my husband wants us to have more children

[Fio2]

i am not sure, infact I am petrified

Socci - great to speak to you, and dd sounded like she was doing some good work with all that applause!! Will email you now!

Could I just add here, that my father (scientist) is fairly sure that his lab has identified (and mapped) the gene that causes autism and figured out how the mechanism works. As Jimjams mentioned having this gene seems to make a baby/foetus more susceptible to triggers (looking like it is heavy metals) than babies/foetus' without the gene mutation. My father is hopeful that there actually may be tests for this gene and ways to prevent the triggering relatively soon.

Fio2 your DD has CP IIRC?? As you know my DS and DD1 both have CP, and its not genetic. Just very unlucky. I have a NT child and she is so much fun. I have decided that 3 is enough for me, but if I was to have anothr one, I would, even though the risk are higher for us (1 in 10) rather than 1 in 400.

oooh ooooh oooooh SA this is what we think happened to DS1 (heavy metals). Can I CAT you, or you me. Would love to read your father's work. I avoid heavy metals like crazy with ds2 and ds3.

Walsh's work on heavy metals and autism is very interestin.....

interesting even...

Sofia, that is amazing!!! Can I CAT you too? Or is your father's work published somewhere we can read it? Heavy metals grrrrr, they're everywhere...I have a mouth full of mercury, not to mention all the tuna I consumed whilst pregnant, plus dpt jabs and living near a waste incinerator.

Sure Jimjams, go ahead and CAT me, but I don't think there is anything published yet as they are just in the process of doublechecking all their results. They've teamed up with an autistic society in the usa and are getting lots of blood samples. Some doctor whose son is autistic cornered my father at a meeting and convinced him to work on the genetic aspect of autism. It looks like mercury and lead seem to have an adverse effect on the pathway. It's been 20 years since I studied biology at university so it's all a little beyond me and I've probably not explained it very well.
One thing that does seem to help with the behavior of autistic children is this compound called Juvenon that my father is developing to help with the aging process. Bear in mind that it's still anecdotal and not scientifically proven yet. And I have to also say that my father does make a small amount of money from it (98% goes to scientific research charities). You can buy it on the internet here .

I have been pestering my father to let me know as soon as he is ready to publish so I can tell all my mumsnet friends. He is the epitome of the absent minded prof, so getting coherent information out of him is difficult sometime. He gets on a topic (currently the progress on our loft conversion) and it's hard to get him back on the subject that you are quizzing him about. He does remind me on a daily basis to give my children vitamins and put them in the sun on a daily basis so they don't get rickets.
My ds (4)is just the same....won't finish breakfast until I explain what chemicals are and how firemen/policemen/ambulance men would be able to resuce people if there were no gravity.

ahh your father has worked with William Walsh. Glad that stuff is going to be published........

I've CATed you btw. It was Walsh's work (and your father's I guess therefore) which made me decide not to vaccinate ds2 (to avoid the thimerosal)!!!

I'll ask my father tomorrow if it's walsh that he's working with. My father is really doing the pure biochemical end of things and putting together a lot of info that has been around, but not coordinated between doctors and scientists.

Ironically, I've always been sceptical of non-vaccination. It now seems fairly clear that certain types of people (with family histories of certain diseases) do need to be more careful. I suppose it really does make sense. I am asthmatic and sulfites are the main trigger for me...I therefore avoid all foods with dried fruits and/or cooked with wine. Doesn't mean all people should avoid the same things, just people with asthmatic tendencies.
The wonderful thing is that we really aren't that far off (within our lifetime) of mapping all the genes and therefore really being able to have a picture of someone's potential genetic weak points and resulting vitamins/minerals/enzymes that they might need to supplement in order to prevent getting diseases.

Fio - whilst we did not have a lot of the worries that other parents of children with sn have - we were a little concerned especially when dd2's 20 week scan showed a soft marker for down syndrome in her heart. Although for us there seem to be an unspoken agreement that we would have more children.

Having dd2 ( who is NT) has been like being new parents - dd1's care was just so far removed form the norm in some ways that we did not know what hit is with dd2 - sleep deprivation, feeding on demand and so on. It is amazing to see the interaction between the two girls. I find it amazing watching dd2 develop compared with dd1 - each suprises us but it just amazes me how easy things seem to come to dd2.

