Looks like we're going to court - anyone with CAFCASS experience?

[poppiesmum]

My dh has an 8yo dd with his ex who despite a contact order he hasn't seen all year. Ex says it's dd's decision and will not force her. Dh has taken difficult decision to go back to court to enforce the court order.

It is likely CAFCASS will get involved to establish dd's reasons for not wanting to see her dad, which we think will be a good thing as we believe she is being influenced by her mum.

Has anyone had any experience of what will happen? Dh is completely devavstated by the situation and all he wants is to see his dd again.

I just tried to CAT you poppies, but you're not accepting CATs, could you change your preferences?

Surfermum - you should be able to CAT me now. Sorry, thought I'd already set it up!

mummypumpkin, I'm not a stepmum either so you've got as much business being here as me!. I didn't mean to cause offence, I'm just incredulous at the advice you were given. Please come back!

I don't agreee with all of your views about Cafcass. You said "they are very hot on fathers seeing kids and if they get involved they will speak to both parents separately and the child on its own...all they care about is that the father is not a murderer or a paedophile. All they want is for fathers to see their children no matter what the circumstances are"

In my experience, they talk to both of the parents individually and see the child with each parent. They may also see the child on his own if they feel that it would be appropiate. It is not that they want fathers to see their children at all costs; but they do start with the premise that every child deserves the opportunity to have a relationship with both of his parents. Ther is cetainly no rule that a father can automatically see the child unless he is a murderer or a paedophile! It all depends on the particular case and is very much based on common sense. Drinking is a coomon one - if there are concerns, then contact is usually supervised and it is made very clear to father that if there is so much of a whiff of alcohol on him contact will cease.

I think one of the problems is that the children will often say what they think each parent wants to hear. If they pick up that dad is upset with mum they will call mum names etc. If they sense that mum hates dad they will often say that they don't want to see their dad because they fear that they will upset their mum. It is Cafcass' role to try to get to the bottom of it all and to establish some form of contact that everyone is happ with. Needless to say, if mum has concerns that dad is an alcoholic or cannot be trusted then Cafcass would normally only recomend supervised contact.

I'm sorry to go on but this is something I feel very sad about - I constantly meet women who simply cannot accept that their relationship is broken down. they are often angy and hurt and will use the children to hurt dad by withholding contact. It makes me so angry. It is so abusive.

I have come across lots of fathers who seem to have been selfish pigs of husbands or partners but in all other respects are good fathers.

Mummy pumpkin, I don't know about your particular situation and it sounds as if you have been through some awful harrowing times,but if contact went on for some 6 years, there must have been some good times between your ex and your ds and that is what I imagine Cafcass was trying to return to or build on. Presumably there is some good in your ex if you chose to have a child with him. Bugger on back and tell us more!

"they are very hot on fathers seeing kids and if they get involved they will speak to both parents separately and the child on its own...all they care about is that the father is not a murderer or a paedophile. All they want is for fathers to see their children no matter what the circumstances are"

I found this not to be the case. CAFCASS were instrumental in helping me overturn a contact order when my exP's girlfriend was messing with my son's head, and Ex P wouldn'd do anything to control her.

And you can forget about the Judge - CAFCASS are the judge, their decision will be the one that applies in the end. Get them on side.

Can text message transcribed from one persons phone be used against another in court? My daughter is only 17 months old and at the beginning her father and i tried to develop some contact although it was sparatic, we were never together as couple. The last stages came down to some now regretable arguementative texts we he is attempting to use in court.
I feel these are out of context, as certainle dont show the pressure and harrassement i was placed under by him - driving past home, work, phonecalls (often put down)and his texts. They will only be the ones he has saved. I had a phone taken during this time which i now believe could have been by him so many could be made up and finally any i sent he may have edited? Also what relvance do they have to our daughters welfare.

CAFCASS are investigating as i have requested as i dont want him to have contact due to the police having concerns about him, (i phoned and spoke to a DC who confirmed she would be happy to speak to them, they are child related but these are the only details i know) and socail services having some kind of record to, details again i dont know. Surely these are much bigger concerns than some past arguementative texts?

Mumsam - your situation sounds terrible - I don't have any experience personally as dh didn't persue the legal route with his dd (my gut feeling is that the court and CAFCASS will be more interested in speaking to all involved, rather than taking texts into account), but I'm keeping this bumped - I'm sure someone with more knowledge will be along soon. I haven't seen her around lately, but Zookeeper always had good advice on this subject - Good Luck.

Thankyou i'm finding this very hard so am grateful for any comments. It's very hard to know what to do when i dont have all the information from police and social services and am just reacting to what is thrown at me each day.

