School, IEP and more problems

[debs40]

Why is there no such thing as joined up services? Why are parents always left doing the diplomatic two-step with ASD issues?

DS is described as having 'social communication difficulties' pending diagnosis(6 likey Aspergers) is undergoing assessment. Long wait on the social communication disorder team list for ADOS and the like and we're not likely to be seen until next year. They are truly crap so I am trying to get a referral to someone who knows what they are doing out of our PCT area.

Anyway, in the meantime, school don't know what to do with DS. They can see issues (eye contact, not asking for help, social skills etc) but have had to be pushed to do an IEP and SA as he's 'doing well' academically.

After what feels like a long struggle, and after the intervention of the SALT team, DS has an IEP and will probably be escalated to SA plus now the OT has become involved.

The IEP is pretty crap. Weaknesses - low self-esteem, mumbling. Errr, he has social communication difficulties. Targets include eye contact etc.

I spoke to community paed who has been great and she was going to get advice from Ed psych. Thought some in-school training might help.

In the meantime, I've been working with school to establish good communication and raise awareness.

Today, I go in and teachers are all upset as Ed psych has been on the phone all stroppy about the IEP demanding they remove certain targets without explanation. No offer of training.

Why aren't they working together? Why should I have to calm ruffled feathers? The local SCD team have no literature to provide to schools and they are left to get on with it.

Not sure I'd want the ed psych involved either if this is the way she does stuff.

It's so rubbish

it is a ridiculous, can't autism outreach advise?

in a rush but would this is any good, it is a national strategy the gov for provide info for schools:
Primary and Secondary Inclusion Development Programme ? supporting pupils on the autism spectrum

sorry you are having a crap time of it. Maybe the Ed psych is fed up that he has a crappy iep and feels that she shouldnt have to set targets for him. But it is pretty off that you are the one that has to sort them all out. IEP targets should be smart (if i remember from my teaching days this stands for specific, measurable, attainable, realistic and timed although there are slight variations) and all teachers should know this. So a target to improve eye contact is pretty poor and no wonder the ed pysch is peed off. I would suggest a meeting to go over his iep and apply smart targets to his weaknesses as a starting point and maybe sending a copy to the ed psych.

In a rush as well. Just wanted to say you don't have to calm ruffled feathers. The ep was maybe right to ruffle them-teachers problem and senior team management problem if they can't handle it, not yours.

debs40

Being escalated to SA plus won't actually in the long term mean a hill of beans. SA plus is also limited in scope and will offer only limited support. There will be no one to one and no SALT.

The surest way forward here is applying for a Statement (sorry I know I keep going on about that but its the only way).

I agree Attila.

I agree also that school have not been very good at dealing with this or understanding it. I think there are ways of working with people though and they are supposed to be fellow professionals.

When I was in legal practice, and someone was doing a crap job, I would think carefully about the best way to right that situation and try and take everyone with me. I wouldn't just have a go and leave it with them.

I'm not saying that is what happened but I know the class teachers have been trying to help of late and I do think that these things are big asks of teachers without specialist guidance.

Maybe the ed psych needs to be called in to provide it? I can't see that ed psychs know much about these things anyway.

The fact is that at the end of the day you are trying to ensure a level of understanding and your child's needs being met. There's more than one way to skin a cat and they had just agreed to do Early Bird Plus with me, so I felt I was getting somewhere.

Maybe I'm being too soft??

Hi Debs,

No you are not being too soft but you're going to have to get real tough now with these people because at the heart of all this lies your son and his educational needs.

These people never work together effectively.
On a personal level I have always felt that there is a degree of mistrust and lack of communication between the various agencies involved with regards to my DS. I know that Junior School do not like having the specialist LEA teacher coming in termly to speak to them re my son and some other pupils who are also statemented. I got the statement for him after all, they just have a very short sighted and short termist attitude.

It seems like the only pro who has been any good in your case to date is the community paed.

I am wondering why EP has been on the phone to the school to remove some targets. I cannot understand the reasoning beind that at all. I would try to get to the bottom of that.

Statements as well are not just for educational needs, they can cover social and communication difficulties as well. At least on such a doc his additional needs will be properly documented.

EP though is an important person re school as they make recommendations to school re his educational needs. They can and do observe children within the school setting. They do have some degree of clout; their main problem is that they are under immense pressure by their employer (the LEA) not to readily issue statements.

Are school still willing to do Early Bird Plus?.

Last point but by no means least I am very sorry to read you're still going through all this.

Thanks Attila. You start to move forwards and then it goes back. You are right. I need to get to the bottom of what has happened. I have emailed teachers and SENCo offering to make suggestions on the IEP and will see what the response is.

School are willing to do Early Bird Plus.Can they ask for an EP to come in even if they are not applying for a statement? That might be the way forward.

Hopefully you will receive a positive response to your e-mails.

Yes the school can request an EP to come in to observe your DS within a classroom situation. I would be speaking to the SENCO about this asap.

Hello again Debs, you still having a hard time i see, feels like its never ending, doesnt it.

I have refused to sign ds's IEP until they put some real help in place. If they dont put some help in place i will go to the Board of Governors and scream discrimination!

Thanks, I will. DS has been terrible this evening so angry and stressed. It turns out that they did practice for the xmas play out of the blue and it was 'really hard work and I wasn't expecting it'.

Grrrr, this is the sort of thing I need to know.

I have offered to draft strategies for the IEP myself. This has usually had the effect of making them realise they should be doing things.

Oh, so I go to write a little message about it in his home/school book and it's not in his bag.

Claw3 - I signed it initially but it was out of date the moment it was produced as it doesn't factor in SALT recommendations and will now need to be adjusted for OT recommendations.

