want to very soon. You go one weekend, he can take his eldest another weekend...then perhaps take your youngest joint child away together to Legoland, or some other age appropriate treat. Things will change anyway with the teens, they won't want to do family all together stuff, that's normal..so do what you'd really like to do now whilst you can! You're not being unreasonable because you've done all the spade work over the last 10 years...it's your turn now!

I think in a nuclear, non-blended family, taking some children away but not all is fine in the circumstances you describe. The younger kids wouldn't enjoy anyway, cost, first time in a plane etc....it's all fine and totally reasonable.

I think that if your step-DCs were of a similar age to your 7yo, this would be the excuse/reason that you could give them to justify such a differentiation. I say excuse/reason you could give them, because the reality is you want this special time with your own, blood DCs.

And that's the crux of it. Really, you want this time abroad with your DC, you want to spend your limited resources on them - and I'm sure that when the time comes for your 7yo you would want to do the same. You don't feel the need or inclination to do this for your step-DC at any point; you think this is your DP's job.

When you discuss this with your DP, you need to be clear that this is the case. It's impossible to know from your post whether your DP genuinely feels that you are discriminating between the five children along blood lines in a way that he doesn't, or whether he is hiding behind this out of frustration that he can't provide the same for his own blood children. Either way, you are going to have to be sensitive to him and his insecurities (if the latter - after all, why should you and your DC 'suffer' because he can't do for his what you do for yours), or be prepared for a tough, tough conversation if it's the former.

Personally, I think I'd be too worried about forcing the issue and opening a potential can of worms for something which (1) may not ever happen (2) if it does would really not be worth having such a conversation about (3) can easily be sidestepped by thinking up and planning for an alternative. I would only go there if I absolutely had to, and a weekend city break wouldn't fall into that category for me (FYI, something like private education or private healthcare would).

I think what you want to do is perfectly fair and reasonable. I take my ds away without dh and dss every year as we always did before I met dh. It's a special time for us, we go as a family at other times. If dh wanted to take dss somewhere just the two of them I wouldn't object at all.
This argument that his kids wouldn't want to go somewhere just with him is completely irrelivant. That doesn't mean yours don't want to and shouldn't.

Agree with pp don't push the issue until you've got the job and saved the money but when you do book something and take your kids away. I wouldn't be impressed in the slightest is my dh started telling me what I can spend my money on and if I can take my ds away. I do think it's a conversation worth having and something worth pushing for not that you should have to push, you might regret not going when your kids are grown, and resent dp if he stops you.

If he wants all the kids to go he pays half. Seems perfectly reasonable as a compromise. Otherwise go ahead with your plans.

Firstly, if he wants his two DC to come along and make it a full family holiday then yes he should pay half.

Secondly: If he's objecting to you taking your teens away because he will miss out then suggest he pays and takes them somewhere himself - if he's that bothered.

Thirdly: What's his attitude towards a scenario where his two children may go away with their mum? Thus meaning your DC and your joint DC miss out on that? It's the same scenario where they would be going with their mum - you want to take your children away with their mum.

Issues like this really get to me because sometimes it's like your stopped from doing things in case it upsets SDC (although they get to do it with mum) yet your children joint or other have to miss out because it's unfair. If you were going away for the first time and your joint DC was going too then I'd understand the feeling of unfairness. But your not and you still go on family holidays.

It's the same when parents from blended families won't go on days out on days they don't have the non resident children or if they do they want to hide the fact in case of upset. Nobody thinks of the fairness of resident children when things like this crop up.

Raventak- have to disagree with you. What his DCs do with their mother is irrelevant, they are not one up.

Do the OPS children go away with their DF - it is not a competition and this argument keeps coming up on here and ~i am sure we will never get an agreed answer.

having said that if the OP wants to go on holiday with her 2 - go. If he wants to join you then he pays his share. I can see why he thinks it is divisive - sometimes their is a joy in being a single parent with a minimal contact dick for a DF to the kids. I just do what I what I want !!

Raventak- have to disagree with you. What his DCs do with their mother is irrelevant, they are not one up.

