Is ABA-VB really for verbal children plus lovaas providers in london?

[firsttimer08]

Sorry to ask this question again. I know there are multiple threads on the topic already, however what most posters seem to suggest is to find the approach the best works for your child. I am finding it hard to make the connection across i.e. which approach works for what type of child.

Q: Would it be a gross overgeneralisation to say that VB is generally more effective when the child is already verbal while Lovaas works best with a non-verbal child? What does 'verbal' mean i.e. the child should be saying recognisable words?

DS is 15 months and no first words yet and little receptive language. We were strongly considering VB, especially as the programme can be structured over fewer hours but based on my above understanding it seems lovaas may be more appropriate. But 40 hours would be just too much for such a small child who naps twice a day for 90 minutes each

Q: Is it possible to find a lovaas provider in london who would do fewer hours?

15 months!
Why are you worried or even considering such an intensive programme for such a young child?

I agree not to get into a state over ABA/VB.

Ring round a few practitioners, and see what they say.

I started our VB programme doing 12 hours a wekk.

Some providers would not countenance this, so they were obviously not the providers for us.

We have only ever doen part time home programmes - apart form cost, we are a family too, and need our home to be just that, a home for some of the time, not just dd1's ABA centre.

I don't know about lovaas providers as such, but we use Sean Rhodes, and would recommned to anyone.

moondog - if I had another child who was presenting as dd1 did at 15 months, you can bet I'd be starting a programme with them!

SF, if you know what to look for, then yes.I'm just interested in background to the OP's situation.

Apart from ABA (and to an extent TEACCH thougyh opinions vary) you won't find much work across the board, and if you do please tell me(essay on it LOL)

I really think the key is to find a child like yours, but at 15 months I would think it would be ahrd to pin down, assuming my ds4 is anything to go by.

You might want to try something like BIBIC which encompasses a lot of therapies, not sure what their age start is but you can give them a googleandask (plus they're v v cheap- £5o then free), and youmight find some good ideas from general things such as floortime or ABA but I don't think you can know where your child is on the spectrum at 15 months

I know very little about Lovaas except that the woman managing my ASD MA isn't seeming keen, but I would be looking at a gemntle start myself.Alot of stuff used with ASD is great developmentally anyway- PECs for example, and anything focusing on engagement . But just in my experience, at 15 months the best thing you can do is really get down and enjoy her. bring in anything that you might find useful from therapy yes, but I wouldn't formalise the therapy myself yet. Every book, hug, game is perfect therapy already, no matter how much it seem to achieve. Even just the lesson that you want to engage is a milestone.

hi firsttimer

15 months!! seems very young to be embarking on ABA (it is intensive) or indeed to have a dx!

that being said ABA is simply a way of teaching children, and I have no doubt that any child would benefit from it's ideas - regardless of asd dx or age

(FYI - DS1 is 3yo ASD and 6 months into an ABA program and DS2 is 17 months non-ASD and reaping all the benefits!)

We chose VB for a number of reasons (though not for the hours - i am certain that Lovaas style does not have to be 40 hours a week) because it fit DS1's abilities the best.

There are a quite a few differences between VB and Lovaas - like NET as mentioned above - but the main one for me was the MANNER in which language is taught. Lovaas style revolves more around rote learning at a table (in general - which is why you get some people in the ASD field being wrongly anti-ABA) whereas VB teachs language functionally. (eg. in Lovaas they might teach you what a cookie is by using a picture sitting at a table, whereas in VB they will teach you what a cookie is in the NET in a situation when you WANT a cookie to eat... and from there generalise it to other situations). VB will always start you child off by teaching them to use language to control the situation around htem (requesting, selecting etc). I'm sure each method is effective, it just depends on what works with your child best, where he/she is at.

THAT being said,im just going to say again that 15 months seems a bit young for ABA, i have not heard of it being done younger than 2 (well 2.5 actually!)it is very intensive and im not sure any 15o would e .

starlight - im not sure what you mean about hte data? i didnt think there is any difference in data collection between the two groups?? (considering I spend 3 to 4 hours every week doing it myself!)

oh ok.

but the initial data collected to make these decisions is not going to be different between the 2 approaches - so I wouldnt suggest that doing Lovass to begin with is in any way going to give better/different data? Or am i misunderstanding you?

VB is equally as rigerous as 'Pure ABA'(Afterall VB is based on Lovaas - simply tweaked to incorporate more recent research/techniques). I know 2 families that have moved from one approach to the other and it is neither easy, cheap or straightforward and often involves 'treading water' for a couple of months so I would advise that it is important to try to make a long-term decision from hte get go.

And im going to be brutally blunt here - from my take on things (and it is mine of course - tempered by my rose-couloured glasses of course) both approaches are effective for more severly affected ASD children, but for younger children and the HF end respond best using VB practices.

(we have 4 tutors, 3 of whom do both approaches, a SALT who previously advised against ABA before seeing DS2 do his, and I have 3 families locally i meet with - that is the general consensus)

mum2fred , we expect by the time things are really up and running ds may be 18 months or so. There is the US study at Uwash on the effectiveness of using ABA on 18m-36m children. The study finds strong evidence of the benefits of early intervention. This is why we are quite keen on it.

I think the differences you state are probably the reasons why I would be keen on VB. DS is too small to really sit at a table (yet). Also we want to do 15-20 hours, firstly ds is too small for anything more intensive and also the US study shows successful results with 20 hours per week for 2 years.