Can understand how you would be petrified. I found it difficult being pregnant with dd2 from a testing etc point of view - as I already had dd1 - every bloody medical professional ( except for my fab GP) wanted to test the living daylights out of me and got most annoyed when I said no. Finally was referred to a good obstetrician who also agreed to my decision of minimal testing. It made me angry that people would automatically assume - being over the magic 35 ( that it is here) and already having had a child with down syndrome and a heart defect that I would want every test going.

I can still remember dh and I looking at dd2 in the recovery ward after she was born very closely to see if she had any physical markers of ds given that there was an elevated risk of subsequent children having ds added to the soft marker they found.

It is hard work having the two - and dd1's needs are nowhere near as great as some children with sn - am sure that makes a huge difference. I feel a little guilty that dd2 is dragged everywhere - hospital appts, playgroup, therapy etc - especially when I hear mothers going on about their babies routine and I think poor dd2 doesn't have one - very quickly she learnt to nap in the car and so on. Mind you I also hope that exposing her to children with a variety of sn will help to make her a more empathic, compassionate, thoughtful etc young lady.

having said all that - I look at dd2 and want another and dh has said no - he is too old for all this sleep deprivation, worry and so on.

sorry for the ramble - probably no help at all.

eidsvoid, do not spend even one sec worrying about the lack of routine in your dd's life. I am a firm believer that it is consistancy, not routine that is important. If your children can predict your behavior, then it doesn't matter that they don't know what tomorrow will bring as they will always know that you will love and support them through it. I think that gives children independence, confidence and an ability to deal with what the world will bring.

yeah I was skeptical of non-vaccination until having ds1 He had mercury exposure in other ways- tuna steak was a favourite meal for him before he turned into bread-only boy, and I've avoided tuna with ds2 (and now ds3 of course). Of course it's not the vaccinations themselves that are the problem it's the added ingredients......

That's absolutely fascinating Sofia. I also remembering you posting something about vitamin C and asthma (and getting bashed a bit for it, iirc) and look at all the stuff now!
I still feel pretty bitter about being deceived into vaccinating ds with mercury - and he's OK. Mildly dyspraxic but definitely not autistic. I still think, well, what were they thinking?
HITC, yes, it is totally normal to wonder if you will love another child as much. I was actually fairly tormented by that though and felt hideously disloyal to ds by getting pregnant. But of course, you do love your new baby as much and ds loves his sister...99% of the time!

hi Fio, I've tried to read the whole thread but leaving work in a mo. Just wanted to say I'm also with you on feeling terrified and up and down etc.

When I think about this baby inside me now I think would it be better to have a boy then if I compare him to Lottie i can put down some of the differences to well he was quicker cos her was a boy etc.

I've also thought I wonder if I could squeeze a 3rd kid into our lives somewhere so Lottie has 2 siblings to share looking out for her, if needs be, when i'm an old and mad woman. Someone else for the (hopefully) NT child to plan my funeral with other than lottie who might not be all that helpful with things like that.

God I'm mad already, don't know about when I get old.

The things we put our minds through, the ifs the buts the maybes when at the end of the day what will be will be aye.

Anyway I'll try and pick this up and read properly when I am at home tonight but just wanted to say for now, i understand your are petrified, but I also think it's really nice your DH wants more.

TC x

God, this thread is to close to my heart, Fio, not sure I can post right now...

I ate tuna three times a week when pregnant with DD

after today I think the answer is def no sigh

What's up mate, what's happened, are you ok?

just thinking I am coping ok at the mo.

I met my friend, her secnd born had down syndrome, then her third born had autism and she has three more on top. then i bumped into someone I hadnt seen for ages and her third son has also been diagnosed with autism (she already has 2 with it), then on friday I went to a presentation and theere were three brothers with different special needs all at my dd's school and I just though very very selfishly I might be better off if I just stop now, do ykwim? as I am so shallow and things really dont need to get any more complicated

I sound like a complete cow and my husband would be horrified. But maybe I just dont want any more and I am looking for excuses, on top of the feeling sick at the thought. maybe it isnt the special needs bit, maybe its just I dont want

Hi Fio, you don't sound like a cow and FAR from shallow! Its a very tough decision and maybe the answer at the moment is "not now".... not necessarily not ever, just not now? Would DH be understanding about that? People have a lot of ideas about age gaps but the reality is that no-one knows how well or not siblings are going to get on and the age gap often makes no difference, whether its a big gap or a small gap.