Are we being selfish?

[impatienceisavirtue]

Apologies for the length. I will get to the question eventually!

DH has two children, DSD and DSD (both between 9-14). We have regular contact with them. Things were great at first but not so much for the past while. Reading posts on here in the last week has saved my sanity - I really thought I was alone, but it's an all too familiar story.

DH and DHEXW split up quite a few years ago following her affair. She went on to move her DP (that she had the affair with) into the FMH a month or so later and not long after got pregnant with new DP.

DH has had a couple of relationships, and generally DHEXW hasn't been too horrendous -awful to him but not interfering with his relationship with the DSC too much. She was ok with me at first - until it became clear just how happy we were and how well life was going for my DH. We do not even remotely rub this in her face, we just get on with life.

She has turned into a nightmare - and as far as I'm concerned, she's emotionally abusing the children. I have 3 DS and DH is brilliant with them. They're younger than his DSS, and obviously he sees more of them as we live together. He also facilitates a lot of the childcare arrangements (getting them to nursery etc) due to practical reasons.

He does not show any preferential treatment to them whatsoever, however. The DSS are constantly reassured that they are part of the family - though they constantly (especially DSD) try and make my children and I feel like the intruders. DH is brilliant and it doesn't impact our relationship - he's not blinded to what's going on at all. He has always maintained regular, meaningful contact, never missed a maintenance payment, never given her a reason to have an issue.

DHEXW is now doing what I have learned from here sadly is not uncommon - following links suggested, I think it's called parental alienation syndrome? It's horribly sad. She tells them that DH will forget about them, that he doesn't love them, that he loves my DC more, that he is an awful father (this in front of my children too). She tells them to tell him they don't want to come stay with us. She tells them to misbehave for us and that they shouldn't have to follow our rules - ones that haven't changed from before I was in the picture. As a result their relation with my DC is deteriorating, DH is in bits as they are almost unrecognisable as the children he raised and his relationship with them is in tatters, and they are clearly messed up. I know now why - she wants him to be alone and unhappy. She hates that he's just getting on with his life. I don't understand it, but I can see it's what's happening. I know it's awful but I dread them coming now. I know how horrible that is, but it's a constant strain, my children usually suffer as DSD makes every attempt to push them out and DSS (the eldest of the two) has physically hurt my DCs many times. They are allowed to tear strips out of each other at home, and carry on here - my children are all pretty young, and one is somewhat more frail than the others. He has jumped on his chest before - he has breathing difficulties. I find it difficult to remain calm, but I do.

We're trying our best. DH has tried repeatedly to talk to EXW, reasonably, about the impact it has on all of the children. She throws it back in his face and says that he does not spend enough time with the kids and that is why they 'resent' him - he regularly receives texts like 'I'm just doing you a favour hun[sic], if you don't sort it they won't want anything to do with you". She point blank denies having said any of the things she has - despite the fact she's said some of it directly in front of us and that we have seen evidence of it, as well as the DSS letting it slip a few times. We try and talk to the DSS but it unravels the second they return from DHEXWs house. We have tried everything. She just comes out with completely bogus irrelevant and fantastical statements. If this is done over a phone call she screams over him and he ends up hanging up the phone. She will often shout at him in front of the children and he has to walk away because he does not agree with this kind of talk - especially with shouting - going on in front of children. DSD is becoming more and more unpleasant and manipulative, because it works on her mother. I am struggling very much with her - though I hide it as best I can. Things just seem to keep getting worse. DHEXW is even going as far as getting in contact with DH's mother - who is a a bit of a sociopath (a whole other story, though he has no contact with her). She and MIL have never seen eye to eye - though apparently now they're quite chatty that they have common ground - to make DH's life difficult if at all possible. DH feels very strongly about her having nothing to do with DSC - with very, very good reason. It's not pettiness or spite, the woman is poisonous and dangerous. DHEXW is edging towards offering contact via her despite all of this. She refuses to tell him anything going on in DSS life and makes it impossible for him to find out himself. She encourages the children not to share things with him. And then accuses him of showing no interest in them.

Now - the question after all of that! DH and I are in a very happy, stable marriage. Other than this issue, our lives are brilliant and settled. We both very much want to have a child together, to add to our family. We know from conversations my DC have come out with that they would be over the moon with it. Things weren't great with my EXH at first, but for a while now have been on a very even keel - he sees them regularly and the three of us co-parent with pretty good success, very amicably. It won't cause problems in that regard.

