Holiday help... Paula Hall didn't - can you?

[origamirose]

Can someone give me some advice please? My RL friends are not much help as they don't really understand the situation (and don't think it's an issue... I think it might be). Before we start - I know that this is not a major major issue and I also know how lucky I am (spoilt actually) to have the luxury of so many o'seas holidays.

I posted some specific questions on the Paula Hall thread that weren't answered (no issue with that as they were probably too specific to be interesting to anyone else!). However... I'm hoping that some of the wise folks on here can help...Here's the background:

DP has 2 children - they've known me for over two years, we are very fond of each other and have not (to date) had any major issues with me. I have no children of my own (so sometimes find it hard to see the parent perspective - hence this post).

DP has a hugely demanding job which involves a lot of overnight travel during the week. His ex-wife is very demanding and if I'm honest I am resentful of her (she doesn't work, lives off generous spousal maintenance, is unpleasant about me and DP to the children and is generally difficult and demanding).

Our relationship is under strain due to his work and his ex (we are doing counselling which is working well) - I've said that I would like to go away for a week just the two of us so that we can focus on us - DP is reluctant because he is concerned about his exW and children's reaction (we both know that the children will be jealous, their mum angry).

We will be going away with the children for 2 weeks in August (and had 7 nights holiday over Easter - not o'seas). If we go away for a week we will miss one mid-week term time access night.

My questions are:

• is this (me and DP only holiday) unfair on his two children? (should we always take them)?

and, if not then

• how can we prepare the children for this? (without them feeling rejected)

Thank you.

Ii isn't unfair. If they were your natural children it is perfectly normal to go away and leave them with grandparents. They are not missing out - they are still having 2 holidays which is a lot more than many children. You don't give ages so it is a bit difficult to give advice on preparing them. Does DP have parents who are involved and could have them?

Not unfair at all. We always try to have a break with dsd, without dsd with our children (who are younger so different interests and cheaper as we go during term time) and every now and then we manage to go away just the two of and it is bliss and always reconnects us.

It really isn't any of the ex's business and your DP just needs to explain it to the DC and they have to learn that they can have/do everything. My DSD gets to go on holiday with her DM as well as us so she gets more holidays than anyone in our blended family.

Do you even need to tell them? DSD doesn't always know what we get up to without her in case it causes friction.

I agree with not telling them if it causes too much aggro. Or go somewhere deeply boring for DCs.

Agree with the other posters. It is not unfair- you are entitled to have a break without your SC.

I have one DS, DH has two DSs. We have one family holiday in summer - all of us. We usually have a winter break - just me, DH and my DS. In between times we have a variety of breaks. Sometimes me and DS, other times DH and one or both of his DSs. Now and again me and DH get a break on our own! Not too often as my DS lives with us- so the childcare aspect is more difficult for lnoger than a long weekend.

You deserve time alone with your DH. You entered that relationship knowing he had DC - fair enough - but it doesn't mean that you can't have childfreetime together - as you would have if you had met as younger people without previous relationships and children.

It isn't XP business at all. She just needs to know thatyou will not be around for that one contact session - and will make it up another time.

Step parenting is tough - it's been a real learning experience for me - and probably will continue to be.

How long have you and DP been together? How often does he ser them during the week? Could you go for a "long weekend" do it doesn't seem as big as a "holiday"? Are they going on a holiday with their mum? Could you and DP coincide your trip with that one?

When they are away with mum seems the ideal time.

If access is say a we'd night could you not go somewhere thurs to wed? Sorry if I've missed something

Once when we knew the ex would have not been flexible enough to "allow" us to miss a Wednesday of having DSD we arranged for her gparents to have her that night so we could get away. It isn't ideal but it could work.

Agree with the others - not unfair - children whose parents are together usually only get one annual leave's quota of holidays, so no reason why those whose parents are split should get double.

Also completely normal - me and my DP have had a week a year without the kids (his or mine) the last two years. And both our ex'es do the same without the kids.

To minimise the sense of jelousy - best thing would be if the DC are doing something with their mum the time you are away. But if that's not possible, either go somewhere they'd find boring, or emphasise the aspects of the holiday that they'd find boring - eg tell them about all the long tiring walks and museums you're doing, and don't make a big thing of the beaches. Would suggest telling them that you're going away, but only very casually and near the time - don't make a big thing of it. Eg - "btw kids, we won't see you next week as we'll be away, but will see you an extra night the week after" or whatever. And only give any more details of where you're going if they ask.

agree - I live with my DSDs and my DS - my partner and I have been away to USA on a couple of City breaks for 4 or 5 days for the last couple of years. It does you good to get away and is not unfair at all - what would be unfair is to never have a holiday again, just the two of you, because you have children.

Go, and enjoy yourself. It sounds like a break away with DP is what you need right now and it's not unfair on anyone.

I'm struggling with the concept of RPs not allowing NRPs to miss access as we have the opposite situation! But you can make it clear that you are happy to make up the time on another occasion and that you are prepared to be flexible in return.

