For those of you with teenage step children

[theredhen]

What do you do about bedtimes?

Dp has a very early start and normally leaves the house by 6am. He's normally falling asleep by 10pm if we haven't already gone to bed. At the moment he's working 7 days a week.

Dsd2 and ds both take themselves to their rooms about 9.30 in the holidays leaving dp and I with some time without kids.

Dsd1 sits in her room all evening then appears at 9.30pm and sits with us both. Dp and I like our child free time to talk about any issues that have arisen during the day. We have five kids between us, two full time jobs, two troublesome ex's so there can be a lot to talk about and we both agree we need that time to talk every day for the sake of once what was our very fragile relationship.

Dp has said he doesn't know what to do. He has explained to her that we like to have a bit of time to ourselves before we go to bed and has offered her a tv in her room several times to which she always replies she doesn't want one as she doesn't watch tv.

She keeps appearing at 9.30 and parking her bum on the sofa. Dp has been taking her out one to one and trying to treat her more as an adult so feels sending her to her room is sending her the wrong message. Dsd2 and ds seem to manage it without being "told" as I did at that age.

Basically he's struggling to know what to do.

Personally I think he should try and encourage her to sit with us earlier in the evening and then send her off to her room (where she has laptop, phone, books etc) at 9.30 ish like the others.

I know it's very early for some teens but dp and I can't lie in til 11am like they can.

Opinions?

[StephenFrySaidSo]

I suppose it depends what the real issue is for you OP. is it that you and DP aren't getting your private time together or is it that DSD isn't doing what you tell her?

[brdgrl]

It's very much a 'pick your battles' point, I suppose.
Privacy is really one of the things I feel most deeply about, personally, so I'm far more likely to have a consistent and clear position on those sort of issues than on others.

Too, I suppose that if there are wider issues in a home about boundaries and on-going problems with privacy or with a child who continually pushes at the household norms, then it becomes more important to address these things and not ignore them, and sometimes placating a child who is pushing at boundaries is a really inadvisable course of action.

[ChinaCupsandSaucers]

you can get round that very easily by being in a room she cant go in.

So it's OK for the OP and her DP to prevent DSD from going into their bedroom?
What's the difference?

[StephenFrySaidSo]

china it isn't a communal room in the house.

in my house we all knock and ask before going in another person's bedroom. not so with living room or kitchen. there is a clear distinction between bedrooms and communal rooms.

[StephenFrySaidSo]

btw i'm not advising to placate her. i'm saying take your private time where she cant disrupt it. this might piss her off or she might be happy to have the living room to herself, or she might get bored and actually decide she does want to be in her room- but either way OP and DH get their time alone. again, that's if getting time alone is the issue that we're talking about.

[brdgrl]

Well, adults do get to make rules and be obeyed, and children do have to suck it up. That's not as ridiculous a notion as some would have us believe.

But even if we ignore that.

OK. Let's pretend for a moment that it is reasonable in principle for the parents to be the ones to vacate a room in their own house, for a child.

I have to question the logic of the adults going of to their own bedroom, leaving the teen to occupy the so-called 'communal' space.

This issue isn't confined just to the parents themselves, either, but to any time the adult wants to send the kid out, presumably. For instance - have a very dear male friend who drops by about once a week to have a cup of tea and a chat. I'm not going to take him up to my bedroom to talk - not because I am a prude and he's a bloke, but because it is not comfortable (DH and I have the smallest bedroom, apart from toddler DDs, and it has nowhere to sit but the bed); because I don't know if his partner would find it odd or bothersome; because sometimes my DH is already asleep or wishes to use the room himself.

Could we sit in the hallway or poky kitchen? No thanks. The stereo - my stereo - is in the front room, and we'd prefer to sit and listen to music in soft chairs - and why shouldn't we? The front room is prioritised in our house for socializing. If the socialising is between myself and my DH, that's no different. And when the kids want to have their turn to socialise in there, they ask, and they get. What they don't get is to obstruct others from enjoying the space in the same way they have opportunities for, themselves.

if that's her aim then you can get round that very easily by being in a room she cant go in.
It's not really all that good an idea to let unreasonable situations develop and worsen by refusing to actually address them. Yes, the OP could spend all her time in her bedroom, where the DSD can't go in (although I am quite sure I have read posts on here before saying that a stepmum can't declare her and her DH's bedroom off limits either!) - but any reasonable person can understand why that is an absolute absurdity.