We have been TTC for a a few months now, but there is this niggling feeling that I'm being incredibly selfish - that it'll cause further disruption with the DSC. Everyone else in the family and extended family would be over the moon. It is something we both feel very strongly about. But do we put this on hold indefinitely because of the damage DHEXW is causing? It's not going to get better any time in the near future, if ever. More than likely never. Do we sacrifice TTC when things aren't going to improve anyway? It's a genuine question. Should we put our lives on hold in this regard or is it reasonable for us to carry on?

I didn't mean to carry on for so long - I find it very hard to talk about for fear of being judged - the whole situation. I feel like the wicked stepmother, and like I'm getting it all wrong. As much as I would like help with the question above, I just needed to get it off my chest and feel like I'm not alone on this :(

We have a difficult ex to do deal with too. Mostly DH now ignores the craziness, and realises she wants a reaction and will do what it takes to get one. So we ignore it, and keep communication to a minimum.

When I was pregnant with DD and DS, the ex's behaviour became more provocative. So please be aware of that.

In our case at least DSS has more contact now than he used to.

I think it's a control and jealousy issue.

Have a child because YOU want to, it may make it easier for your SC's to love and except you all as there will be a blood bond.

That's not selfish, that's normal to want a child with the man you love. If you can manage it emotionally, financially, logistically, why not?!?

I really feel for you, there's alot of us here that are in similar positions through no actions of our own other than loving a man who no longer lives with his children. If you wait for the exwife to sort herself out and to put the dc first, you will wait forever. It will never happen and not having your much wanted child will be your biggest regret and all to please a 3rd party that hates you....

Also what Stepmooster said about the bloodbond, that can work too. If it makes the situation worse, you may have tough decisions ahead. I recently read a book called Divorce Poison, to help me to help my dp in his dealings with his toxic ex and the poor dc, might be helpful for you.

The author of divorce poison, Dr Warshak, also has a self-help DVD called 'welcome back Pluto' I suggest you order is as soon as possible while you still have some contact with your DSC and can watch it with them.

It is fairly inevitable that whether or not you have a DC with your DH, one or more of his DCs will choose not to have any contact and become estranged from your family for a time, maybe more than once. Don't underestimate the impact this will have on you and your DCs, as well as your DH. And you might want to consider the fact that in extreme cases, allegations of abuse are made. That will also impact on you and your DCs.

Your relationship will be pushed to the limit and beyond. My DH and I have sobbed many times as we reach the conclusion that the best solution may be for us to live apart. It's still a possibility for us. DHs exW has applied to court to secure an order validating her decision not to allow any contact. She has made allegations against us both. This has inevitably put strain on the co-parenting relationship I have with my DDs dad, as well. He is naturally worried about her.

Only you can decide whether you and your DH have the resilience to manage this on top of the pressure of a pregnancy, and new baby.

If you want to do some more reading, Google the term that sees to have been adopted in the UK for this - "implacable hostility".

Ok, first of all, welcome to our world. There are many (way too many IMO) of us, in this situation and my advice is based on personal experience which is not unlike your own.

My dH's exW had the affair which ended their marriage. They had 3 kids (now, young adults at ages 20 to 25) and I met their dad years after his marriage ended. His ExW's affair ended and she has been pretty much alone, for a long time. DH and I took 4 years of long distance "dating" before we decided to marry. I relocated 100 miles. I have one son, now aged 13 but DH has been in his life, since age 5 and is a great step dad to him. For his kids, I was OK as an intermittent girlfriend but one especially, was not happy that we were marrying. It was decided to keep this secret from the ExW as it would "upset her, terribly". Eventually, she found out and it's been pretty awful ever since. She does not have any contact herself with DH or me but their youngest daughter has taken over in the "punishing dad for moving on with his life/finding happiness elsewhere" department. We haven't seen his youngest SD for over 2 and a half years. I am the whipping boy/evil stepmother who took dad "away" and she is resents me and my son. DH is a fantastic dad. He too was always there for his kids, financially, emotionally and time-wise. That did not change after I arrived. Upshot of all this? Both of his daughters are now alienating me (I adore eldest SD and am so upset that she too has stepped away from me). DH can see why all of this has taken place and is massively supportive of me, which is good. He knows I've never done anything wrong.....other than exist in his life.

I'm now 51 and too old to have kids obviously but, we've talked about how wonderful it would have been to have had one. His exW and certainly one of his now adult kids would never have forgiven us. My advice to you? Carry on TTC. If it happens, it may well cause all kinds of problems but, if you don't do it (to please them) you still have all of these problems anyway. You'll be damned if you do and damned if you don't. Seems to me that as in my own situation, your step kids will probably only be fully happy when/if you and their dad are as miserable as they and their mum are so, do what makes you happy because if you stay "childless" because of them, you will regret it.