I agree with you as it should be ok for the op to take her children away without fear of upsetting her SDC. I simply noted that it was the same type of scenario and wanted to know if her DP kicked up a fuss about his other child missing out on anything because his children went away with their mother - none of his business. Neither is it tbh if OP wants to take her children away - especially if she is footing the bill. I've never once stated his children were 'one up' as you put it. But it is poor when in blended families you have to sometimes walk on eggshells because you simply want to do something with your own children without DSC but have to check if that's ok - or if a dad won't do anything for fear of them getting upset.

Do you both have the same disposable income and financial responsibilities? And what would be cut to put the money aside? Would it be possible for your dh to save the same to take his children somewhere?

I think it would be unfair if the same couldn't be done for his children. But if it could then I don't see the problem.

I agree you should go!

Given limited time and money we have to prioritise.

I have booked solo trips. Hubby didn't like it. He didn't like to think his would miss out. He can solve that for them, he just isn't very, ...um, good with it! I am better at organising, keeping the teens engaged. Things are a bit 'flat' when he's out with our lot.

For you, it's a case of having nerves of steel and doing right by the individual children. Once you DECIDE to go, it's easier to be brave...just start with saving up, then a flight booking and a city apartment, then tell him!? Remind everyone that you've paid for their trips in the past and that this is as much for you as it is for the DC.

I'm sorry but if my do announced there was going to be a holiday but no, my children weren't invited, only his.. well I think he'd put his hard hat on. I completely understand you wanting time alone with your kids, but either you're a family or you aren't. Yes, as somebody mentioned, in a nuclear family this wouldn't be anything remarkable.. but this isn't one, and that's why you have to be so careful. Because whether his kids wanted to go or not, the fact they were being excluded would most definitely be noticed and noted by them. not worth the fall out in my opinion.

Life isnt 'fair', is it? We all just have to learn to live with that.

They are a family. Hence why his kids have always been on holidays before. I saw on another thread on this board somebody said blended families are like a Venn diagram, different families coming together and over lapping to make a new family whilst the old families still exist.
My dh and I and our son's are a family, most of the time our family only includes dh ds and I. Me and ds will always be a unit. Sometimes we get time to be a couple without the kids. All of those combinations are important and should be encouraged and supported imo.

I think it is perfectly fine OP. You'll only get a few years of your kids being younger to go with too, so make the most of it.

Trying to do everything to please everyone all of the time means that someone always loses out in one way. I don't know why people are so adamant that all kids have to be included in everything - taken to the extreme they would only live with that parent and do everything with them. They are like Venn diagrams, separated parents, different houses, holidays, activities, some combine, some are separate.

I took my DSCs individually on weekend breaks, one at a time, with and without my own DCs - sometimes my own DC would even lose out but I said I wanted to get to know DSCs. But I tell you, even there kids were complaining! You can never please everyone, even your DP.

A friend of mine's DH always takes her DSCs on a separate holiday (without her) every year, and my friend takes their sons on a holiday on her own at the same time. The DSCs love having that time with their Dad on their own.

Thanks everyone for taking the time to reply. To answer some of the points raised:

I've paid for holidays because generally over the years I've had more disposable income, and because I've chosen to as I think it's lovely to go away all together. DP has contributed to some of them when he's been able. He hasn't particularly expected me to do it. However, he isn't very proactive in planning things, and I suspect that if it was left to him no-one would ever go anywhere.

Really, you want this time abroad with your DC, you want to spend your limited resources on them - and I'm sure that when the time comes for your 7yo you would want to do the same. You don't feel the need or inclination to do this for your step-DC at any point; you think this is your DP's job.

No, absolutely not Sushi. Yes I would like to spend a small proportion of my income on my children, but only if it reached a level where I could do that without anyone having to miss out on anything they have now. Of course I feel the need and inclination to spend resources on my step-DC, precisely because it's very important to me that they feel equally valued and included; I always have and will continue to do so. I just won't be able to afford to pay for everyone to go abroad, even if I get the job I want.

