Found out the secondary placement for DS yesterday

[sugarcandymountain]

I called up the LA yesterday to find out what they've named in Part 4 of DS's statement. He's 11 (Yr 6) so due to transfer to secondary in September.

They have named the most appalling placement!! I won't even call it a school, because they themselves call it a 'School Outreach Centre'. It is run by a private company which runs a couple of schools for EBD and a range of Outreach services. The website describes their outreach services thus:

"Referrals to our School Outreach Service are predominantly of those pupils who:

?cannot manage a school setting
?require a period of integration
?only require a part-time placement
?have issues around travel
?require a more local service"

He doesn't need a p/t placement, he's in school/PRU for f/t hours as it is! It sounds like a private PRU to me. He cannot cope with change, it would be disastrous to send him somewhere knowing that he can't settle there.

He has AS with challenging behaviour, anxiety, ADHD, and other specific learning difficulties, but has high IQ and getting age-appropriate NC levels so he's very difficult to place.

Our preferred school is an AS specialist, residential school. There is no day school locally which can meet his needs - the LA consulted 20 different schools to find a suitable placement for him and only three had replied with a firm 'Yes' that they could meet his needs (my school, another AS residential and the LA's choice).

So, obviously I am going to appeal immediately. I'm going to write to ask for more information about the school to build up ammunition! I don't have much information about it as it was a last minute recommendation to the LA. I'm going to ask for a prospectus, Ofsted, SEN Policy, exam results and leavers destinations, list of specialist staff with their qualifications. I will also ask for an appointment to visit the school. What other information should I ask for?

I have legal support for tribunal and independent EP who will be able to visit the school with me. What else do I need to think about? I'll be writing to my MP, maybe the local paper?

Contact your MP as a matter of course, visit him/her at their surgery.

If you son has AS then a PRU is truly the worst place the LEA could send him. I presume that this "school outreach centre" has been named due to cost i.e it is cheaper to send him there but sod the emotional cost to both parents and pupil.

You're doing all the right things. Certainly appeal the LEA's crass decision.

LAs didn't used to be allowed to name PRUs! What gits. I think you've got everything covered - good luck with it.

You could also ask how much a placment will be there and then will have it to compare with the school you want.

You sound well organised and determined. Good luck.

Hi

They are definitely NOT allowed to name a PRU on a Statement.

The policy from the Dept of Ed is that a child with long-term special needs shouls NOT be educated in a PRU.

Our LEA tried this one on with us so I know about PRUs.

Our solictor said a PRU was the very worst place you could send a child with ASD and said we should avoid them like the plague!

ASD child tend to follow by example and PRUs are the dumping grunds for the 'worst of the worst' - or as a PRU teacher told us - the last step before juvenile detention.

AVIOD!

If you're looking for evidence to support your case try

www.teachingexpertise.com/articles/what-makes-a-pru-successful-2738 - see para 4 in which it confirms what I said above.

I guess as that's all they've managed to come up with and it clearly isn't suitable (and shouldn't be named anyway) it does increase your chances of your choice. Good luck! I'm sure you'll get it but what a pain that you have to go through this.

Thank you for all the replies. I got the actual letter with the new statement in yesterday. In fact the statement itself simply says

'Independent education provision that is highly resourced to provide for children with special educational needs including autistic spectrum disorder and behavioural, emotional and social difficulties.'

There is a separate letter naming the private PRU. Is this legal? As I understand it, the STATEMENT itself is the legal document, so the name of the school must be on there, not on a separate letter?

I went through a rollercoaster of emotions yesterday. The letter explains why they didn't name my first choice and tells me that the LA 'must follow the guidance in the SEN COP...You may wish to view the COP...' It all sounds so justified and official and final. I felt so disheartened on reading it and I know they are wrong! And then I felt angry for all the parents who take it at face value and don't appeal.

WetAugust thank you for that link! I've been told lots of times that a PRU is inappropriate but I haven't been able to find anything in writing confirming that.

I'm itching to start getting the ball rolling now with the appeal. I wonder if I should wait until I get a bit more information about the school? I'm going to try to call them on Monday but they might not be there at half term. I can't wait an entire week!

