Why can't i assert myself more?

[brdgrl]

Semi-rhetorical question, I guess!

Pretty much since the beginning of our relationship, I have felt bullied by DSD. Our relationship has come a long way, I think, and we bump along together ok most of the time now, but I still find it really difficult to stand up to her.

She belittles my opinions; she lectures me on things I already know; and she generally treats me as though I hatched from a pea pod yesterday and stumbled into through the cat-flap (yes, even on topics where I, in my well-educated forties, have considerably more knowledge, experience, and insight - even on topics about which she quite reasonably knows nothing at all and I could be considered, by others, an 'expert') - I know that teenagers think they know everything, but it goes beyond that. I don't know how to explain it, but I assume some of you must have felt it yourselves...?

She acts as if it is her home, and I am a visitor or housekeeper. She never asks for permission to do or use anything in the kitchen, for example, and loans things out to her friends as if they belonged to her. She doesn't do anything to help around the house beyond the minimum required to collect her pocket money, yet she exerts ownership over the home as if she were an adult with equal responsibilities. But if I ask her to do even the smallest thing - today it was to get up from sunbathing and come inside to refill the water pitcher she'd left empty on the counter (a rare request from me, as usually I would do it myself rather than face the attitude from her). She asked me if I really expected her to do it "now?"; I said yes, and she pouted and sulked and slammed her way into the kitchen.

I know it is all very silly. She is 17 and does fuck-all; I should by this point be able to say something when she leaves a mess behind for DH/I to clean, or when she interrupts me, or when she breaks a house rule, or when - like this example - she's simply forgotten some minor thing. It should be straightforward, not the start of a 24-hour passive-agressive pout from her. But I still feel scared of the pouty reaction - why oh why?? I think it is because I know that now she will find some way to insult me or cut me down to make herself feel better - I can almost guarantee that at dinner tonight she will find a way of saying something intended to hurt or annoy me.

I really admire other women I know, who deal with their kids and stepkids in such a no-nonsense way and aren't the least bit intimidated. I want to be like that.

My dsd1 is the same. I avoid being in the same room as her due to her attitude and constant sneering and the put downs. I told dp a few months ago that it feels like living with a controlling emotionally abusive partner because I literally feel I'm walking on eggshells, it's literally easier to get out her preferred choice of cutlery for example than have her making snidely comments. It shouldn't matter, it's not important but it's just easier to try and find the path of least resistance isn't it? In my cast I know dp won't tell her off for being critical so I suppose in my own way I am tying to limit the effect of her rudeness on me and the household.

I suppose you've got to be strong, be prepared to constantly fight your corner and ensure your dp backs you up to the bitter end. Easy to say isn't it but the reality is, it's very difficult to do!

Thanks, redhen. That's it exactly - walking on eggshells.

People often question whether as stepmums we treat our DSCs "the same" as our own kids....I'd love to be able to treat DSD with the same authority and confidence. It's funny how much easier things are with my DSS.

I have been seriously considering some 'self-assertiveness- exercises!

Go for the self assertive exercises.

What about your OH? Does he tell your DSD to respect you and does he back you up?

Remember the saying: People will only treat you the way that you allow them to.

My DH does mean to back me up - but he also tiptoes around with her; partly because he is a bit of a Disney Dad and doesn't like to see her unhappy even when frankly, a bit of momentary unhappiness is exactly what she needs - and also because he absolutely hates confrontation and will avoid it as much as he can. (Whereas I think confrontation is just part of parenting a teenager!)

He is fed up with her at the moment, too, and complaining that her attitude has been shitty for the past couple of weeks, but he really struggles to adress it with her. He's told her off a couple of times this week for general sulkiness and disrespect, so he must really be frustrated!

I think you're right; she does need to be upset as it's part of growing up and understanding she needs to respect others to get along in life.

She might actually feel safer by being given more ground rules. Perhaps both of you could sit her down at the same time and explain how you would like to be treated and how you will give her more understanding if she joins the 'team'. You keep the roof over her head and would like her to pull her weight to show you both she respects that.

Ask her if there's anything she would like to say about her unhappiness and moods and perhaps you could help understand and support where she's coming from. It may be hormonal and she may need the support of a GP.

Try not to go in with an accusation but say you're concerned.