It's like pulling teeth! The worst thing is, they smile and are ever so nice and supportive as you point all these things out to them.

I just want someone to come along and go 'oh yes, social communication difficulties, this means we have to do x,y and z'

Debs, thats the problem once its been signed, they are reluctant to up date it, until the review is due, when is review date?

I didnt offer to draft an IEP, i just did it, i must have taken my assertive pills

I highlighted to them, which areas they had not covered, how the SALT recommendations could be used etc, etc then told them if they thought the help i had asked for was unreasonable to let me know.

Any verbal discussions with them go in one ear and out the other!

I agree. It was a bit of a problem when we were just confronted with it. I understand (and I may be wrong) that although it is good practice that parents' views are asked for when writing and reviewing IEPs, it is not actually a legal requirement.

Equally, I don't think there is anything to stop a school updating the plan at any time (not just review time) as needs dictate. Nor is there anything to prevent parental input at any time.

DS is to be put on SA Plus so it will need updating for that and to be honest the whole thing is so rubbish at the moment, it clearly isn't a functioning plan.

Debs,
I can only echo what Atilla has said - the only way this will be fully resolved is by applying for a Statement - IEPs are not legally binding, only Statements are.

The Ed Pysch could and should get involved before Statementing is considered but as yours seems terminally useless then I would just go straight for an assessment for a Statement.

They should all work together seamlessly to deliver and end-to-end solution, but they don't. Like you i spent days trying to coordinate my son's upport with all the disperate Agencies all hiding behind their own agendas and terrified that agreeing of agreeing to anything in case it cost 'their' dept money.

I would draw up the IEp that YOU want to see and present it to them. SENCOs are supposed to have received training and are supposed to know the SEN COP and Toolkit - but many simply don't.

You coudl also complain about the lack of training and understanding to the SEN Governor at the school and also to the LEA's SEN Dept.

It's all time-consuming and frustrating but it gets easier as you start to understand just how badly they are letting your son down and that translates itself into sheer determintaion to get what he's due.

(I used to be a meek and mild little soul pre my SEN battles - not now!)

It is a legal requirement in as much as you have to sign it iyswim. So the first IEP they provide you with is a draft for your approval really. Once signed then cant add or remove anything from the IEP without your approval.

You are quite right, it can be amended at any time if you request it.

Have you seen the NAS IEP guide, i have copy i can email to you, if needed?

Debs, must go and get some dinner on, let me know if you want me to email IEP guide. You are more than welcome to have a look at my draft and covering letter if thats any help too, i have no shame

Oh by Law you are entitled to participate in all IEP team decisions. Public Law 105-17, the Individuals with Disabilities Education Act (IDEA) Amendments of 1997. (i can give you a copy of this too)

Really must dash.

Thanks claw3 it would help to have a look at that. BTW, the act you quote is US legislation!

WetAugust - thanks I completely take your point. I will speak to them about getting the ed psych involved to help with IEP etc and/or statementing.

We are seeing BIBIC next week and the OT again in December so I hope I will have a clearer picture myself of DS's needs then.

Claw..... we will have so much to talk about at Bibic next week!!

Morning Debs, doh me! Sorry I was reading about the legislation last week, ive bookmarked the wrong link, will see if i can find the right one!

Claw - There is no obligation for it to be signed. There is a good practice duty to include parents and take account of their view.

I suppose IEPs would not be workable otherwise. Some parents don't want to be involved etc.

Teachers have said that they are happy for me to provide strategy suggestions so we'll start on that.

Hi Debs,

I love the alternative acronym for IEP given on these pages - Individual Empty Promise. They are at worst meaningless.

School may likely tell you your DS cannot or will not obtain a statement on the grounds that he does not need it ("he is too academically able" or some such guff)- do not listen to the naysayers. Apply for the statement asap, do not let the school apply for it. This is because in the likely event the LEA say no they cannot appeal. Also some schools take ages before actually writing. If you personally write to the LEA you know its been done then and if they say no you can appeal their crass decision.

Claw3 - same counsel is also for you above.

Thanks Attila, I handed my version of IEP to SENCO yesterday, even provided visuals that i want included. If they say no, i will apply for statement. To be honest i feel i need to get my head around the IEP and exactly what rights i have first and have a good understanding of it, before i go in guns blazing if you see what i mean.

Claw - biscuits and coffee conference on this needed at BIBIC next week I think!!

I completely agree Attila. But even with a statement, at the moment, I couldn't be sure I will get what DS needs. I don't know that anyone really understands what they are or how to meet them and I need to work that out for myself (or rather I will have to work that out as no one else will help).

What I''ve realised is that understanding of these disorders is pisspoor even amongst professionals in the field - who are largely genralists but who might dabble in ASD occasionallly for these multi-disciplinary meetings.

I went to a conference with Carol Gray/Marcia Winner on Monday and it made me realise that there is a whole world of expertise and knowledge out there but I won't find it in my town - whether with schools, doctors, or even the SCD group.

Debs - Right, ive had a bit more time to have a look at what i did have bookmarked, no dinner to cook!

My understanding is the Disability Act 2001 requires the school make accessibility strategies to plan for the education of disabled child and make these known to parents(IEP)

It also states it is unlawful to treat them less favourably and fail to make reasonable adjustments.

So if the school are failing to make reasonable adjustments and all you are asking them to do is make reasonable adjustments, by Law they have to do it (well in theory anyway!)

If you are disputing what is in IEP, by Law Section 332B Education Act 1996 states they have to resolve disagreements between parents and school about the SE provisions made for that child.

Although i dont want to go rushing in quoting section 100000001 at them! it has helped me to be more assertive knowing what my rights are and what i can fall back on if necessary if you see what i mean.

I have taken my crash course in IEP's, now for crash course in statementing!