Hmm naming it in a separate letter sounds distinctly dodgy.

Would it be worth seeing if you can get IPSEA to help? It sounds as if your LEA are breaking every rule going so it should be fairly easy to dispute.

Do you have the COP? Would be worth starting there I'm sure.

If you read the bit on statementing in the COP I think they are breaking it. Presumably their argument will be that sending your son to your choice is not an efficient use of resources. However, as others have said a PRU should not be named on a statement.

Have you been given the time limits for appeal etc by the LEA?

Is this statement a proposed or final one, if it's a proposed one they are not allowed to name the school on part 4 and must put in on a separate piece of paper. If it's the final one then it must be named in part 4. That may explain the separate piece of paper, although not why they've chosen such an inappropriate school! Good luck with getting it changed!

Just tell them straight that a PRU is contrary to Dept Ed policy and that they had better find him a placement elsewhere. I did - and my LEA caved in as they knew they were just trying it on.
We also got the 'separate explanatory letter' - if you don't object that's what they will name.

they know they are in the wrong - they hope you'll not understand DS's rights and that will save them a fortune in not having to find a suitable placement.

i cannot imagine a SENDIST would back their choice!

Sorry, I was being dumb/panicked earlier. The school is actually named in Pt4, it's just I was looking at Pt3 where it mentions the independent provision.

Thanks saintlydame, I have the COP (next to my pillow actually - yes sad I know but it was my bedtime reading last night!). I have the time limits for appeal. I'm going to download the pages to fill in now but I wonder if I should wait until I have more information/have visited? But I definitely want a hearing before September so I don't want to wait too long.

I've been googling for more information about the school and it's definitely run along the lines of a PRU (intention is for pupils to reintegrate to another provision). I don't know if it matters that it is run by a private company - obviously they don't call it a PRU themselves so they might argue that they haven't technically named a PRU on the statement!

"...(intention is for pupils to reintegrate to another provision)..."

So there's your first argument against sending him there. He needs 'continuty' and this doesn't provide it.

second argument is - if integration is the aim - where do you (LEA) see him integrating longterm? Why can't he gp there now?

Also, I wod completely reject teh fact that his behaviour is 'challenging' - it may be so but that couod well be because he's not receiving adequate support for his SENs - that's the line to take.

Same with "he needs part-time ed" - no he doesn't if he's in a supportive placement. No Statement should accept he needs p/t - the aim should be to find a placement he can access f/t.

etc

Yep, WetAugust - DS has been unsettled a lot in the past year due to split provision, lots of appointments during school hours and half a term out of school. He would be really confused and upset to go somewhere that he knows he would have to leave shortly.

The private company run a few EBD schools and the centre is designed to feed into one of those. The LA originally asked the school directly if they would take DS but they admitted that they didn't have any ASD provision set up there yet. So the centre is like a 'holding pen' until they get some ASD provision put into place. But the school itself is still primarily for EBD and it only opened in September 2009 so I don't feel confident that they'll have the right experience behind them.

Has anyone had experience of appealing AGAINST an independent placement? I know that LA special school headteachers often get dragged to tribunal to defend their schools, but I don't know if an independent head would? They don't have to toe the LA line, after all. (Sorry, I feel a bit embarrassed about complaining about an independent place - I know everyone struggles to get one. ALL the maintained schools admitted they couldn't meet DS's needs so LA were forced to admit they had to look at independent.)

No experience of appealing against an independent placement BUT the cost of this placement and transport costs may not be much less than the cost of the residential placement that you feel is suitable.

This would negate the LEA reasoning on efficient use of resources.

They haven't put transport into the statement It's 9 miles away and I don't drive, it would be a 55 min journey each way by train. Not that I have any intention of letting him go there in the first place - I would home ed first. I've found out that it's often used as an alternative for prison for teenagers or those awaiting court or bail!

I don't think we'd win on cost grounds vjg13, even if I got them to pay for transport. The residential placement is very expensive (as it includes all therapy, residential costs etc) - I almost feel embarrassed asking for it. I will find out the costs of the named school though.

I spoke to my solicitor yesterday and she is hoping we can get the LA to back down before a tribunal hearing. We need my EP to look around both schools and we're going to see an independent Child Psych as well. I really don't want to have an appeal hearing!

