Safeguarding a friends daughter from her step father

[yogagirl22]

Hi all,
I have browsed on her for a while for lots of good advice. After searching specifically, I have started a new thread to get some wisdom on what to do about a sensitive situation.
I have a dear friend, and I am also close to her husband (as is my DH, I guess you could say that we are a foursome as we all go out and socialise). However, my friend has a 12 year old daughter still at home and is now remarried to our friend. I love them both and they are good people. They really helped me out recently when my own marriage was in a very bad way (thankfully resolved).
But, the husband/stepdad is really horrible to the little girl and I do not know what to do.... especially as my friend has now started to kind of join in. Its like she has been brainwashed into believing the crap that he tells the little girl.
Am I being over sensitive or should I be concerned?
It not anything abusive (although maybe? emotionally it is damaging her self esteem).
Basically, she has an older daughter too - now left that home because of the picking/nastiness. The older daughter will have nothing to do with her Mum now, citing that it is the step dad that drove her away at 17 and her mum did nothing to stick up for her.
Me and another friend have tried to call our female friend up on it but our friend gets incredibly defensive of her Husband. Claiming that the kids are badly behaved etc etc. and that he is a brilliant stepdad! Er NO
I have spoken to my friends 12 year old daughter, when I looked after her recently in the school holidays, and told her she can confide in me in confidence and if she ever needs someone to listen to her, and basically she confided that it is really getting her down. It is very awkward being around my couple friend when she is around as he continually puts her down, as it very tyrannical to her. She is the sweetest girl, okay a bit cheeky like all 12 year olds but she gets snapped at/ picked on/put down/ criticised for no reason at all. For example she tries to join in a conversation and gets shouted at not to speak/shut up/ what the hell do you know about it. I have never seen them complement her or show any real love. I am very concerned that my friend will lose both her daughters at the expense of keeping her husband happy.
What would you do? Shall I risk my friendship with some good friends ? Maybe speak anon to the 12 year olds school?
I had a terrible childhood with a dominant and tyrannical controlling father and feel that this lovely girl will rebel and turn out doing something bad, as that is what she is always being told?
Please give me some useful advice I hate to think of her unhappy
Thanks

I was that 12year old once.

When it's happening you need to stand up for the girl, tell him / her its wrong.

If it continues you call her school and social services.

I recently found out at 25 years old that my parents friends knew what was going on and they did nothing to protect me.

No matter what the consequences, you need to help that girl. Can you get in touch with her older sister to back up her story?

Oh god, that's awful and I really wouldn't know where to start.
I'd be inclined to maybe contact SS but I doubt there is much they can or would do, hopefully I'm wrong.

I would say that you need to be more honest with yourself though, it's not just the stepdad this girl needs protecting from but her own mother too.

Following her husbands lead does not lessen her own mistreatment, there is no excuse. They sound like thoroughly nasty people.

If you witness it stand up for the bairn as it's happening.. show the bairn that there is somebody who is willing to stick up for her.

Then I would get them both told about how appalling it is and maybe they should just go pack a bag and you'll take her home with you for a couple of days? Just to shake them up abit.. it's easy to get comfortable in a situation when it isn't challenged.

Can you contact the sister and ask if she could help maybe?

People that mistreat their kids in front of friends are far worse in private.. please help that bairn.

God you are all right - in a way I have been condoning their behaviour with my own apathy. Is it abuse then? Clearly something is very wrong I do not know where the Sister is now as she shacked up with her first boyfriend just to get away basically. I think it come to a bit of a head today (thats why I posted) as I went out with mum and daughter and it was dreadful as mum picked on her all day. It exhausted me and I did stick up for her, and told my friend she is lucky to have a wonderful daughter and all kids act out sometimes.. All I got back was a tetchy friend telling me that I do not know what she is really like, how awful she is etc! And how I need to be stricter not such a hippy etc etc In front of her. The poor lass looked mortified, humiliated and ashamed. My own Mum and Dad witnessed it too a month ago and told me off for not protecting the little girl. I feel like I do not know where to begin, but you are all right - it is bad and abuseful and something needs to be done. :( Its making me go off the couple of friends however good they have been to me, I should not give them the payoff of condoning their awful parenting....

Hi OP - really sad thread.

I think you need to realise that your friendship with these people is on hold while you prioritise helping the little girl.

Does she have any other sane relatives that you could talk to, anyone other than the mum's cohort? Is her dad on the scene? If not, and it's only you, and you're sure it's happening, then you should act. This does happen and you hear in the news about more extreme abuse situations involving the mum and a new partner. Who knows what the psychology of it is perhaps it's because of an insecure relationship with the stepdad and needing to 'put down' anyone including the children that remind him of her past. Who knows it's certainly wrong.

Families can develop traditions of abuse that carry on. You need to talk to someone outside about this. I recommend someone at the school, or call Childline for independent advice. Once you move forward with this you need to see it through, as a false-start could end up with the couple's anger at being found out being taken out on their child.

