Posted here to avoid wicked stepmother claims. 9/10 year old sleeping patterns

[toddle]

Hi started posting in sleep but figured I wouldn't risk it after seeing some of the threads posted previously.

My dss is 9 and a half. He comes every weekend and majority of all school holidays. I also used to look after my now 11 year old sister most of all weekends until recently as I have lots on with university work and constant morning sickness so she has not been coming for the last few weekends.

So there's a bit of background mainly because my s was a excellent sleeper and has been for years maybe I have silly expectations. By that I mean she goes to bed then wakes up around 10ish. I know that bit is a rarity dss does get up at 'normal' child times of 6.30/7.30 although a slight shock as he doesn't lay in like my sister its expected.

What I didn't expect and is driving me nutty is 'daaaaaaaad' at small hours in the middle of the night. Dp doesn't always wake up so after a few more of these he comes up to the side of the bed and shouts again. Practically every night without fail for one reason or another.

I'm pregnant it takes me a life time to get to sleep in the first place. maybe im hormonal and grumpy as not sleeping properly myself but being woken all the time is starting to make me want to pull my hair out.

Dp either deals with his request, go lay with him for a bit, lay with him for the rest of the night or puts his telly on at stupid times like three in the morning 'oh course his bloody wake his watching chuffing telly'

Sorry this turned into a rant it's not because his my dss and not my child or sister or anything, it's just I have never encountered a child of his age with sleeping patterns like this. Is this normal or am I being horrid when saying to dp it does my nut in. Not only the lack of sleep but I feel uncomfortable with him seeing me some nights with sod all on if I am asleep when he comes down to the bed.

Sorry for the epic post any thoughts welcome especially nice ones

Sorry bit rambly basically should say although my sis is a dream sleeper, i think I have the realistic expectations that very few young children lay in like she does. So the fact he is up early is not a shock or a problem. It's just being woken once of twice in the middle of the night I didn't expect

Toddle have a lovely.

Some children the age of your dss do have sleeping patterns like this. Not many, but they do exist. It's generally not down to 'parenting' in my experience but the child going through growth spurts/changes that make them less able to 'switch off'.

My own dd didn't ever sleep through (medical definition is 6 hours straight) until she was at school.

As to how you can try to break the cycle here are a few ideas.

A star chart with a massive bribe - a star for each night he manages to go back to sleep.

A torch that he can use if he wakes in the night. My ds has a light up Harry Potter wand so that he can 'magic' away anything scary.

Stop putting the tv on and try putting on a relaxation cd instead something like this one is good.

Thanks for your swift reply at silly o'clock . I shall be fetching some jaffas to accompany that soon.

Thanks for the tips but unfortunately dp doesn't seem to think anything of it so I guess no real point in his eyes to try and introduce star charts or anything.

We've sorted the torch ours is Spongebob courtesy of Santa himself.

Yeah I seem to agree with you on the telly front I think it's crazy. Then when his in a huffy mood the next day because his been up watching a film at three o'clock and not sleeping the two are of course completely unrelated.

Maybe I'm just jealous as dp goes back to sleep straight away and is now snoring delightfully in my ear.

What would you think to if it carries on me suggesting dp just sleeps in there with him from the get go? In two minds as although I would get some sleep now, not sure if in the long run it would be helpful. In fact im pretty sure it wouldn't be maybe just dreaming at this wonderful hour.

I have huge admiration for parents of children with sleeping problems. I can't possibly begin to imagine what it would feel like to be so sleep deprived. My friends younger brother used to have night terrors and it changed the whole family dynamics for quite a while with sleep deprivation and seeing their boy in such states. So I am aware it could be a lot worse I just thought the average child went to bed and woke up in the morning

Oh dear....given that you are suffering with morning sickness and DP snores, why not suggest he sleeps on the sofa with a baby monitor so he can go in to your DSS when he wakes and you wont be disturbed, how would it be if you also suggested to DP that he speaks to DSS about knocking loudly on your door rather than just coming in...9 is little but not so little that knocking first is out of the question...night waking is a hard habit to deal with at the best of times but as a SM rather than BM it can be particularly hard.

I have heard that having a television in the bedroom can adversely affect sleeping patterns and ability to sleep - maybe talk to DP in a 'worried the TV is adversely affecting DSS' way, rather than a 'don't encourage him by switching the bloody TV on' way (tempting though this must be!) :)

Plus it will be less enticing to watch TV in a chilly sitting room than from the comfort of a snuggly bed...

I understand your frustration, and I agree that tv is certainly not the answer. My children are bot night wakers, but so am I so I can't really complain!. They both have story tapes that they have always been allowed to turn on for themselves. Maybe that's a way forward?

BUT. I do think a child has a right to come and find their parent in the night if they need to. So it's ok to tell him not to shout to wake his dad up, but not to tell him he can't come in. So I'm afraid you need to make sure you're wearing enough so you're not uncomfortable at him seeing you.

Hi there. My DD has always woken a bit in the night but at 8 no longer wakes me regularly - at 9 I would think it not really acceptable to be waking you and his dad except if something is really wrong. Still less by shouting from his room like a toddler. He needs to be taught that it's OK to wake in the night, and that he doesn't need to wake a parent. An MP3 player with stories on it has been great for my DDD for times when she really can't sleep (with small speakers next to the bed, rather than headphones), and music is even better at helping her get back off to sleep. As Seeker says, he needs to know that he can come and get you if he needs you, but simply finding himself awake shouldn't be a reason to need you. Rewards for staying in his own bed all night can work well - though my experience is that boys tend not to be quite so easy to please with star charts so you may need money, sweets or more time on a computer to motivate him!

