Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Step-parenting

Connect with other Mumsnetters here for step-parenting advice and support.

Original poster

maintenance

39 replies

wheresthelight · 22/02/2015 11:24

hoping for some advice so apologies of o type this clumsily.

when exw and dp divorced they agreed maintenance privately and dp pays quite happily every month. the figure set at the time was based on have the kids every other weekend, they agreed a figure slightly less than csa guidelines (only by £8/week) so that dp could help out towards additional costs like school trips etc. we also buy all school shoes, clothes for here, presents, give them pocket money and dp pays into their savings accounts every month.

due to the increased cost of energy bills etc we are struggling so dp has reduced the amount he pays into the kids savings accounts. his ex has hit the roof and is demanding that it was part of the discussion and agreement to pay less than the csa guidelines. we have been through all the mediation paperwork and the agreement has been noted as less so he can pay for trips and holidays and big presents at Christmas. nothing is mentioned about the savings account. we also now have the kids for more nights than at the time maintenance was agreed and so in reality he is paying about £50 a month more than he has to according to csa and that's before the £40 a month into their savings accounts and £10-15 a month pocket money depending on whato chores they complete, so it's more like £100 over.

now whilst the extra money for us would be really helpful he has no intention of reducing her payments and neither would I let him. but she is demanding that the saving account money goes up which we genuinely can't afford it.

I have been through the paperwork over and over and copied the sections for her and printed out the csa calculator to show what he should be paying based on the current contact agreement so he can discuss it with her but I don't know of we are being unreasonable.

what do we do? if we put it back up then the kids will lose out because there won't be money to pay for school shoes (£60 between them yesterday) or for school trips. dsd's have already cost us £200 this year and dss wants one that costs each parent the best part of £700 next year. I know she will flip of we refuse to pay dp's half and I have gone back to work to help out with saving for it (and yes I know technically it's not my place but he really wants to go).

Any tips?

OP posts:
IDontDoIroning · 22/02/2015 11:30

Well you can pay what you don't have so.
He spells it out to her - the CSA amount is £x. This is the legal amour I will have to pay and it includes everything so no extras like savings pocket money etc so
I will either carry on paying what I do now which is £a +£b etc coming to £y, or I pay the CSA minimim adjusted for the overnights.
Her choice.

IDontDoIroning · 22/02/2015 11:31

Woops you CANT pay what you don't have

Original poster
wheresthelight · 22/02/2015 11:58

idont - that is pretty much what he has said to her already. he has also pointed out that with the additional nights and extras he pays she is getting almost 50% more than the csa legal minimum.

if we had the money then I would be very happy for the kids to have it without reservation but she seems to be of the opinion that now I working again that she is entitled to a % of my income also which I think is what has kicked this off as the payments to the savings accounts were reduced a year ago and he did tell her at the time.

Urgh why does it have to be so hard?!

OP posts:
FireflyLight · 22/02/2015 12:56

You've highlighted all your paperwork for her and explained the reason for the drop. I'm afraid the only other way is the hard approach. I understand she might be difficult but at the end of the day it's plain and simple. You can't afford to be putting in as much a previously because times are hard.

At the end of the day the only thing you've done is reduced their savings, not completely stopped it. If she doesn't like it tough. Leave her deal with it her own way but absolutely don't back down - especially if it's ultimately because of family struggles.

Ultimately these struggles will also affect her children significantly if you're left with bugger all because of a bit of extra in a savings account.

Perhaps suggest upping the savings again if things move back on to more of an even keel?

Original poster
wheresthelight · 22/02/2015 13:07

firefly I suspect unfortunately the tough approach will be the only one she understands. this is just one in a long line of issues.

Dp is at least standing up to her which is a huge improvement and has told her if he can afford it then he will up it again but as it is addition to everything else he pays then it's tough. the kids have over 4k each and they are 9 and 11!

OP posts:
westielover · 26/02/2015 07:25

He sends her an email saying "I have made my decision and I understand that you don't agree with it but it is final based on X and Y (the calc and the paperwork) and so if you do have any other queries here is the telephone number for CSA"
And just wheel the same sentence out again and again.

