behaviour advice needed please

[mumothree]

Hi,
please help i'm a newbie at posting on mumsnet.
I have three children a daughter who is 8 years old and has ASD. A son who is 7 years old and the baby of the family at 11 months old.
I don't even know where to begin!!
My eldest son is having a really hard time at the moment both at home and at school. He has always been quite sensitive and strong minded he often had tantrums when he was smaller and always seemed to be quite bright.
Over the past year he has become very angry and aggresive both at home and at school. It has bacome much worse than normal bad behaviour and has been referred to CAMHS via the doctor. We have had a meeting around the child at school and now CAMHS are refering him to the hospital.
He is also waiting for another appointment to see a pediatrician at the hospital because school are worried as when he has a do he becomes pale and unresponsive and his eyes twitch he then becomes very calm soon after? School are saying he is quite complex at the moment!
He says he wants to die. He has held scissors and knifes to his wrist and throat. He has never actually hurt himself with anything. He runs away at school when things are bothering him says he just needs to go.He has also said he hates it when the children are talking all at once. He lashes out at other children. He has one best friend and he seems to take it all out on him. Other triggers can be Noise -normal classroom/ playground noise. Computer games as he becomes so agitated. He hates loosing at anything. If someone says something to him that he takes the wrong way. Certain clothes - he refuses point blank to wear polo shirts. My son is not distructive and looks after all his belongings. He has never even scratched a DVD or CD. Bedroom is very tidy because he doesn't play with his toys. He is scared to death of fire especially smoke or the fire alarm. My son will never be on his own in any situation, even at school as he is so scared.
He doesn't eat lots of sweets or drink fizzy pop at all.
I was just wondering if anyone had any ideas what could be wrong. Has anyone had any dealings with CAMHS?
Sorry the info is a bit higgeldy piggeldy was just writing as it came to me.
I'm so worried about him. He can be so lovely when he is not showing the behaviour above.
I just want to help him.
Thanks for reading

Have you read much about Asperger's? My girls have it although only DD1 is diagnosed and some of the things you are talking about sound quite familiar to me.

I don't mean the going pale and unresponsive although could that be some sort of response to a total overload of emotions?

CAMHS diagnosed DD1s AS when she was referred to them for school anxiety. We found them to be fab but I know the service varies greatly around the country.

I have just had an almighty battle to get DD1 into school. She is usually very passive but has gone into total meltdown because she's been to the dentist and is going in late. It is shocking to see such a change of character isn't it?

I would look out for some of Tony Attwood's publications on AS and see if you can use them to make sense of your DS's experiences.

HTH

Hi, and welcome.

I have a DS, aged 6.7, with ASD and ADHD who is doing his first week back in school full time since Christmas after a very difficult year.

There are several things you could do while you're waiting for help from CAMHS and the hospital (because even when services are good, it can be a frustratingly long wait.)

Your DS obviously has some sensory issues going on, so I'd recommend reading the Out of Sync Child.

I'd ask the school to keep a record of all his outbursts and meltdowns and the events leading up to them so they can identify triggers within the school environment, so that they find it easier to find ways of avoiding them. The information would also be incredibly useful if you apply for a statement for him, in the future.

Look out for The Incredible 5-point Scale (both books are on Amazon). Your daughter may find it helpful, too, since it deals with stressful situations and how to identify and communicate and ultimate avoid the panic involved. It's a good one to share with school, too.

Given all this information, ask the school if they could provide a quiet space for him, maybe allow him to retreat to a less busy corner of the classroom, where he is not alone, but no longer surrounded by other bodies and chatter from every angle.

I would also cut out the computer games. The paranoid mum in me would be at least a tiny bit worried that the pallor and unresponsiveness might possibly be something untoward going on, anyhow, so even if he wasn't getting so uptight and aggressive when he's playing them, I'd be worrying about that, in itself.

Try "People with Autism Behaving Badly" (book available on Amazon). It helped me to understand a bit about why my DS behaved as he did.
My DS was very similar at 8 years old. He carved NERD into his arm with a pencil. I felt so sad.When I told the HT she just said it was attention seeking. Yes, it was, because he was just so unhappy.It wasn't un til much later we realised just how awful school was for him at that time. To this day I regret not taking him away from that school.(He is 15 now). In his case it was a particular(male)teacher who had no idea how to handle him, and at that stage he had not been diagnosed with Aspergers. The school just had him down as a pita.
Is he in Mainstream or Special?

Hi,
thankyou to all for your answers. It has obviosly crossed my mind about Aspergers. His behaviour is different but then can also be similar to my daughters. He has a much greater understanding? Very confusing! ( don't know that much about it to be honest) I don't want to be the over anxious mother.
I too think the paleness etc is down to an overload of emotions and frustrations. The school has been fantastic and kept a very detailed diary of the events before, during and after the episode. School have also given him time out cards so he can remove himself from the situation. To my suprise school have said that he uses them correctly and that he doesn't take advantage by claiming he needs to use them when he is feeling ok. I was a little worried that it would become a game with him. He is only allowed to play on the games for half an hour a day. If we see any sign that he is becoming angry/ upset we turn it off.Don't want to stop him from doing the things he likes but then I don't want him to become agrevatated / frustrated etc either??

I guessed you might have considered AS. I think you should read up on it.

It's just that the stuff about noise, fire, clothing, not wanting to be alone, perfect toys, etc all matches my DDs perfectly. They are both highly intelligent and use this to work out the confusing world around them fairly successfully most of the time. It does come crashing down a times and that may be when you are seeing the anger and aggression in your DS.

Can you do a diary beween you and school to try to identify triggers?

Yes, both us and school are keeping a diary of the issues with concerns to my son. I was told there was a three month wait to be seen at the hospital through CAMHS so hopefully they might see either triggers or patterns in his behaviour through the diary.
Hopefully all will become clear with him, crossing fingers!?

I hope you get some answers when you do get to see them. In the meantime I would be asking school to give him a quiet refuge. My 7 year old goes to the library instead of the playground. Both my DDs find that having some quiet time out in the middle of the school day helps them cope for the whole of the rest of the day in school and at home. Maybe it would help your son too.

Thanks Al1son