[brdgrl]

in my house we all knock and ask before going in another person's bedroom. not so with living room or kitchen. there is a clear distinction between bedrooms and communal rooms.

But if you walk into a 'communal' room, and you can see that someone is 1)watching a film - or 2) that you have just walked in on a private conversation - or 3)the space is being obviously used by another family member and a guest - what do you do, in your house?

Here's what I'd expect in mine -

1. Quick evaluation of level of interest in film - if high, a whispered "hello, what are you watching?" and - if no invitation to stay, a quiet withdrawal. If low, take seat, but no changing channel or nicking seats.
   
2. "Sorry, didn't mean to interrupt. Can you let me know when you guys are done?" and - withdrawal.
   
3. "Hello, guest." If adult is the one who's walked in, probably followed by "can I get you guys anything?", and then a withdrawal. If teen is the one who has walked in, perhaps a few minutes of charming small talk, and then a withdrawal.
   
   'Communal' in our house doesn't mean that there is no respect for others using the space. I think we are all happier with that!

[allnewtaketwo]

"china it isn't a communal room in the house"

Can I just say at this point that I got absolutely slated by a number of posters on a thread of mine, by suggesting that I was going to prevent DSS from coming into my bedroom after I found him playfighting in there. So seemingly even an adults bedroom is communal when there is a step child involved

[Anormalfamily]

Brdgrl, re your list, here's what happens in our house:

1. dss 12 "what are you watching?" Doesn't wait to be invited, sits down, sometimes between us. Then I have to say, "it's an adult film, sorry (my only strategy to get adult time). Dss leaves in a huff (despite having had lots of 1 on 1 time with dh during the day, just doesn't want it to end despite living here 50:50. That is simply rude and denying the adults their private time.
   
2. ds 15 "can you let me know when you guys are done?" Will occasionally watch stuff with us, during "communal hours" but I tell him when its going to be just dh and me. When he has friends over we talk about the adult "slot" and there is never any backchat, huffiness, its simply accepted., along the lines of "who wants to spend extra time with oldies?"
   
3. happy that ds is now naturally inclined to say hi and make a bit of small talk with guest, if dh doesn't encourage that much good will and manners in his dc that's his business.
   
   Thankfully dsd 16 is now mature enough to understand private time, even though we gave her loads when her boyfriends visited her norm was to ignore us/film and text sullenly in her armchair/ spread herself over only couch and dh would ask her if its alright with her that we now also want to watch a film, cringe cringe.
   
   Let me just point out from my first reply a few days ago, dh and I attend couple counseling (being a Disney dad one of our issues) and we've been praised for creating this space for us, drawing a boundary between adults and children and getting some visible results, I.e. kids withdraw (not forgetting that during holiday time kids come back down to TV room for hours once we've left for bed!).

[Tuckshop]

But this thread is about helping theredhen with HER situation. We can all talk about the very different house rules that we all have and what we feel about them and never agree as they are so different.

I think stephenfry puts it well in her post of 23.33.

[Anormalfamily]

I agree tuckshop, its just that I think it comes down to manners, respect and/or lack of it. And when I compare my redhens situation to mine I see certain similarities, I.e. sullen teen being passive aggressive and waiting to be shown clear boundaries.
I'm sure we all do what we think is best for everybody in our diverse homes, and Redhen has a hunch that dsd is simply being a pain and I agree with this estimate
Of course its easier dealing with own dc because the normal give and take situation is easier to navigate and we can tell them off when we feel they are taking advantage. More difficult with dsc and so I'd like dh to deal with them. Trouble in our home is that Disney parenting had them confused and they are only now getting used to the idea of not being dh bffs and we are as "entitled" to our time as they are to their time with dh/ friends/etc.