Something I have learnt along the way is that it isn't that the ex doesn't understand, it's that she doesn't agree. Explaining things and justifying things won't make her agree. Don't give credence to her by finding more "evidence" that you are right because she doesn't agree. That's okay. We all have different opinions. But if you and your husband stand by yours, and legally you are not doing anything wrong. Leave her to it.

Quesera21 · 26/02/2015 21:31

Have to say if you sent me stuff about what the CSA says it would get up my nose.

She is cross about the DCs savings account - this is not actually about monies to her. It is about the kids and their savings - which she does not have access to.

I think the animosity is not necessary, she is defending her DCs - not being greedy for herself. Most parents would

Storm15 · 27/02/2015 05:37

Is the savings account something they both pay into or just your DP? If it's just your DP, I'd be inclined to say that was money he alone was choosing to set aside for his DC, and none of Mum's business.

We set up CTFs / Junior ISA's for my DSD and our 3 younger children and paid the same amount into all 4 accounts monthly (just DH and I, nothing to do with Mum). As our costs have increased (specifically the amount we were spending on school fees) we decided to stop paying into the accounts and we just put their bday and Xmas money into them now. DH hasn't even told Mum but I doubt she'd give a monkeys if he did because she doesn't see it as having anything to do with her.

Agreeing finances / maintenance privately is all well and good providing all the parties involved do actually agree. The nature of our economy is that circumstances change and just because it worked once doesn't mean it always will though. If your DP and his exW are no longer in agreement, I think he has no alternative but to allow the CSA / CMS to dictate what he pays.

She has no right to a percentage of your income, regardless of whether that income goes into a joint pot. I'm not saying that's right (actually I think it's one of the major injustices of the CSA system that a NRP can pay less maintenance to their BC if they shares a home with SC while the NRP's partners' income is totally disregarded in calculations for the RP's maintenance) but that is the way it is...

westielover · 27/02/2015 22:24

Quester a you are very naive. It's it not about her having access to it - to. A lot of people, children are an extension of themselves in terms of what they are owed or entitled to. Many parents will fight over what is due to their kids as a punishment

Quesera21 · 27/02/2015 22:35

Sorry - naive about what.

A lot of parents do not pay what they should - not the case in this topic. Am I being naive in thinking some parents just do not bother to contribute to their offspring and go out of their way to reduce their payments - circa the self employed etc

westielover · 28/02/2015 03:57

No, tons of people try to get out of paying and try to reduce payments so they can have more cash for themselves. Obvious statement.

The naive statement is that because this is money mum doesn't have access to it can therefore only be for the good of her children that she is concerned about it diminishing. OP's household can no longer afford to pay in to savings. The kids spend time in OP's household. So it would not be of benefit to the kids for the household to be left short in order to pay in to savings would it?
No one pays in to savings over having money for necessary living costs, that would be madness. Only in step/ NRP land would it be considered a good idea.

There are a host of other reasons mum may be banging the drum and my money is on it being about control. Maybe not. But it is naive to not see that just because the money isn't going in to her hands directly.

Original poster
wheresthelight · 28/02/2015 08:56

sorry been dealing with some other issues with dss

to answer some of the questions

  1. no mum doesn't pay a penny into the kids savings and never has. it's all money dp has paid in
  2. we pay well over the odds by the time all the extras add up and I do not begrudge it at all. looking at some of the useless twunts people talk about on here I am actually very proud that dp sees the csa as his minimum and pays over happily everything else
  3. even when dd was born the payments haven't altered and dd goes without as do we in order to make sure she gets everything she asks for in terms of the kids
  4. hard line worked. Dp told her he was paying way over what csa would expect so if she had any further issues she could take it to them and he would pay what they dictate and not a penny more. she shut up at that point
  5. it's never been about the kids unfortunately but more about screwing dp over due to certain issues that didn't go her way when they divorced regarding finances
OP posts:
Original poster
wheresthelight · 28/02/2015 08:57

and she is the trustee of the accounts so she does have access to it!

OP posts:
westielover · 28/02/2015 09:02

Of course! Continue with hard line whereisthelight you've done nothing wrong and quite to the contrary, you've done everything you can.