Just an idea

You may be on to something there. I increasingly feel like she needs a BLUNT conversation - not the sort of sensitive pussyfooting, but a real TALK about her attitude and our expectations. She is 17, and it is time for her to take more responsibility for herself, and to stop the pouting like a child.

DH has asked her about counselling a number of times, but she refuses. Her position is that she is not the one with a problem.

One big difficulty is that when she's asked about something directly, she will refuse to reply or engage properly in the conversation. If asked "what's bothering you?", in a sympathetic or casual way even, she will invariably say "nothing." If told off, she just nods and says "can I leave now?" the second DH's mouth stops moving - or just changes the subject - never any acknowledgement of what has just been said. It is the same if you try to give her a warning or instructions about something - she just says "yeah" and changes the subject or walks off....it is an absolute refusal to treat DH (or me) with any respect or accept that she doesn't already know everything. Dismissive.

Example...last night at dinner she was in a pout (because her brother sat in the seat she prefers and was not made to move...) and went the whole meal without speaking. Since she usually dominates the conversation, and gets cross if anyone else tries to set a topic for discussion, it was very obvious. So, the rest of us carried on a conversation which meant, for a change, that I talked about some stuff to do with my work, DD (who is two) talked and was the centre of attention for a few minutes, and DSS talked about a film he'd seen. It was rather nice, apart from the cloud of attitude at the other side of the table!

At the end of the meal, after DSS left the table, DH asked her why she was not speaking. SHe played 'innocent', saying that she just didn't have anything to contribute to our discussion (managing to convey with her tone that we'd somehow been terribly rude by talking about things that didn't interest her). It was typical - very passive-aggressive, very much managing to be just rude enough without crosiing a line that would get DH to confront it. It makes it very hard to address things, she just denies that she is being rude, or is upset, or is angry, but then she sulks, or is insolent, or simply ignores what has been said.

At 17, she is old enough to understand that if she chooses to share your home, there are expectations regarding her behaviour.

If she doesn't like them, she can leave, but I would make it clear that once she is 18, she is an adult to whom you are extending hospitality, not a child who you are raising and that your hospitality is not unconditional, even though your love and support always will be

I'm very blunt with my DD over her attitude - if I ask her what's wrong and she says nothing, I make it clear that if her attitude is a choice rather than a reaction, then there will be a consequence.

Even if she's not prepared to discuss whets bothering her, I expect her to tell me that she's working something out but isn't ready to talk right now - if she says nothing's wrong then the attitude is inexcusable and not accommodated.

Yeh. Sounds like she's passive aggressive and needs to talk to enable her to grow up and get her anger out. She sounds like she feels left out and is playing PLOM (poor little old me) instead of being brave and talking about it.

'Counselling for Toads' is a great book to explain more about the game of PLOM. Also @A Woman in Youyr Own Right' is a good book about assertiveness for both you and her.

Have you thought about mediation anywhere? Relate may be able to help. (I'm not a counsellor for Relate by the way). You both could lead the way and make an appointment and go first to show her it's not a scary thing to do.

DH and I went to Relate, for more than a year...the kids went twice; they met with the counsellor (together) once, and in a group with DH and I the second time. They didn;t have any interest in going again, and neither DH nor the counsellor seemed to think it was worth pushing them over.

Before I ever knew them, their mum died; DH had grief counselling but the kids refused it. Again, he didn't want to push them to do it if they didn't want to. I think it was a mistake - but hey - not my call.

I will check out the books, lou.

The truth is that DSD has been the boss of things for most of her life. That has loosened a bit, both because I won't tolerate it, and because DH has actually come around to the realisation that it hasn't been the best thing for either her or her brother. She has serious control issues (She literally shakes if she doesn't get to hold the television remote) and I do feel bad for her - only because she was given such false expectations about life so far and lacks a lot of the social skills and maturity she should have at 17. I feel bad - but at the same time, that lack of maturity and social skills is very tough to live with.

NADM, that's what I have just realised - we need to stop accomodating her sulks and bad attitude. I am seeing that they are becoming one more method of manipulation, and we can't 'fall for it' as we have been...I feel stupid for not recognising how passive-aggressive it all was, sooner.

I'm concerned about what will happen when she is 18 and goes off to school. She had, briefly, decided to put off uni and live at home - a decision she announced to DH and neither of them talked over with me! - but has since changed her mind. I want to be very clear about what we expect and what she can expect. I've told DH we need to have a serious talk about it and be clear about it all - what financial help we'll give her; what her summers/holidays at home will be like; what we'll be doing ourselves in the future...he is reluctant and has been putting it off, but it needs to be sorted. I don't want her to feel she has been tricked or let down or had things sprung on her...