[Tuckshop]

I did find in my situation that the more I worked on making dsd feel wanted here and important to me, the more she seemed to encourage my bf and I to spend time alone. And she went from sometimes sulkily agreeing to babysit to practically demanding that we went out! I think my bf's (not her Dad) willingness to make her feel wanted helped greatly too.

Like I said before though my situation is unusual and not quite the same, but I do feel I had a similarish issue.

[ExcuseTypos]

I agree stephenFry's post puts it very well.

[ChinaCupsandSaucers]

I suppose it depends what the real issue is for you OP. is it that you and DP aren't getting your private time together or is it that DSD isn't doing what you tell her?

I'm not sure it matters which it is - does it?

If the DC is disrespectful, and refusing to 'do as she is told' (after being given the same opportunity to voluntarily give the OP space like her siblings have) them surely that is just as significant an issue for the OP and her DP as not having personal time together?

When teens get close to adulthood but remain living in the parental home, there seem to be two approaches - give them equal status which often leads to the adult home owners/bill payers compromising significantly on the quality of their life in their own home, or maintain boundaries and give the teens a choice as to whether they live within them or move out.

[theredhen]

Interestingly when I posted on here a while ago about whether dsd1 should pay "keep" next year when she starts work, the majority if replies were "no" because she's not with us full time (although of course, she's not with mum full time either). 1/3 2/3 split currently.

So it seems that a non resident stepchild should not pay keep but should have the privileges of an adult in the home. Of course resident step children (albeit not full time) should have to pay keep but can have the privileges.

Interesting

[Petal02]

So a non resident step child should get the perks but not have to bother with the responsibilities of being a young adult .....

[theredhen]

Petal, exactly that.

I wonder sometimes if we should treat step children as "guests" ie no rules to worry about, chores, contributing to family life whilst simultaneously allowing them all the benefits of family life such as holidays, buying of treats, helping with homework, giving lifts etc

Does that really make for well rounded individuals?

[Petal02]

Rather like DSS18 who is "entitled" to a key to our house, but is spared the expectation of behaving responsibly with it.

He can pick and choose which elements of adult hood he wishes to engage with.

[theredhen]

Yes I'm sure there are many resident children who don't have keys because they're hopeless at not losing them.

Step children are required by some unwritten law to have a key whether they look after it or not.

[ChinaCupsandSaucers]

I'm not so sure this is exclusively a step issue - I think that some of the posters who are championing the cause of teen DSC on these boards expect parents to be equally liberal towards their own DC's - there have been some very bizzare threads recently about the rights of teen DC's and how it is unfair to place adult responsiblities on their sholuders while they are enjoying the liberties of being a teenager!

There are undoubtedly those posters who go into bat for the step-child against the step-mum in all situations, but there are also those who support "oppressed" teens, no matter who is doing the oppressing!

[Kaluki]

Only on the step parenting board would an adult be advised to leave a room and go to their own room rather than tell the child to give them some privacy!!!
Crazy!!
My own dc have just been evicted from the living room and are watching a film upstairs! When we have all four kids here the same rules apply because we are the adults and we pay the bills!!!

[Tuckshop]

No, I'd say the same on any thread. This isn't a step issue. I'd have the same opinion about my own dd as I've expressed here. And I consider and treat dsd as mine anyway.

Theredhen you asked for opinions from those with teen step children about bedtimes and privacy issues. You've been given them. If you don't agree with some and it's crystallised for you that you want to insist you have that room to yourself every night after 9.30 then just do it.

[ExcuseTypos]

Same here TuckShop, this isn't a step issue, it's a parental issue. I would never ask my 2 older teenagers to leave the family space and go to their rooms that early.

But we always see bedrooms as spaces to sleep and relax. My DDs have never had laptops or Tvs in their rooms and neither have we. I suppose it's different strokes for different folks.

[allnewtaketwo]

I think one key element people are not taking into account is that there are 5 children and the DP is working extremely long hours. It is not at all healthy for an adult relationship where the only time alone together is in bed.