Re the early waking - I think you were v lucky with your sister here, many DCs do wake that early but again, at the age of 9, they don't necessarily need to wake you up with them. Maybe not everyone will say this is great parenting - but I regard 7-9am at a weekend as time for the DCs to have the house to themselves, unrestricted time on the computer, TV, etc. They get themselves breakfast (and have done since DD was 5 or 6 - DS is older) and when I get up I'm well rested, happy and ready to start the day with them.

At the very least, if you're not well with morning sickness, your DP should get up with his son and leave you in peace for a bit.

I agree with purple here and, reading through the previous posts, was starting to think I was on my own!

It's not acceptable for a 9 year old to lie in bed and shout for attention. The reason he is still doing this at his age is because it is now a habit to wake up in the night and when he does he needs help getting to sleep again because he's never had to do it on his own.

Does he ever have sleep-overs? What happens in someone elses house?

I think you need to start with your DH and tell him it's not right at his age and that it will make it hard for his DS if he wants to stay over at friends/go on school residential trips etc. Stress the importance of him becoming more self-reliant in this for HIS OWN sake as this may get you further than saying you have had enough!

If you can get your DH on-side then he needs to sit his ds down and tell him that things are going to change. If he wakes in the night he needs to get himself back to sleep - if his dad has to go to him then it should just be to quickly tell him to just lie down and go back to sleep - not to put the tv on or lie with him.

It's crazy to be woken every night by a 9 year old! The pattern is going to be pretty ingrained though so may be tough for a while and if you can't get you dh on-side then it may be a non-starter.

I really don't think you should consider sleeping seperately from your DH because of this - it needs to stop!

Thank you for all your thoughts if I don't reply about something's it as I'm on my iPhone so can't see the thread when replying.

No I do defiantly agree that he should be able to get his dad when needed so I've never suggested he doesn't come in at all. I would just prefer it that it wasnt every night and not so loudly.

I think it may be worth suggesting he comes straight to his dad and pokes him or something to get him up without calling him from outside the room or next to the bed.

Story books what a excellent suggestion. That's what they got my friends little brother when he was having night terrors and they seemed to make a difference. Does anyone know where I would look into finding these?

baby monitor and sofa, if nothing changes I shall suggest he trials it out before baby arrives.

With the clothing I feel stuck between a rock and a hard place. Our room is so hot at night and I have slept with nothing on for as long as I remember . I do sometimes go to sleep with a bikini top on something similar. I tend to take it of in the night if I'm honest though without knowing. Obviously I don't want his child to see with in the buff would scare him for life but then dp can sleep in nothing whenever my sis stays over because we know that she will not come in the room in the night and even in the morning she knocks. So I guess I feel a little resentful that he maybe won't have a little word which would allow me to do he same with peace of mind.

I will speak to him about it but after mentioning last night I'll leave it until dss has gone back home.

Also another question when you all mention to partners something about dsc's do they listen to you at all or do all stations shut down and believe you are being unreasonable?

Thanks again everyone

You can get story books on CDs (or possibly still cassettes) from your local library. If you have an MP3 player you can transfer them onto this (illigally...) and keep them for good. Or buy online - eg from Amazon or Ebay. Recommend the Roald Dahl boxed set from The Book People if they still do it at a bargain price. My DD(8) falls asleep listening to Harry Potter every night - which I would think ought to give her nightmares, but seems not to.

agree with purple and glass.

at 9 or 10 it is old enough for him to learn not to come in the room without knocking and getting permission, in all but the most dire emergencies.

He should definitely be trying other strategies first - listening to stories, self-soothing, etc. If he is sick or sad or genuinely frightened then at that age he still needs his dad at night - but not just because he is bored or a bit lonely or just has the expectation of an instant response. At thsi point, it sounds like it has simply become a routine for him, not so much a real need.

When there is a genuine need for dad, you need a strategy for that, too.
If you prefer to let him come directly in and shake your DP awake, then maybe that will keep you from being awakened - if he has to knock first, and you are the lighter sleeper, then you will be awakened, but you will have slightly more of a sense and expectation of privacy. Personally, I would prefer the latter. I think it is not just about sleep/night-time, but a boundary you want to establish anyway - at that age, it is appropriate for a child to be learning about privacy and asking permission to enter.

My DSS was similar until about 12. Partly it was need for reassurance at night, and he did have bad dreams. His habit began, as I understand it, after his mum died, so obviously DH was pretty understanding about it, and after we were together, I accepted this as something that was going to happen, but we did make a rule about knocking on doors, and that worked out well and avoided any night-time traumas (for all of us!). Over time, it resolved itself; DSS just got older and developed more skills for coping. Now he is 14 and we have issues with him staying up all night on the internet but that is another kettle of fish altogether...

I'd get the tv out if the room straight away. I really don't understand why anyone would put a tv in a childs bedroom

A nine year old is more than capable of regulating their sleep through the night. I suspect he has got into a habit of afternoon seeking behaviour. it is quite simple to cure although might take several nights but if dp doesn't want to see this as a problem, them you need to find ways to minimise the impact on you.

Get dp to sleep on the sofa if he's so keen to treat his nine year old like a two year old.