DS has bitten someone at school!

[Novacane]

Just had a phonecall from his TA to say my DS (5 in April09) has just bitten a little girl quite badly on her back.

Now, my DS has just had a deferred decision on ASD till Oct (definately has a significant language impairment).

When he started school he struggled settling in, kicking, pulling hair etc, but although sometimes unprovoked, we realised he was 'storing up' things that kids did, and reacting later, apparently unprovoked.
However, he has improved recently, and apparently where this happened (carpet time) he is usually quite reliably good.

Today he has done this completely unprovoked with his TA stood right next to him.

I am bloody devastated, ra ra ra, usual crap feelings and rollercoaster ride that we all go through, but how do I deal with this now?

Apparently he said sorry, and they did all the disciplining things, but they are not sure he understands....what do I do at home? How can I follow it up if he doesn't understand? can I take his computer off him etc

I am bloody lost at what to do. And now I have to go face her bloody Mother at the school gates. I NEED A DRINK. (or a diazepam lol)

Sorry for self indulgant post, I'm new to this SN malarky, and not quite in the position to advise too much yet!!

xx

Hi Novacane. What seems unprovoked to others may not be to us, alas. If we're not well, or have had a bad set of experiences leading up to circle time, or if we're facing a lot of eye contact in circle time, it can be more painful for us than being punched in the face, and young children can suddenly lash out at someone near them. He definitely needs to understand that it's wrong, and they need to help him to take out his frustrations in safe ways/bite on something that definitely isn't another child. Expert advice from local autism charity people might be an idea, even without a firm DX??

There's no point taking compter off him at home- at least there wouldn't be with my ASD 5 year old tbh. Too delayed a response, iyswim. Besides I don't know how attacjed your ds is to the PC, for ds3 it's a lifeline and he would sob for several hours.

You might find its triggered in some way you will disover- going down with a bug often does that ime- but you might never know. Somewhere deep down there will be a trigger though.

I use a twofold appraoch:

1. work on the behaviour using eg social stories, amalysing triggers etc

1. work on the results of the behaviour- I usually make ds1 hand over a sorry card. It has no effect on ds1 but goodness does it make the Mum and the child feel better! Almost subversive but heck it works!

Totally agree with Amber, even the anticipation of being touched, someone looking at them, can be enough and quite threatening to a ASD child.

Obviously you cant ignore him biting someone, try to see things through his eyes. Sounds like the school have dealt with it, it happened at school, let it stay at school.

Just picked him up and heard the teacher saying 'you can take it further if you want to' so decided to take the bull by the horns and talk to the mum with the SENCO etc.

Gosh it was hard trying to defend him, and she was totally uninterested in why, which if I was in her position I would feel the same I suppose. I blubbed all the way through which i'm sure made things better (not).

I tried to put the idea of a trigger/sensory cause etc, the school do know he does delayed reacting to things, but the sensory thing I will mention again.

The Mum said her Husband will be fuming and she can't say how he will react. I can just imagine their conversation mover tea 'shouldnt them kids be in a special school away from our kids' which devastates me.

I've just about had it. I'm really struggling coming to terms with all this in the first place, DP wants to blamew the whole world for it, and now is saying wwe need to go private to see if we can get any further with a dx etc.

I just wanted him to make the right stmpathetic noises instead of being so angry about everything for once.

sorry for typos, can't see for blubbing.

(((((virtual hugs)))))) and a cuppa.

Yes, private DX is one way to get some answers, though many schools take no notice of them (grr)

Hi Novacane

God you 've had a pretty shit day. Any consolation we went through this with dS2 whilst he was in nursery. At that time he was undiagnosed with asd. He kicked, bit and used to destroy other children's games. I think like your DS he bottled things up and didn't have the communication skills to vent appropriately. He, I expect, found it noisy and stressful at times as well. The nursery staff were supportive and they encouraged him to apologise, etc. As his mother I felt crap, embarrassed, etc and used to dread what would be written in his little homework book. This went on until P1 (aged 4 - 5), P2 (only on occasion). It's a tricky situation at the moment but things have definitely become easier for us as he has matured, social stories helped and is now in a much smaller class.

I think it was naughty of SENCO to put you in a room with the Mum tbh- bad handling.

Have been in this situation many times with ds1, and tbh 'The Mum said her Husband will be fuming and she can't say how he will react.' would have been met with me in their face asking 'Is that a threat?'.

How their H reacts is totally irrelevant to you, should they try to talk to you again direct them to the Head and or SENCO. Do NOT discuss anywhere else; I say this because I was verbally assaulted by someone's DH and to this day regret approaching police about his threatening behaviour.

(And yes whilst a private DX will give you peace of mind and mabe even paperwork an NHS Paed will use- ours did- it doesn't hold any weight with LEA etc.

Hiya chaps, thanks for your advice and understanding, I've calmed down a bit now.

Amber, thanks for the insight, its something to think about.

Peachy, we have spoken to him at length tonight, we said her name and asked what he had done and he said 'bit', so I think he does know what we are talking about, we have explained it has made us sad etc etc. I was the one who barged into the room i'm afraid so can't blame the SENCO, I can't stand people talking behind my back, I would prefer it to be out in the open, even though it's not very nice. I didn't have the strength to fight back though really, i'm feeling a bit weary atm. Sorry you've been through the same it's awful. Really awful.

My Friend did text me later to ask if I was OK (I was stood in the queue with her).

Helensmelons, yes a rough day indeed! It nice to know in a way i'm not alone, cos I feel very very alone atm! I don't want to take him to school tomorrow, I feel like I am making him go there and he just can't cope with it. He has started crying and carrying on in a morning, not wanting to go.

