any doctors on here?? or anyone who can help with this?!

[jennybensmummy]

i posted the other day about the paediatricians putting that i have post natal psychosis on my sons dla report and in his notes etc when i havent got it and never had. i did however have post natal depression, not bad though just tablets for a few months. I asked the gp to clarify this in a letter so i could send that with my complaint about this information being in my sons notes etc but the gp refuses as says that post natal psychosis is just the old fashioned term for post natal depression that has since been changed to mean actually psychosis which is much worse than just your typical pnd. so what im asking is this was only put in bens notes last november, and he is only 3 years old and i find it hard to believe these changes happened that recently so i think therefore that its no excuse to say this is just an old term as surely at one time autistic kids (like my son) were classed as just naughty btu nowadays this wouldnt be allowed to be written in notes so whats the difference really??? anyway essentially what im asking is your take on this and how long ago the term post natal psychosis instead of post natal depression was actually in common use?? ie do i have an arguement here about the term or just in general about it being in my sons notes, i was intending on complaining about both these things but now im wondering if ill be shot down if its just an old term, but i was thinking it seems like a very old term if that makes sense?!
well i have ranted and hope this makes sense?!
thanks in advance if anyone can help?!

the original post i did is here

why are they puitting your mental state on his dla forms anyway? surely it is not even necessary

Hi there,

I have been a lurker for a while (trying to get up courage to post as im new), so i hope you dont mind me posting on here. I have read your other thread and did a little search on the term and came up with this website:

www.pnpsupport.org.nz/

From what i can read PND and PNP are different things i.e the PNP being a more severe case of PND

If this isnt what you suffered then i would definetly look at making a complaint about it being in your notes. Can you talk to the PALS service at all? Or a counsellor to try and get a medical description of the two terms?

HTH

well no thats my main complaint but also i want it amended in my sons records as surely it shouldnt be there either unless they are saying im not caring for him properly?! am currently waiting for a copy of bens notes to be sent to me! it was in the mobility section too so not sure how it would make any difference in the slightest!! it was put in the any further comments section of the form!!!!

Even if the change was that recent (which I don't believe) seeing that it has happened and psychosis now means psychosis it would be perfectly reasonable for you to ask for a clarifying note to be attached to your son's notes.

hi beldaran and welcome, hope you post more now you have had the courage to post first time, it took me ages to too and i still dont post that often!

i have phoned pals and they keep saying they will get back to me, another person fobbing us off i think!! so im thinking it has to go to a formal complaint next!!! I read that site too and there is no way i had that so to me even if this psychosis is an old term for pnd they should just not be using it anymore unless i fit into the new term, which i dont at all!!! Its just a mess, noone is really interested i have tried phoning everyone about it so im thinking this weekend ill start to write the formal complaint so that once i have the copy of bens notes i can quote from his notes about the bits im not happy with etc as well as complaining about the dla form being done with that on!! why is it all such a battle!!

Thanks for the welcome, i hope to find this section a little more active than another one i subscribe too.

If you have already contacted PALS then the only other place i can think of is the Parent Partnership. I dont know if this is something they can help with but i know that they help parents with DLA forms and appeals (im training to be an Independant Parental Supporter with them). So they might be able to point you in the right direction or give you other options.

oh yes thanks i hadnt thought of them, ill give them a ring and ask if they can help at all good idea! which other forum you on?

I'm on bounty, don't know if we can mention other websites on here.
The SN section on there wasnt as active in the topics/areas that are of interest to me, and mumsnet has far more topics for me to get involved in.

i went on that site a couple of times but struggled to get used to it and also thought the sn board was quiet. thie one is very friendly and is nice i think. i have been on a few autism specific forums as my son is autistic but i found they can be a bit full on as its autism everywhere and i live everyday with autism and my internet time i prefer not to be so full on. here i can read about other things too and i find it so much more user friendly dont you think!