IchBinEinNerd · 28/02/2015 09:03

if my x paid only £8 a week for each of our children then it wouldn't be difficult of me to expect more.

so you pay £32 a month per child and you've started a thread about the agonising that causes you?

Confused

As for the nonsense about saving for their futures while they're havning their childhoods NOW, I can tell you what the judge made of that when I had to go to court.

Stop putting money in to their savings accounts, it is ridiculous to give £32 per month and then put money in their savings account for the future. Children get ONE childhood and it's happening right now.

FireflyLight · 28/02/2015 13:08

Glad things are sorted Where's.

I don't get some of the comments on here to be honest about Mum looking out for her DC. Things are hard in one household so money has to take a drop for time being. And that is savings, not maintenance.

Dad is clearly looking out for all his DC. Older DC have to take a drop because Dad's household isn't meeting it's essential living needs which affects not only his partner and youngest child but also his two older children when they come and stay.

To make sure all his family's needs are met there has to be a drop. Tough shit what an ex thinks. He is doing what he needs for everybody in his family. The maintenance she gets for them isn't dropping so their essentials at her home are covered.

She contributes nothing yet moans when she really has no right to when it's her ex who has been putting in to the pot. Something that hasn't even been stopped - just decreased. Plus there's no mention of it not increasing in future if things even back out.

IchBinEinNerd · 28/02/2015 14:32

What on earth can a poster means when commenting that the mother "contributes nothing". If her children live with her then it is severely misguided to state that she "contributes nothing".

marriednotdead · 28/02/2015 15:00

IchBin OP states that they are paying @ £100 per month more than the amount CSA would expect them to, not £32 in total!

bf1000 · 28/02/2015 15:05

It - where do you £32 from ?

The father is paying £50 more than CSA, Trips, clothing, uniforms, savings accounts and pocket money. Children spend a lot of time at both homes.

Original poster
wheresthelight · 28/02/2015 15:45

ichbin can I suggest you rtft before posting such utter bollocks

I don't think she had thought about the fact they spend much more time here now so dp pointing out based on current arrangements we are paying far more than we need to has made her think.

OP posts:
IchBinEinNerd · 28/02/2015 15:57

Blimey! Can I suggest that you wind your neck in! I did read the thread btw. It didn't have me on the edge of my seat however, so perhaps in my haste to finish the thread I missed the odd detail.

The OP's post was confusing and there were a number of different figures mentioned. I agree with her that saving is ridiculous when they're all struggling now.

In my defence, the amounts the CSA suggests are always generous to the nr parent, so it's no boast to say that you're giving more than the CSA recommends!

Quesera21 · 28/02/2015 16:02

Whilst I agree with the OPs other half, reducing the savings payments - the assumptions about the mother have little credence.

It is now implied she will be accessing the kids savings account because she is the trustee and that this is all about control......

Katiebeau · 28/02/2015 16:14

Terribly sad that you are literally seeing your step children as a cost centre budget and sticking to the legal minimum as all you're obliged to give (legally but Hmmnot morally) and anything over you view as an amazing altruistic act.

If he could afford those savings plus shoes etc he perhaps should have paid more maintenance to start with. Clearly he/you want control over how it's spent.

It would get right up my nose too.

Do you add up exactly how much your DD costs you per day as well????

Sorry OP but it does sound like you resent every penny he puts towards his own children. It's just how your post comes across.

jovialjulia · 28/02/2015 16:58

It doesn't come across like that at all OP.
Heaven forbid a father should get to choose how he puts his money toward his children Hmm

lmb21010 · 28/02/2015 17:17

Katiebeau that's out of order. The father has obviously been doing all he can to support his kids and the Op has supported him to do so. She has even gone back to work to try to cover the costs. Unfortunately times are hard and getting harder, I've not paid into my own dd's savings account for years because we have been stretched financially and would rather make sure there is food on the table! It's a good plan if u ask me. If u can continue with giving the kids their living money and lower/ stop their savings for a while, great! Most kids don't even have any savings put by for them so they are luckier than most anyway!
Op I'd say to the moth, it's either reduce savings or maintenance, I'm sure she'd be quick to decide. X

Swipe left for the next trending thread