Don't worry about the text messages - I suppose technically he could write them down and put them in a statement but I doubt the court would take too much (if any ) notice of them given that there are police and social services concerns. If we got judged for sending furious texts made in the heat of the moment then none of us would have our kids!

I think the approach would be to say exactly what you have said, ie that you were angry, that they were taken out of context etc etc. The important thing is that you realise that it's a bit of a daft (though understandable) thing to do and regret it

Thanks for that i am less concerned about them. I am feeling disappionted though and hoped for some comments - during this week we attended court by the request of CAFCASS, i had breifly spoke to the officier given my daughters file about the police concerns and she had obviously by calling us back to court acted on them.

On meeting her i found CAFCASS had had telephone calls with the police and had concerns which meant they wanted to change the intrium order of contact to supervised at a centre. For a while i was so relieved and pleased. I certainly felt, and still do that CAFCASS were on our side, however, when in front of the judge i was simply shocked.

He really complained at CAFCASS for not having enough work done on the case, even though its just started, and dismissed or questioned much of what they had to say. There were some major concerns involving two other female children related to the father(given no details as yet) and him once owning a 2-way mirror in bathroom, which he denied and the judge didn't believe so demanded police proof.

Another and perhaps not as serious concern recorded by police was porno found at the fathers home in children's reach, including some of him and his ex wife. The judge comment to this and i quote was - all grown men have pornography in their home and just should be kept on top of wardrobe.....and what happens between man and wife in bedroom is their buisness - i was just amazed.

Finally, when writing the new contact arrangements the judge felt there was no need for supervised and CAFCASS had to repeat their concerns 3 times before he agreed, adding the comment - if i was the father at the moment, i would feel victamised by all this.
I left feeling very confused and hurt that my daughters welfare had almost been put at risk by the judge.

I have been through the court system now for two years, and CAFCASS have been involved since our first court date. At first i found them very un-helpful and the children found them very pushy, my eldest daughter (10 at the time) even wrote a letter of complaint because she did not feel that she was being listened too. Anyway after a few meetings with them they felt that there was not much they could do and ordered a finding of fact hearing with the judge. this took place and the judge found in our favour, CAFCASS are no longer involved and dont wish to be, they felt that the childrens wishes could not be discounted in this case. My suggestion to you would be stick at it, dont get on the wrong side of CAFCASS, seem to be doing all you can to help the situation but at the beginning of every meeting remind them why you are there. my CAFCASS lady never took any notes and seemed surprised each time i told her something as if it was the first time she had heard it, repetition works! i hope all works out for you. Just one more thing, the legal system and CAFCASS do on occasion go against the Father, they have in my case, hold true and you can win.

My dp and I have recently found some web articles about something called parental alienation syndrome - it does not seem to be accepted by the court system but totally reflects the influence that his ex has had on his children. Children are usually open and loving and want to please everyone - especially their mummy and xps can ve vicious, unforgiving and manipulative. By all means try the court system but be prepared for the manipulator to use it against you!!

I haven't seen my son for 6 yrs either, his choice as he claimed not to like my new partner. His dad and stepmother I am convinced alienated him from me, and frankly I had no confidence in family court so did not pursue contact order. Sons dad was a control freak and bully to me during our marriage, he didn't change after our divorce. Son has sent back unopened birthday and xmas cards money etc with a note saying to leave him alone, didn't want to see or hear from me again. I'm not sure he'll ever change his mind while under dads control. Decided best thing was to leave him to live at one home with one set parents and half siblings. I feel so sad for all in the same situation, it feels like a bereavement.

different experince to yours, it very complicated but short story in middle of going to court with ex as he wants unsupersived contact with 2ds I have never refused him contact but want it to be supervised due to him not looking after them properly, neglecting them when they in his care etc etc. I went to court not overly worried as surely the childrens best interests are at heart but was very very shocked, the cafcass did not have childrens best interest at heart, she tried to bully me in2 allowing my exs father in2 supervising, I dont know him as he was not around for the 7 yrs i was married to my ex but i had been told he was a wife beater, cafcass said that irrelevant just because he has hit a woman doesnt mean he will hit a child and she continued to pressure me to allow his dad to do it basically to save money rather than them getting someone to supervise. Because I wouldnt agree cafcass said they would do a police check on his dad and if came back ok she would put in her report for his dad 2 do it.But it came back he has convictions for sexual assault, the police check would not of been done if I had not stood my ground. Anyway back in court in 2 weeks to decide what now. I found the cafcss officer very narrowminded and more interested in thier rules and money than what is best for the children. But hopefully there is some good ones out there 2. hope all goes well.