Tonight he has been very withdrawn and totally in his own little world, ,repeating snippets of the day. Infact he has been repeating 'good afternoon children' which is when said biting incedent occoured. Haven't had any meaningful interaction with him, and he was wild in sainsbury's, jigging and dancing, iykwim. He's in his bedroom now playing with trains on his bed very vocally.

I on the other hand have treated myself to a taste the difference sauvingnon blanc, which I am going to drink ALL of, and flop into bed- hopefully then I won't have that irritating thinking period before my slumber.
That's if DS ever goes to sleep! I'm dreading tomorrow because i've got someone coming to lay some lino in the bathroom at 8am..just when we all need to use it lol.

I can't offer any advice or be of any use but I am sorry you've had a crap day. I hope you've poured yourself a glass of something by now.

What a hard day for both you and your ds. When my ds2 was in a NT nursery, he was actually bitten by a NT child and his mother wasnt bothered in the slightest! So for you to actually apologise to the woman face to face was really fantastic. Not many NT parents will apologise for their childrens behaviour, so well done!

Hope the wine is going down well I had a bottle to end my crapola day yesterday, but didnt help with the sleep.

Well if shared stress makes you feel better apaprenlty ds3 hurt someone today. gawd only knows who or why though, he can't tell me (language too poor) and 1-1 told me had a great day!

AAArrrrrgghhhhhh

Novacane - Just to say i hope you have a better day today, albeit with a hangover and no bathroom

lol claw- Ive just kicked the boys out (DP taking DS to school) and lino man is doing his stuff in the bathroom lol. DP had a wash in the kitchen sink and no doubt they are both busting for the loo. I, on the other hand, was v sensible and had a wee before he got here.

Hoping for a better day today, yes. We have reaffirmed that he has to be a good boy at school etc, but I'm not so sure that was it. He was completely wired last night, worse than I have seen him for ages. He was completely closed down and you couldn't even 'get in to him' IYSWIM. He doesn't want to go to school today, he has been like this all week. Hmm interesting stuff.

5inthebad, I don't know about being fantastic, it was just because I'm completely crackers when it comes to me thinking that someone is talking about me. I HAVE to confront everytime, or else the anxiety just eats me up. Not ideal sometimes I tell you that.
I wasn't having her thinking that he was just a bad lad, a bully etc, when there is so much more to it. She didn't give a shit though, all she said was 'well I think I'd be more annoyed if he knew what he was doing' I was livid, embarrassed, helpless, and whenever I get strong feelings I blub lol. I'm well known everywhere for crying, my work are used to it now, they understand its my release mechanism!

Novacane - More importantly did you get to finish your wine

This is a quote from some research i read about children with sensory difficulties, i thought it really helped me to see things through the eyes of the child. (hope you dont mind me quoting to you)

"Daily life is a struggle for children with sensory issues. Imagine driving a car that isn't working well. When you step on the gas the car sometimes lurches forward and sometimes doesn't respond. When you blow the horn it sounds blaring. The brakes sometimes slow the car, but not always. The blinkers work occasionally, the steering is erratic, and the speedometer is inaccurate. You are engaged in a constant struggle to keep the car on the road, and it is difficult to concentrate on anything else."

Oh and i have another quote which describes how a child in the classroom might feel. Let me know if this might be helpful in getting teachers to accept, understand and stop being so bloody judgemental.

Dont want to keep throwing quotes at you

Claw3, it's a bit like that sometimes, yes. But it's also like you're driving along minding your own business when the radio comes on at full volume on every station all at once and you can't switch it off, and someone's put itching powder and tin tacks on the seat and you can't stop to sort it out, and you're stuck behind a lorry with huge flashing lights right in front of you that are absolutely blinding, and the car fills with choking smells of smoke...and you're supposed to be able to drive perfectly in all conditions like this, always, when what you actually want to do is get out and say "Arrrghhh! Stop it! Just make it stop! "

Brilliant description Amber. Ive really been trying to see things through the eyes of my ds when things go wrong for him.

Ds started school in Jan, he doesnt have an official dx, so school basically had no info on him, other than a phone call from the OT and they were not very understanding. He hated going to school every day.

The teacher recently pulled me to one side to have a 'word' with me. She told me ds had told another boy during lunchtime, that he was going to get his older brother to beat him up, although she didnt know what had happened beforehand. She told me this was unacceptable and the school did not tolerate threats etc, etc.

My reply what did the other boy do, to make ds feel like he needed defending!!

Ooo, another thing about driving that car...people keep diverting us down roads we've never seen before, completely unexpectedly. We think we're going to Birmingham, but it turns out that this road only lead to Bristol today and tomorrow it'll be Liverpool. And at the roundabouts, it changes from minute to minute so you can't tell which way to turn or who has priority. If only there were clear signs to say which way is which. Apparently everyone else can adapt to everything changing instantly. We can't. We need to see the sign, then signal, then manoever.

Ooo and you forget you have to keep stopping the car because the motion makes you sick.

We will have to write a Sensory highway code

Would just like to say, that the very same boy we are talking about is sat next to me on the sofa, watching thomas (we can't have everything lol). we are both under a duvet, he has just asked for a cushion, and gone and got one when told to, and got his PJ's out of his top drawer when instructed. I feel 'connected' with him, he isnt going scatty, not repeating anything, calm, he is on my level IYSWIM.

Today we havent done a lot, he has been into town with Dad, as I'm not very well ATM, they got a computer game and a couple of books (yes he is spoilt), and we have been playing on the computer, lazing about since 2pm ish.

hmmm just rambling thoughts.

Watching Thomas whilst under a duvet is absolute heaven to nearly everyone with an ASD. Thomas characters have really clear expressions and are all different so it's easy to tell them apart, and the duvet acts as a giant pressure-comforter for us.

Wonderful.

Classrooms, by comparison, are hell on earth.