Otherwise, I'd second getting a grandparent/other family member involved. It's what DH and I did with the DC that live with us when we needed some time alone recently so why should it be different with DSC?

DP is reluctant because he is concerned about his exW and children's reaction (we both know that the children will be jealous, their mum angry).

Do you do anything without the DC's? Cinema? Meal out? Day trip? BBQ? Are the DC's jealous of that, too? Is their Mum angry because your DP has a life without them?

I really don't understand your DP's position - if he is going to put his life "on hold" when his DC's are not with him, then he really shouldn't have asked you to share it with him.

Personally, I would go and probably wouldn't cancel the mid-week contact (unless there is a right of first refusal arrangement). Arrange for a relative to care for the DC's for the night, and go away and enjoy yourself. THe contact time that your DSC have with your DP should also facilitate a relationship with his wider family - so this sort of arrangement is to be encouraged, even if you weren't going away.

Have you discussed at counselling how your DP's attitude makes you feel? Your DP's reaction is understandably hurtful to you - it sidelines your relationship with him; it seems that his DC's and his exW are currently more important to him than your own relationship.

Yep, agree with everyone else. This is not an unreasonable thing to do, and really a lot of the 'drama' of it can be minimized simply through the attitude you and your DP project about it.

My DH and I have a commitment with one another that we will go away for at least a long weekend, without the kids, every year (we would do longer if we could afford it, actually!). I live overseas from my family, so my DD and I have also taken trips to see them, without DH and the DSCs (we have also made two trips to see them on which the DSCs did come). We treat all of this as normal and natural, not something to be negotiated or apologised for. It has been absolutely fine.

Your DP is going to make a problem over this where one needn't exist, I'm afraid. Good luck!

Sorry, have only read the OP but not unreasonable at all.

I have 2 preschool children with DH and an 8 year old stepson so can see it from both perspectives. If we ever have to move or change our usual access arrangements we discuss it with DSS and let him choose something instead. Perhaps you could take your step children on a theme park weekend or similar to make up for the missed holiday? They'd probably enjoy it far more than a dull adult holiday anyway.

Thank you all. I am pleased that no-one has told be I'm being unfair.
I agree that any fuss can be minimised based on our attitude (thank you! Hadn't actually thought that through).
To defend DP I do share some of his concerns re ex. Only last weekend she told the children (in front of him) that he never puts them first and they're lucky she does. This will be another example for her to use. She really is a very tough lady who appears to enjoy making our lives more complicated and this will be another excuse. He's in agreement that we need time away and he definitely wont stop it happening.
No willing family nearby to help out I'm afraid.

Agree with everyone else that going away for one week as a couple is healthy for you as a couple and also teaches the children that you are an important unit in your family. It's not like you are neglecting their needs for a holiday is it?

I hope you can show your partner that it is in everyone's best interests and if his ex is the awkward type she will always find something to moan about, you can't let your relationship be controlled by her.

the Ex will continue to make life difficult regardless of what evidence she can find. She'll find it, by the sound of it! just go, dont apologise, offer to see them more the follwoing week or whatever. It is absolutely none of the ex's business and at some point or other the Wednesday night will get missed, surely? what about when they go away with their mum (if they go away for hols) or when they have another arrangement? Just do it, it is absolutely right for you to spend time together.

To defend DP I do share some of his concerns re ex. Only last weekend she told the children (in front of him) that he never puts them first and they're lucky she does. This will be another example for her to use. She really is a very tough lady who appears to enjoy making our lives more complicated and this will be another excuse.

For your relationship is to work, then somehow, you and your DP will benefit from finding a way of disregarding this.

I know exactly what you mean; my DP exW is the same; and for a long time, DP agonised over how to behave/respond and just live his life, to minimise the negativity being passed from his exW to the DC's.
It was only after DP attended the "Putting Children First" course that he realised that we have absolutely no control over his exW reactions at all - and if we make decisions based on our anticipation of her reaction, then we are failing his DC's.
It has made such a difference to our lives. We are able to do what we think is best for our family without agonising over "what if's" - we know that no matter what DP says or does, his ex will react and respond in a way of her choosing, and it is not our responsibility to try and deflect it away from the DC's by changing our own behaviour.

Instead, DP has put in place support (such as counselling and school intervention) for the DC's to deal with the impact of their mothers inappropriate behaviour; DP can control the support and interventions offered, but not the actions of their mum

It was only after DP attended the "Putting Children First" course that he realised that we have absolutely no control over his exW reactions at all - and if we make decisions based on our anticipation of her reaction, then we are failing his DC's.

This strikes me as a most sensible view-simple but true.

Interesting - his exW does control our lives and that is what has driven us into counselling (which is working really really well for us).
I'm interested to hear about the putting children first course - NADM - could you tell me more about it? We agonise over the what-ifs for every decision that we make because exW is so difficult to deal with (and I am v sensitive due to my own parents' acrimonious divorce). I also suspect that our constant acquiescing to exW demands is not the best behaviour to model for the children.
Tough stuff, I wonder if I agonise more because I don't have my own kids...