My dh told his 18 yr old dd to respect our home and my and the decisions we make and ask of her (very little actually). We haven't seen her since. Over a year now.

When she WAS here, I always felt like she looked down on me. Didn't matter what I did or tried. Her disappointment in dad marrying me, was tangible.

That's sad Eliza22 but if you were fair and said if you change and respect us you will always be welcome I guess she made her choice.

brdgrl you can't force anyone into counselling and if you try too hard it could have a detrimental effect and shut them down for a long time. Sometimes people may need to take what seems a l-o-n-g time to get their head round stuff enough to be able to begin to make sense of their grief but they have to be the ones to decide when the time is right, even though it can be frustraiting and painful for the rest of us.

If DSD had such a traumatic loss she might have taken the role of mum and been supporting dad when you 'pinched' him and made her feel her efforts were not enough. Perhaps she feels that if she loses 'control' she may lose dad aswell????

Just a couple of theories to help you to perhaps understand her put not to give in to her.

Eliza I don't think we are at that point and I hope it doesn't get there - I'm sorry it came to that for you and your DH but yes, her choice I suppose!

lou, thanks. What happened with DSD was that even before her mum's death, she was quite spoilt and 'spirited' (this is a fact generally agreed by all parties, even DSD, not just my perception), and clearly was in control of a lot of things that a child normally would not be. My guess is that when her mum died, it was not only the obvious terrible loss, but also the extra element of being an event completely beyond her control, and she has reacted by trying to control things, and people, more than is healthy or possible.

Her role in the home after her mum's death and before DH's remarriage was not the one you might imagine - I have read about girls/teenagers who take over the mother's responsibilities and how that can play out. In this case, it was more that DSD was allowed to remain a little girl - but a very empowered, catered to, little girl. The expectations about her behaviour were more appropriate for a much younger kid, but the status was like that of a grown woman - hard to explain. (Comments by relatives and family friends have confirmed to me that this was not all in my prejudiced imagination!)

She got me tonight - she had a group of friends over. I made them dinner. Over dinner they were discussing books they had read, and she made a really snide (and completely, absurdly, unfounded) remark aimed at making me look stupid and ignorant. Which should not have bothered me, as in an actual discussion about literature I would wipe the proverbial floor with these kids - but I think that's why it did bother me. She doesn't just pick on my weak spots - she actually ignores or denies my strengths. And I feel like I have to let it go, because she is 'just a child' and to say anything to defend myself would bring out her 'poor me' act. "Actual discussions" are not allowed; the only permitted response is sycophantic agreement with her stated viewpoint. Which, again, is why I sit in silence through a great many "conversations".

Deep breaths, brdgrl, not worth it...

Oh Brdgrl. That must be just hideous. At least my DSD is a bit thick and only wants to talk about make up and how ugly other girls in her class are - don't know how I'd cope with a know-it-all.

But I do understand exactly what you mean about being mollycoddled like a much younger child but given adult status. I can't quite put it in to words but it is certainly the case.

I really feel for you and am so admiring of you that you've got this far. I suppose it's just deep breaths now and wine (if you drink!) for the next year. Can you at least see the light at the end of the tunnel?

Argh it's made me so angry on your behalf! YOU cooked HER friends dinner and SHE has the audacity to belittle you. Well, you know what to say next time she has friends round...

In the case of the younger teens, as we've all said before, it is really down to the Dad's to be pulling them up on things but I think at 17 she should know wrong from right by now. I have no time for her poor little me rubbish.

thanks, notso. Yes, next time she has friends round, I'm not even going to offer...
It took me a while (when I first got together with DH) to realise that it wasn't DSD I should be getting angry with, but DH. Well, I finally came around to that - but now I think, ok, she's 17 - at some point surely she IS responsible for her own behaviour, right? DH was apologising to me for her the other day and I said to him, "you know what? I'm NOT mad at you, I'm mad at her." And I meant it - there is a big diffference between a 14 year-old who is just acting the way she's been raised to act, and a 17 year-old who actually can see perfectly well that she's out of line.
(Yep, I drink! More in the last two weeks than usual...) :)