Definitely go ahead with it. He's in a family with you now and your future child which all your relative DC are a part of but which the ExW isn't.

Your family is YOUR family, and you both have DC from previous relationships. Ignore this woman's (and to some extent the DSC's) attempt to keep alive a family unit that broke up a while ago like a sort of zombie ghost ship.

She's not in your family -- ignore her. The best thing for DSC is to have to face reality, to realise that their dad can be 100% loyal and committed to them without being at all loyal or committed to their mum. It's also good for them to see your family as a stable unit.

I think many SMs feel so upset because they don't think they can have a family, or feel worried if they do describe themselves and their DH & kids as a family. At the same time many ExWs are so hideous because they are trying to preserve the old family order and encourage the children to feel hurt her ExH (the SM's DH) seems to have betrayed it.

It is vital that you forge forward with your new family unit and of course include the DSCs in it.

Also on a side note funny how SO MANY people have the same story. i.e. ExW who had an affair but then very vengeful to new partners who come on the scene years later. I think it must be because these are terminally happy grass-is-always-greener women who had the affair because they were bitter and dissatisfied and still feel the same way now, the rage just gets constantly redirected. Nothing will make them happy -- and who gives a f* anyway.

Of course you aren't being selfish. There are more people to consider than the ex and the DSC. You and your DH and your dc are all for it so why put your family on hold for a bitter ex wife and these two dc who quite frankly will just have to get used to the idea.
"it must be because these are terminally happy grass-is-always-greener women who had the affair because they were bitter and dissatisfied and still feel the same way now, the rage just gets constantly redirected. Nothing will make them happy -- and who gives a f* anyway."
Well said indeed!!! This is DPs ex wife to a tee. She is just a miserable mean woman who can't bear to see anyone happy when she clearly isn't.

thanks - I meant terminally unhappy! (which I guess everyone guessed)

Well said Croquet

Thank you everyone - I appreciate you taking the time to reply, and you're right, we can't put everything on hold and then end up possibly regretting it forever - especially as it's likely to make no positive difference if we don't anyway.

Sorry that there are so many of you going through similar. it is such a shame for everyone involved.

DH had already ordered divorce poison after seeing it on the "suggested books" when we were on amazon buying the "stepmonster" book I'd read suggested on here, thank you - hopefully it'll come soon!

Who knows - as has also been said, it may make things a tiny bit better. DSD every now and then makes comments that she has admitted are designed to hurt me and to push us to separation for her sake - such as "I liked it so much better when we lived at your old house Daddy". She also tells her mother that she doesn;t like it there as they don't have their own rooms and because the boys irritate them. The house we all live in together is significantly larger than the one he lived in as a singleton - they had one room the two of them shared there, and here my lovely DS1 gives up his room without question every time they are here so that DSD has a room of her own as the only girl, and we have a nice back garden whereas he didn't have one at all. They also all play together - though they bicker - and get on most of the time. DS2 cried that they had to go this weekend and said how much he'd miss them. Perhaps if we are successful in TTC, it might finally ring true that this is how it is. DSD especially constantly does her best to try and make me feel excluded. I am ok with it - she's just a child and I am the adult about it, but it's not nice she's doing it in the first place.

EXW is adamant that it should be us that change our lives around the children, and not that they adapt. She claims to have "spoken to professionals who back her up and tell her that DH is an awful awful father" but was utterly silent when asked if she'd told them all of the things she'd been saying to them and the way she'd been encouraging their negative behaviour. The fact is, they actually have a better life now, and do a lot more than they did before. They just refuse to enjoy it.

DH is feeling very sad after reading some of the articles etc on the subject - because it is so prolific and because it is so familiar.

We have, as a couple and as a family, had a heck of a lot to deal with (aside from this) in a short space of time and it doesn't affect our relationship - we deal with it together. I guess the one saving grace here is that we are working together on it and that it is not pushing us apart. I guess we'll just have to see how it goes.

In the 2ww now - testing Saturday - so hopefullly questioning the decision would have been too late anyway - I really hope so. It is something we both really want and I feel a lot better hearing that it isn't selfish and that it would be wrong to let someone else's bitterness take away from our happiness. Thank you all once again, it has been a huge help

Lovely! Hope it all works out for you....let us know