Neither set of teens really goes away much with their respective other parent. Occasionally in the uk but never abroad. So this isn't a factor at all. I do think though (in fact I know, because he's quite open about it) that my DP feels a lot of guilt in relation to his DC, because he left, because he moved 30 miles away when we moved in together, and because he can't play as full a role in parenting them as he'd like. To the extent that (as you describe RavenInk), over the years he has often effectively opted-out of our family when his older DC haven't been here. He's recognised it and things have been changing, but it's certainly affected his relationship with my teens. In fact my eldest and he don't really get on that well, which is another reason why I'd like to take them alone. I think the guilt factor has more to do with the strength of his objections than he will admit.

lunar1 at the moment we have roughly the same disposable income. He works full-time but pays maintenance to his ex-p, I work part-time but receive maintenance from my ex-h; we have always taken account of this and split household expenses proportionately rather than just automatically go 50:50. The plan is for me to go full-time, in which case I would be the main earner and would have considerably more disposable income than him, in which case we'd adjust the split again to make it fair. And I would only consider this break if nothing had to be cut to make it happen, i.e. we could cover all costs, feed everyone well, still go on a family holiday and have something left over afterwards. Yes it's perfectly possible for my DP to do the same for his kids as he's recently had a small windfall that would easily cover it with quite a bit left over. My view is that money is his to do what he likes with; if he chose to take his teens away I would encourage it and be happy for them that they would get their dad to themselves for a weekend. I know that we'd have fun on our own. Maybe the others would feel a bit jealous but I'd explain to them and support the SDCs right to spend quality time alone with their dad sometimes, and his with them.

Anyway there are no easy answers, but thanks again for the opinions, I've found them really helpful.

Bell I think the answer is easy you should take your children away. I'd only have said otherwise if the financial split put him at a disadvantage. The reason this is hard is because he is putting you down n an unfair situation.

I think this sort of thing needs to be looked at for each individual family. There are so many ifs and buts.

I take my teen son away in this country every year for a few days. I have 4 dsc who get lots of school trips and a UK holiday with mum every year with no step siblings from mums boyfriend. Dp is the main earner and we all have a foreign holiday once every two years and a UK break on the alternate year.

I deliberately take my ds on a holiday the dsc wouldn't like to try and stop the jealousy. That side niggles me but it's a compromise I'm prepared to make to enable me to get away.

I think it's fine. It's only the same as your DSCs mum taking the DSCs away. You're a mum taking her children on holiday, she does the same with hers.

Agree with thegreenhen, it really depends on expectations, habits, how things are communicated.

I personally thing there is nothing wrong with taking your eldest kids away, but then I do not believe in every siblings getting exactly the same so there is no jealousy approach. My DD went on holiday abroad with a friend which I paid for whilst DS stayed home all week doing nothing much, but he didn't feel jealous, he knows that when he is her age, it might very well be his turn.

What I think is important with the decision you've made is to communicate it in a way that it is clear you are not favouring your eldest, and make it clear to your DD that you will also do things with her on her own.

As for the SC, they should see that it is not a rejection of them since you are not taking your youngest but again, it might be worth talking to them to explain why you've made your decision, and make it clear on that basis that you wouldn't have an issue with their dad taking them somewhere without your children.

I think you are being perfectly reasonable to take your kids away.

My DH earns a lot more than I do, he takes his DS to disneyland every year, skiing and at least one other holiday abroad. I can not afford to do that with mine and I would not want to go to disneyland anyway. Mine know that this is what DH and his son do, they are not bothered.

I have also taken mine away on holiday, UK and Europe, and last year took my dd on an activity holiday just the two of us.

We have also had 'family' holidays over the years, that have never gone well.

This year Dh and I want abroad and left all the kids.

This is what a blended family is about, not pretentding that everyone is to be treated the same, but accepting that there are different relationships within the family unit and respecting that.

You are right your teenagers will not want to holiday with you much now, do what you want. It will be a holiday you will all remember. I hope you manage to convince your DH and have a great time.

OP I am the major earner in our household and left to DP we would never go anywhere as he never plans anything. I book all the holidays. Some for all of us including DSC, some with just our son . Some for just the two of us and some with my older children and DGC. My DSC also have holidays with their mum and sometimes alone now they are older. I never feel any guilt at taking just my children. DP could go away with his children if he wanted to but is basically lazy!