Can I request the advices received? DS1 turned down for Stat Assessment

[starfish71]

My DS2 (6) under assessment for ASD and some learning difficulties has got the go ahead for a Statutory Assessment but my DS1 (11) Dyspraxia and under assessment for Aspergers has been refused an assessment 'insufficient evidence'.

I have a feeling that it went to panel without a report from CAMHS and I want to see who actually provided reports - am I entitled to see the Advices? Need to know before I decide whether to appeal or not.

Any one know? many thanks x

I'm sure someone will be along who knows more but I should have thought that at the very least you are entitled to see the Advices under Freedom of Information legislation.

Put in the appeal first and then talk to the LA. Of course you are entitled to see the advices but you won't know if they are lying as I guarantee they did not make minutes of the panel meeting. They will say simply that they saw them 'all'.

Stick in your appeal. They are trying it on, thinking you'll go away if you have one child that they have agreed to. Don't waste any time. They are very likely to agree to a SA on receipt of the appeal and appealing at this stage is very easy. If you want support or advice speak to IPSEA.

I don't understand why you weren't sent copies of the advices by the people who wrote them. Our DS' Statement was applied for by the school and the only advices were ours, Psychological Advice and Educational Advice. The Community Paed did not send adv ice by the deadline, but the Statement went ahead anyway. Those who provided advice sent us a copy automatically.

You should definitely be entitled to see the advices. Whetehr you can ask the LA to provide copies or whther you have to contact the people who provided them I am not sure.

I think the OP has seen the advices, but she is not confident that the panel has, so she wants the panel to send the advices that they received/based their decision on, because she can't quite believe that they are just vindictive rather than incompetent!

starfish

I would appeal regardless of which bod sent in the reports. You must put your appeal in re their crass decision asap.

Talk to IPSEA as well, they are helpful in such cases.

My guess for what its worth why DS1's case fell at the first hurdle is because of a) his dyspraxia and b) he's now 11. They could well argue the toss over why you did not apply for it when he was younger. It is very difficult to obtain a statement though not impossible for such difficulties.
As said before though, you must appeal.

You are your child's best - and only - advocate. No-one else is better placed than you to fight their educational battles for them, besides which no-one else will do so.

TBH the panel wouldn't know that another child in the family alreday has a Statement or not. It might be mentioned somewhere in the paperwork but it wouldn't affect the decision for your child.

I would phone the Education Officer named on the letter and just ask her to confirm whether the report from CAMHS was included. You could ask her to confirm the date on it or something which would satisfy you that it was included. You can tell her why you're phoning and I'm sure she'd check for you - it's far quicker than going through an appeal.

You obvioulsy feel that teh CAMHS report would fairly strongly help your case. JUst be aware that the panel are deciding on a Statement of EDUCATIONAL need. I have just recently had a CAMHS letter suggesting that a child at my school shold be Statemneted. But when I spoke to EP she reminded me that CAMHS have no right to ask for this - it is up to the school, the EP and the LEA as to whether the child needs a Satement for Educational reasons ie they are significantly behind where they should be / need additional support in order to access the curriculum etc etc

NappsShed I'm afraid you are wrong. It is very likely that both children were discussed at the same panel, and even more likely that they have the same Case Officer. In any case 'the panel' is an illusion!

Being able to see isn't an educational need, but that doesn't mean the child doesn't need a statement if the school can't meet his needs!

Starfish, they should have sent you copies of everything they used to make their decision. If you requested that they contact CAMHS and they didnt, that would be your grounds for appeal, they made an uniformed decision.

Delswife - do you mean "not being able to see" - yes that would be an educational need - in that the child/school would need additional resources / support in order for that child to access the full curriculum.

If both children had reports going in on the same day then both children would have been discussed. But in our LEA the panel meet once a fortnight and they are not the same people every time, so if only one child was having their application discussed, unless it was specifically mentioned, that panel would not necessarily know that there was another child with SN.

Oh thank you all so much for your replies. The boys were discussed at the same panel meeting. I have just rang the LA and asked for copies of the advices they received for DS1 - they said they will organise it and get back to me in the week.

They only sent me a letter telling me that DS1 was not going to be assessed - no other paper work included.

I do feel bad that I didn't do this last year for DS1 - only got dx'd with dyspraxia last year. His social and communications difficulties are still being assessed - just want to make sure I don't let DS1 down as he goes up to comp. x

You shouldn't be feeling bad, I would never expect a parent to initiate the Stat Ass process. That's the school's job, surely?