Not an expert by any means. But did forensic psychiatry as part of my first law degree when I was young ie about 12 years ago (). A psychosis has as much to do with depression as shoes with apples. Totally different things happening in the brain. And no that did not happen last year or the year before, and no putting postnatal in front of it does not change it either.

thanks so much thats a great help, any idea how long ago it would have been considered as the same roughly speaking?? well i spoke to the paediatrics manager for the area today and she is going to talk to someone at a meeting on monday about the whole thing. she said it sounds like me and the paediatrician i saw just misunderstood each other?!?!?! i was like no i dont think there is any way of misunderstanding someone telling you that you have caused your childs problems so think again that is no excuse!!! she is getting back to me next week!!!!

can't help with that one sorry. am surprised to see that 'health' websites commonly refer to pn psychosis as a severe form of pn depression! For me the key distinction is that with psychosis there is a losing touch with reality that does not happen in depression.

I used to be a nurse (general and mental health) and depression and psychosis are different conditions with different symptoms, though one can morph into the other (I think you can get psychotic depression as far as I remember). Were you psychotic, e.g. deluded, hallucinating, paranoid thoughts, that sort of thing? Or were you depressed - flat, disinterested in life, etc.? If it's an 'old fashioned term' then why was it put in your notes 3 years ago? Rubbish.

Unfortunately, once something is written in dr's notes, it is there for ever, and often repeatead endlessly. PNP will pop out of the page like a disco light to any medic flicking through. You should definitely try to take this on through the routes others have suggested. A letter of complaint to your GP maybe as well? Do it as calmly and non-psychotically as possible or they will feel vindicated!

Thanks donkeyderby too, i have read all those symptoms etc and even asked my mum what she thinks and a few close friends and all agree definately just normal depression!!! id be less bothered i think if it was on my notes but being as its in bens notes it just makes me so mad as like you say it jumps stright out of a page and surely implies quite easily - useless/incapable mother! waiting for the top person to ring back next week and see what she says. she did say she would like to arrange a meeting with me, a new paediatrician, my little boy and my gp to confirm in their minds that i dont have psychosis by asking my gp about it, im going to try and refuse this i think as surely i am saying its not true they should accept that and it should be up to them to prove it is true as i dont believe in their care for my son it should be their right to assess my mental health, but if i refuse this meeting on this basis i worry it will make me sound psychotic!!! i cant really win can i!!

essentially too it wasnt even post natal deprssion as such, basically to cut a long story short i got deprssed around the time i left my violent partner (bens dad) as he had been very controlling and violent to me and also to ben as a baby but as ben was only 5 months when we left him i think this is why i got put down to post natal depression if that makes sense!! i was just very quiet, sitting staring into space and just doing everything i had to for me and ben but not a great deal more, though i do have plenty of photos i took of ben during tha time too. I felt like a useless mum as i couldnt protect ben from the abuse, and then some of those i feel useless feelings came back as ben started to obviously be "different" but only a little and that was a good year and a half ago at the latest so well before this paediatrician in fact any paed saw him so that wouldnt have even been noted as it was just a little time when i thought this while waiting for the hv to admit he was not "normal" but i think those feelings are the same in most sn kids' parents i guess?!

so donkeyderby definately just depression rather than psychosis you think on that?? i think so but feel free to disagree i wont mind just want to be sure im not argueing a pointless battle that ill loose!

it sounds like you were having a perfectly understandable emotional response to a very stressful situation! definitely complain.

i have requested his notes, hopefgully will get them soon, they said could cost up to £50 so hopefully not that much! the gp has never even spoke to the paed about anything related to me so the paed merely made it up, its just the gp's excuse as to why he wont write me a lettter saying i dont have psychosis!!! lazyness i think!! going to be a long fight i think but i refuse to have this on my sons notes so will battle all the way, just so annoying as it should never have come to this!

If your GP has record of your postnatal period for Ben, he should be able to correct your notes and Ben's too. If you had psychosis, it is unlikely that a GP would look after you without getting a specialist's help, a psychiatrist or a Community Psychiatric Nurse. Medication would also probably include an antipsychotic, not just antidepressant, and they will have record of what they prescribed you.
I would challenge your GP, depressiona and psychosis are nowhere the same, anythime, not now not then either.And put a formal complaint if he is unable to prove that you had psychotic symptoms. Hallucinations and odd beliefs are psychotic symptoms, not feeling hopeless and helpless and guilty, these are just part of depression. If it matters to you, he should correct it or at least give you a better explanation. Can you write formally to the GP surgery manager to ask for a meeting in a view of settling this without using a complaint? Hospitals have a way of dealing with complaints, I guess GP surgeries too, maybe the surgery manager can guide you through that?
Good luck (Er, yeah, I work in this field!)