I don't think transport is specified in my daughter's statement but she has always had it and I think they would be expecting to provide it for the 'PRU' with the distances involved.

I think that you have a really strong case and the LEA are in a panic to even suggest this placement.
I was desperate to avoid a tribunal too and fortunately the LEA agreed to the non-maintained school that we felt was suitable for my daughter. Good luck and let us know how you get on. The independent reports will really help and the LEA will see that you have the resources to go to tribunal.

Sugar
I don't know which part of the country you're in but it may be worth seeing if there are any independant schools that specilaise in ASD in your area. That's what he needs - not an EBD school.

If your LA are happy to fund his existing (expensive) placement then they may be amenable to transferring him to a more suitable ASD (expensive) placement.

To get residential you would need to prove it's needed on social grounds as well as educational. we argued that our DS needed a 24 hour placment as he could only learn / be taught these in a socio-educational 24 hour setting.

The LEA must pay the taxi fares to the nearest suitable placement - which is the school 9 miles away for the time being. Just make sure that it's clearly stated in the Statement that the LA will provide transport. They should also provide an escort to take him there and back if you can't.

Best wishes

WetAugust - the LA have already looked at independent ASD schools locally, they all said that they either couldn't cope with his challenging behaviour or had much lower-functioning children so wouldn't be appropriate. There really isn't another placement locally that would take him - even some of the specialist residential AS schools said they couldn't meet his needs because he has such a complex profile.

How did you argue that your DS needed a 24 hr placement? We're hoping the CP will recommend that but I understand the threshold is quite high? DS does need the consistency but I've been told that's not enough.

I argued that he was socially isolated because of his lack of independence and lack of social skills - both resulting from his ASD.

I also argued that he needed to be proactively taught social skills etc and that could only be done in a safe, sheleterd environment by those with expertise in ASD on a 24 hour basis.

It is very difficult to get a residential placement. However, if you're prepared to go residential then there are many throughout the country you could access -some even do 52 week care.

I know of ASD schools in north Devon (run by the NAS_ in Frome (run by The Priory Group), Cheshire, London (Hillingdon Manor) . try this link which shows a long list - and that's just one provider, there are more

www.priorygroup.com/pg.asp?p=pubOurSchoolsAndColleges

If I were you I would definitely reject anothing EBD and would also firmly state that any EBD behaviour he presents is totally as a result of lack of support for ASD. you need to get the idea out of their minds that he is EBD. TBH I think they LA are bullshitting to say that no ASD school could cope with him because he has challenging behaviour or complex dx as challenging behaviour is part of the deal at ASD schools - but they know how to handle it. i suspect the LA are making more of the challenging behaviour aspect and playing down the ASD aspect as it would suit their needs better (i.e. they can then suggest loacl placement and not have additional residential costs).

bEST WISHES

Also meant to say - don't pin your hopes on the CP stating he needs residential placement - i doubt fery much that will happen. if an NHS CP suggested that then the LA would take that as an opportinity to ask his PCT to partially fund the residential placment on health needs - so CPs stay well away from making recommendations for fear of recrimminations from their employer - the NHS.

And even if they did recomend residential the SS would then be asked to make an assessment of need on social grounds.

The best advocate for residential would be an EP and probably a private EP. I used a private one who recommended residential.

If I were you I would contact some independant schools yourself and discuss whether they would be prepared to admit your son. You may have to send them a copy of the Statement for their assessment. I did this and found that some will not take parental referrals or will charge for an assessment. Others will be more helpful and suggest a trial period.

You'll need to have a particular school in mind for SENDIST as you'll need to argue why that particular school can support your son's needs and the LA provision cannot.

Best wishes

Ooops sorry - when I said CP I thought you meant Comunity Paed - I can see you were talking about Child Pychologist.

Same applies though if they're NHS. I couldn't get DS's Consultant Psycholoist or Pyschiatrist to state categorically in writing that he required residential placement - although they agreed verbally it was what he needed and what he eventually ended up with.

An independant Child Psychologist would be much more open and back you if they thought residential was required.

Sorry - CP is shorthand for too many things in the SEN world