Also you could get in touch with the older daughter and help them both at once.

Good luck OP, not an easy one.

You are in a horrible position op and I don't envy you. I think you need to out the responsibility into both of them, the stepdad couldn't be EA if the mum didn't allow this man into their lives.

Your friends might have been lovely people in the past but now they are not. They are damaging a child. Forget the friends that you knew in the past and look at them through fresh eyes.

If a stranger was behaving this way to a child you were close to then what would you do? If you didn't feel a loyalty to the adults how would you act?

Thanks again you are right. I do need to look at this without any emotional feelings towards the parents. I guess in a way it has to be handled carefully. I certainly do not want to make things any worse for the little one. I was thinking of contacting the school, but if they then challenge the parents, the parents will certainly want to know who the little one has confided in. I am seeing the girl today at a birthday party event, I will speak to her and ask her to confide in her Dad. She sees him every other weekend and they are still close. I know it is hard being a parent sometimes and maybe even harder being a stepparent, but the step dad in question has been 'bringing up' the little one since she was about four. So she has not really known any different, only that he makes her feel bad. My own partner feels very uncomfortable when we are around the whole family and the non stop picking starts/ never ends. However my own partner is of the opinion that you just do not get involved in anyone elses family life unless there is physical/sexual abuse etc. Personally emotional abuse from my own perspective can be just as damaging and research does indicate that it can lead to life long depression etc. In my own mind I am just struggling whether it is abuse or just bad parenting?

You sound like you already know the right thing to do for her.
That young girl is lucky she can turn to you.

Good luck

This is a terribly sad situation, my heart really goes out for that girl. You need to forget about the people these friends were, because really they do not sound like good people.

My own dad always treated my sister (his stepdaughter) differently. When I was younger I always thought it was because she was the oldest, but when I found out he wasn't actually her dad it all kind of clicked into place. It still makes me so sad and a little angry that this happened, and that for years my sister was treated differently and my mum did nothing to stop it.

You need to confront this woman about the way she is treating her daughter, and allowing her husband to treat her. It's just not right. No child should be made to feel like that

It is abuse. Definitely. You are describing constant put-downs, the DD bring made to feel worthless, that her opinions don't count, that her mum and stepdad don't love or value her. That is emotional abuse and it can have a huge effect on a child.

Please pass your concerns on- I would contact ss, but at the very least talk to the school. Ask for reassurance that your name won't be passed on. This girl needs to know that someone will fight her corner. By all means, also encourage her to speak to her Dad, but you have toact as well. Otherwise, the girl has learned that there's not much point confiding in you-you listen, but you don't care enough to do anything.

If you are unsure of what to do, stay child focused, don't even think about the 'friend'

What would happen to the child if this continued
What would happen to the child if this got worse

That alone should help you decide what to do. You have tried to talk to your friend & she was not willing to listen. You can talk to her all you like, she doesn't see the issue.

I am very concerned that my friend will lose both her daughters at the expense of keeping her husband happy. That would be purely her fault. She is completely toxic, and no one deserves to live like this. I lived like that until I was 18, and I knew I was not a bad teen, quite the opposite as I learnt from a young age that my mothers approval (there was no love) was conditional on me being good & compliant.

It caused no end of issues for me, some I still struggle with & I am 40+ now. I haven't spoken to her since I was 18.

Could you maybe not offer the bairn to go with her to speak to her dad? Or speak to him yourself in private and really hammer home what his bairn is going through?

You cam make an anonymous report to social services so please do that. Like another poster up the thread I was that little girl although no one knew as dad was very careful to act like Mr perfect in public. I went through my whole childhood and early adulthood terrified and it has effected my life long term.

As others have advised you, please speak out on behalf of the child and protect her.

Where is her father? Is he someone that can be contacted or involved?

I'm studying to become a teacher and we have just did a module of study on child abuse, how to recognise it, deal with it etc.

Under the heading of emotional abuse comes humiliation. That's what is happening to that little girl.
Such a sad situation, I hope you can help her.
Must be a very difficult position for you to be in, OP, but the girl is lucky to have you looking out for her.

You do have to get involved, and you must know that.

I once coached a young lad in sports and his behaviour started to trouble me, it had all the symptoms described in the Child Protection course but when it happens you can't quite believe it's really happening.

Whenever I asked him if he was ok, he'd say he was fine but I got some background info on his home life and that was enough for me to report my concerns. I shouldn't have waited for that though.

From that point on I was not involved in any way, it was all dealt with by the professionals. And regardless of what most people think about social services, they will act. And that may simply be to offer the family some help.

You could tell the school, but if they've not spotted anything they may not act. At least if you report it you know it's been done.

I couldn't read and not post. I was that child once and it chips away at your sense of self & eventually you don't know who or what you are anymore , it robs you of feeling until you feel almost nothing.
Subconsciously you are always hyper alert/vigilant.