Starfish, did you ask them to contact CAMHS when you applied?

Ive just received the LA letter of refusal to assess and they enclosed two big bundles. One all the evidence i supplied and the 2nd bundle was all evidence they used to decide from others (info the school had provided etc)

Yes I did ask them to contact CAMHS. Not usual then to just send a letter of refusal and no other paperwork? Glad you had all your evidence claw3 - I hope now I have asked that they will send it out to me.

Our school not so good on dealing with any additional needs - quite proud of fact they only have one child with a statement..

Interesting, claw. When we were refused assessment they just sent a single letter saying they were 'pleased to inform me that DS does not have the very high degree of SEN that would normally require a statement'- no other reports or evidence.

I would consider doing a DPA request claw. I know that they've said that they'll send the papers but by putting it in writing and sending it recorded, they can't wriggle out of it and have to provide a complete bundle. They're entitled to charge you £10 for it but ours didn't.

If you haven't done a DPA request to the school already, for his school record, I would consider doing so as well.

'do you mean "not being able to see" - yes that would be an educational need - in that the child/school would need additional resources / support in order for that child to access the full curriculum.'

Absolutely, but many cases of Dyspraxia, and certainly Apergers traits can prevent access to the curriculum without additional support.

Nappyshed The panel is not responsible for the decision of whether to assess or not. The Case Officer is. The two children from the same family will almost certainly have the same Case Officer. How he/she presents the papers will affect the outcome. Also, even if the panel say 'yes' she can decide strategically to simply say 'no'.

WRT who's job it is to initiate a SA. Well that is a tricky area and highly political. Ideally the school will identify that they are not meeting a child's need and initiate a SA. However they are wage slaves to the LA who make the system less than transparant and schools are often frightened of:a) suggesting they aren't good enough, b)asking for expensive resources from the LA when they also have a request on the horizon for something else, c)are misled about their rights.

The OP should not blame herself for not initiating however, because yes, the school should. It is not until you get going with the whole process that you realise what a terrible mess the whole system is.

Starfish

I got a terse phone call saying that my DS's case did not make it through panel. Had that particular experience twice and got the LEA to agree to Statementing in the end, do not give up!.

If I had waited for DS's school to start the stat assessment process I'd be still waiting now. He is now in Y6; it is very difficult if nigh on impossible here to successfully obtain a Statement for secondary if it is not already in place.

Some schools too sit on Statement applications for ages thus delaying them further. If parents apply directly to the LEA they know its been done then. In my case this is why I also applied for the Statement when he was in reception.

Parents can appeal in the event the LEA say no to Statement, school does not have that particular right. Parents have far more power than school ever would have in this regard.

OP should not blame herself in the slightest, as Dels rightly states it is only when you get going with the whole process that you realise what a terrible mess the whole system is.

Starfish, follow up your request for all paperwork to be sent to you in writing.

I thought it was common practice to send you the evidence they have relied upon. How are you supposed to know what you can rely upon when/if you appeal the decision otherwise. Sounds like im one of the 'lucky' ones, receiving 2 bundles!

A law unto themselves as always i suspect. Good luck.

"By NappyShedSal Mon 29-Mar-10 11:56:44
You shouldn't be feeling bad, I would never expect a parent to initiate the Stat Ass process. That's the school's job, surely? "

I agree that Starfish shouldn't feel bad. But I don't agree that it is the school's job to apply for Stat Assess. It is the job of whoever notices that the child has significant SEN that cannot be dealt with by the school alone.

DelsParadiseWife how do you know 'the panel' is an illusion?

Thank you all for your replies and advice - will go through everything and will definitely
put it in writing that I want copies of all the advices they have for DS1. It is really difficult at the moment but am really grateful for the support on this site. x

Because there exists documentation from the Government to LA's telling them to stop hiding behind their panels and that the responsibility for the education of a child is the Case Officer's alone.

Also, there are never any minutes of such 'panels' or any record of them having happened. If you don't believe me ask under the Freedom of Information Act.

AND I used to work in LA Education dept.

To be fair they DO make recommendations, but it is up to the Case Officer what they do, and they usually look at their resources first.

imahappycamper It may not be an illusion in literal terms, but the legislation is clear that the existence of a 'panel' does not absolve the SEN case officer from sole responsibility of the difficulty.

decision, not difficulty