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Autism and horses and weird mongolian rituals?

26 replies

wannaBe · 02/04/2009 12:27

Have just watched this morning and There was a writer called rupert Isaacson talking about how his son was healed through horses and shaman rituals.

sorry it's the daily mail, but

here

and

here

are extracts from his book.

Now, I'm a fairly broad-minded person. I am totally aware of the impact that animals can have on people, esp those with severe sn, so I have no doubt of the relationship between this child and horses.

I'm also fairly open to alternative therapies, and am fairly sure that they have their place in society and that there is definitely something to be said for using other methods to bring about changes.

But healing in a day? A couple of rituals and suddenly no more incontinence and only a couple more tantrums?

Isn't this all just a bit ... ?

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mrsturnip · 02/04/2009 13:39

Book was fantastic.

I need to write a review.

Original poster
wannaBe · 02/04/2009 13:53

he seemed very genuine, and very definite about not wanting a cure but healing - he was very definite about that.

It was more the rituals etc he talked about that seemed unusual, and the speed at which they appeared to have an effect.

They did show a clip of Rowan having a tantrum and as soon as Rupert put him on the horse he spoke clearly which was remarkable.

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mrsturnip · 02/04/2009 14:01

I'm of the school that if it works and it isn't harming anyone then great. And healing did seem to work for him. I was pleased he made the distinction between cure and healing as well- he does that early in the book. The book really resonated with me tbh - I really really must write the review.

They run a centre now for people with kids with SN to go and ride. They don't charge, just ask people to donate what they can afford.

amber32002 · 02/04/2009 14:10

Animals can have a remarkable effect on us. I've been around horses most of my life in one form or another, as well as cats, dogs etc, and it is very calming. And who's to say that some religious rituals can't have some healing power . Seems to work sometimes.

improvingslowly · 02/04/2009 17:28

excatly if it works and does not harm anyone then that sounds good. shame there arenot a few shamen around here...

5intheEgg · 02/04/2009 17:57

All I could think was, "The child was probably drunk from having all that vodka spat in his face" . Maybe if I got ds2 drunk he would stop tantrumming

Not sure I would go as far as taking my ds2 that far to have that done, but I do agree that animals have a great effect on ASD children/people.

Pixel · 02/04/2009 19:32

I've read a few excerpts from the book and seen some clips and it was all very interesting. I was flipping through the book in Tesco the other day wondering whether or not to buy it and there was a photo with the caption "Rowan can now manage Betsy by himself" and there was this tiny boy bareback on a huge horse with no hat on, charging up a field! I reckon ds would love to do that but I don't think my poor heart could stand it .

amber32002 · 03/04/2009 07:23

No hat!!?! No way! Sensible riding, brilliant. Risking death with no hat on? Not a chance. We do enough of that whilst young anyway thanks to zero sense of danger

mrsturnip · 03/04/2009 14:05

I've finally got round to reviewing the book on my blog

The post below the quick mention for their foundation.

My son made me laugh. I'd been reading the book for a week, he picked it up, flicked to the first picture in the book, then flicked immediately back to the cover. Did this repeatedly laughing. I then realised that the front cover was one picture (the first one) superimposed on a different background. DS1 had spotted it right away, within seconds. I hadn't noticed after a week

electra · 03/04/2009 16:46

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moondog · 03/04/2009 17:37

It is interesting, primarily because the child's mother is a psychologist and academic thus by definition not prone to falling for hocuspocus.

mrsturnip · 03/04/2009 17:56

I don't think they would get that false hope reading the book though electra - he was very clear about it not being a 'cure' - and spent some time early on talking about the difference between cure and healing.

He doesn't suggest that Rowan is cured, let alone any other child.

I would see a calm ds1 as 'healed', however autistic he remained. That's the sort of difference he describes.

magso · 03/04/2009 19:39

Wearing a hat was a huge problem for ds - and most his (ASD riding) classmates. (Ds is very anti hat). The simple rule was no hat no going near horse! The 'hat figit' was almost a hazard to start with. But he eventually got comfy!

Pixel · 03/04/2009 19:48

Yes, ds hates hats but he knows he doesn't ride without a hardhat so he tolerates it. He wants the hat off as soon as he dismounts though!

mrsturnip · 03/04/2009 20:35

DS1 just couldn't wear a hat until he learned to imitate.