Luckily I had people who helped me/therapy but not all the damage can be totally repaired. You just make sense of what has happened and realise that the people who are supposed to love you & look after you are damaged. In my case what happened to me had happened to them & the generation before.

The buck stops with me & I give my DD the love & support that I didn't have/wasn't shown.

So please listen to all the other Mumsnetters on this thread & do something.......you will always be appreciated for any help you give.

It was very hard for me to post this Yoga and apologies if I've hijacked the thread.

p.s. I think you are lovely (yes I know extremely very unmumsnetty but

Please encourage the girl to speak about the situation to people. Do what you can and stick up for her, but also encourage her to talk to someone at school. Make sure she knows childline's number as well as yours so she can call whenever she needs to.

Thank you all again, it has really been on my mind a lot and I have spoken to a mutual friend. She was relieved I had brought it up as she was feeling on the brink of it too. But this support has made up our minds we are going to have a word with the mum in private first, while challenging the step dad on his nastiness. I think if it comes from a lot of people it can't be ignored and they will have to take stock of thier behaviour.
I am not really on good terms with my female friend at the moment. As I went along to the birthday do on Sunday as planned and she continued to berate and ridicule her, when I asked for directions and the little girl tried to help she was told to not be stupid derrrr shut up what do you know. I snapped and now the 'friend' is ignoring me.... bothered not really.
I feel sad that it has come to this really, it has made me feel better sharing with you all, so thanks again. Will let you know how it turns out....

She's a rubbish mother.

I hope the little girl tells her father poor thing.

Ring the father yourself and tell him what is happening to his child. Poor little thing.

It's not just the stepdad though, is it?

Hi to everyone who posted advice and have read this thread.
I have now spoken out to the couple (now ex friends) regarding this matter. I have been truly shocked at the response. i am now myself a target for their bullying and general nastiness.
It was a difficult thing to do. I had been pulling back from my female friend, waiting for the right opportunity to present itself, when she turned funny accusing me of not being there for her. The bullying husband then called demanding to know why I was such a bad friend to his wife. This put me on the spot. I then sent her a message saying my family were visiting and that I would rather speak to her in person but as she clearly has an issue with me (she had been posting about me on fb) that I felt uncomfortable with her and her husband behaviour to her daughter. I also said it was their behaviour not them that I had an issue with.
This has led to so much trouble. The husband rung after a few days claiming he had asked everyone else, but he is a model step parent according to everyone else, I should mind my business etc... The fact he so so angry makes me think I struck a chord. He said they asked the little one if they were horrible, according to him she said they good parents - well she would say that wouldn't she?
I wish I had said something sooner - or just gone to the school. I am now a victim of FB trolling too from them. The whole time my female friend has never spoken to me about it, the bully has rung me and tried to make me recant what I said and basically grovel to him. When I would not - started a little campaign against me (oh dear!!)
So although it was never going to be easy, I told them and in the process realising that they are not really any great loss as people.
Our mutual friend is going to keep an eye on how they are with the little girl to monitor it now.
Lesson learned - if you get a bad vibe do something, these people are not friends. A real friend might have disagreed but seen your view point not started WW3!!!

The unconditional love of a child. Of course she would say that !!

But a professional in childcare would ask far more subtle questions.

You're now the target so in one way that might actually help, if they think they're being watched perhaps their behaviour will change for the better.

You also need to protect yourself so I'd keep in mind going to the police about the social media thing if it spreads outside of fb, and if that pops the cork out of the bottle on the issue with the child then so be it.

You've got the answer you needed. I believe you posted on the right thread. We SPs get flamed for asking for support but our intention is to make sure all children are raised in healthy environments. I think Most of us are a great benchmark for what is abusive.

You describe something which is terribly abusive and the older daughter's response to the situation, IMO, is all need to know. This means their DM is also a victim of this abuse because she has started to parallel the behaviour. I'm assuming she hasn't always felt this way towards her children.

There's not a lot you can do now. Cut them off, stop looking at what their saying, and hold confident their disproportionate response to you is indicative of the nerve you hit.

Thanks again... yes cut them off now totally. Bully man said I had to wait until his wife had calmed down and then I will be asked by them to say sorry for offending them! Yeah right. I cut it dead, cos I am glad what I said. In fact if I knew I was going to be such a target myself, in hindsight I would have added more examples and not played it down in fear of a reprisal.
But I did what I could, and what made me feel really good was when my own dear lad of 16, said he was really proud of me for speaking up for the little girl, and that they and I quote "will have to take a serious look at their behaviour now Mum, cos they know the truth hurts" and that I deserve better friends.
Funny thing is they were so domineering with me and my husband that its kind of let a void - a good one though! I just need to let more positive people in now. But again a lesson learned always speak out, after reading on here the hurt it causes years down the line - we all deserve for someone to look out for us, if you get a feeling about a friends treatment, say something. I have learned now, a true friend will want to ultimately listen. Yeah you so right gettingmeback its hit them to the core.