Then I think he 'got' the point of things like climbing and horse riding (so he could see someone else do it and want to do it himself). Then we could do the 'no hat no climbing/riding' thing. Until imitation though that didn't work - because I think he had no idea that he was wearing the hat to do the activity, because the activity he was observing had no sense of meaning for him and he had no idea he could do it. I suspect it was just random hat wearing and he didn't understand at all why we were putting this uncomfortable thing on his head.

Weird thing imitation and the world it opens up once you 'get it'.

it took him three trys to be able to keep the hat on his head long enough to go on a climbing wall. But he desperately wanted to do it. Beforehe could imitate he had no desperate want. So no motivation for wearing a hat.

Sassor · 03/04/2009 20:57

In Mongolia they eat a lot of fermented foods which are very effective treatments for our kids' damaged guts. Exercise is also often mentioned as beneficial in many ways for our kids. horse-riding strengthens the back and is good for constipation. Then there's the magic of animals and the claim that I've heard many times that our children can form great relationships with them which can help them. Add in the shamen which I don't understand at all but which is as likely to be beneficial as not and I don't see why it can't be true. Fantastic!!!

electra · 03/04/2009 20:57

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mrsturnip · 03/04/2009 22:56

Oh yes yes quite agree electra. My review mentions that- the byline of the book "miraculous journey to heal" was enough to almost make me not read the book. I'm so pleased I did though, it really had quite a profound effect on me (and not many books have that effect these days).

Good point about the fermented foods sassor! Although I think Rowan was rather self limiting (been there, done that got the t-shirt!) Traditional mogolian foods probably would be really good for many of our kids though.....

mrsturnip · 03/04/2009 22:57

It's probably a bit like Natasha Campbell McBride's diet thinking about it- she has loads of fermented foods in that iirc. Always thought her ideas made lots of sense, although hard to put into practice.

mrsturnip · 03/04/2009 23:01

oh electra- missed your last sentence. Yes, that's true. I think that's a reflection of the breadth of the spectrum. Different children need totally different things, but there can be a tendency to assume that 'all children with autism need X' when in fact different things work for different families at different times.

cyberseraphim · 04/04/2009 08:01

"because the child's mother is a psychologist and academic thus by definition not prone to falling for hocuspocus."

I think I'll have to read that sentence again to get it to make sense but maybe I've met too many Ed Pyschs recently. I heard the author on the radio and he sounds quite nice and genuine. I think the problem is the media spin that 'something can cure autism' . A Friend Like Henry (book on which After Thomas is based and is far better than the film) shows us that although the dog was important, it was really the hard work put in by the parents and grandmother that helped the boy. But 'hard work by parents helps child to speak better' doesn't spin as well as Dog/Horse/Budgie is miracle for autistic child.

cyberseraphim · 04/04/2009 08:09

Although Mongolia is a bit out of reach for most, I have found that new experiences bring out more language in DS1 so although it depends on the form of autism, I don't agree with advice to keep the child in a routine for comfort because the comfort zone does not always challenge the child enough.

moondog · 04/04/2009 16:48

Cyber, mum is a clin. psych. I think not an Ed Psych. They certainly don't say their boy is cured, just that he adapts better to the demands of everyday life.

Your point about routine is a good one and I agree.The challenge is to be creative within a loose structure.It can be done.It is in essence what we all thrive best in.

cyberseraphim · 04/04/2009 17:30

Did not mean it seriously - DH is an academic and I am a semi 'given up' one.

Original poster
wannaBe · 05/04/2009 20:04

iirc he said that his wife (the mother) was against the idea but went along with it because he felt so strongly about it.

agree re the this morning spin on things which is probably why I thought it sounded so . And in ten minutes you just cannot get across the whole concept of autism, so programmes like this morning tend to focus on such a small part that the public who have little to no understanding don't gain anything from it other than to perhaps be led into believing that horses can cure autism, any autism. And one can perhaps already hear the cries from well-meaning people saying to parent of newly diagnosed child, of "well, there's this bloke in America who can cure your child by putting him/her on horseback."

Fern did say more than once that Rowan had been "cured" and rupert was very definite that he was not cured, that Autism was an will always be a part of who Rowan is, but I wonder how much of that the typical this morning viewer will have taken in.

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