Please - any advice or even kind words? Feel like the crappest mum ever

[MrsMattie]

Sat here in tears and don't know who else to turn to, as DH is away at the moment.

I've posted on MN before about my 3.11 yr old DS (wanted to link to an old thread but can't find it). He's very bright and amazingly verbal, very big for his age, can be the loveliest, sweetest boy, but since day dot has been a complete handful much of the time. He stands out like a sore thumb in a group of children - noisy, out of control, very rough (sometimes unintentional, sometimes not), prone to being aggressive, extremely bossy and inflexible, a whirlwind....the list goes on. We have battled on with every day life with him, doing normal things - nursery, playdates, toddler classes etc and explained away his behaviour to ourselves as over exuberance / his size / a thousand different explanations, but it has come to a head lately. We seem to not be able to lead a 'normal' daily life anymore as DS's behaviour is just too unruly and hard to deal with. i hate to say it about my own lovely boy, but he just comes across as an angry, rude brat a lot of the time

I am seeing his (lovely) nursery teacher on Monday and I am going to ask her straight whether she thinks there is something else going on with my DS. I have been so reluctant to label him I have refused to believe that eh could have some sort of special needs, but it is becoming increasingly obvious that he has. The kind of strategies that work with other children have no effect on DS. it's like he doesn't hear / it doesn't sink in. He is incredibly focused on what he wants to do and that is that. he is pretty much unable to empathise and doesn't much care about what others think.

I am, very worried about what the future holds. I am exhausted with my DS's tantrums. We can't go anywhere anymore - he is just too wild . The final straw came today when I was told buy the teacher at the one toddler class he still goes to that other parents are complaining about his aggressive behaviour and are threatening to leave. I could just sob my heart out, honestly. I just feel like we are increasingly isolated because of my DS's behaviour. In fact i have to stop now as I am crying

Mrsmattie

what i always do before meeting when i know theres a chance i am going get upset or annoyed more of the latter now a days is write a list of my concerns or questions before hand givess me ssomething to focus n lol swear paed now groans when see me paper in hand think A4 ,might help if you think going to get upset

Thanks Aefondkiss &v Phoenix4725 x

I've just thought of another characteristic of my son - my mum actually pointed it out to em this morning. He has a real wish/need to dominate other children. He doesn't seem to empathise with them at all, either. Does this ring bells with anyone? I have no idea where it comes from or what it means.

Sorry you are having such a rubbish time at the moment. Hope you and him get the help you need.

mrs mattie, sorry you are struggling a bit at the moment - but there will be nice bits along the way in your journey, and they will be all the nicer.

Yes, i can deffinately agree with the statement you made just a little above, DS1 is ADHD, and HAS ALWAYS needed to feel in control of EVERYTHING, has NEVER really felt empathy for anyone, and is very controlling. HOWEVER - he is now 16yrs and has been taught (and has learned too!!!) to try and see clues as to how someone else is feeling about his actions, ie. toddler making loud wailing noise means hes not enjoying the game, baby crying means stop what you are doing and hug gently, child shouting and stomping means he feels angry about the situation. This has taken a lot of teaching, but it can be done, without the use of facial expressions which DS1 is completely useless with. The trick was to get him to play detective and try and guess why the other person wasnt smiling. Of course the hardest thing was to get him to stop and realise in the first place!

He has always been a 'control freak' since as early as i can remember, he was amazingly controlling as a preschooler in nursery! he would get kids to do his painting while he went to play outside ! I didnt know much back then, but when i look back i see just how many ASD traits he had: tactile defensive (clothes mainly), food preferences, the need for sameness and routine, the need to know EXACTLY what was going to happen and when (down to the minute!) - in this last regard hes still as needy, but now he can tolerate foods, jeans, and occasional change to routine so long as hes told in advance. But TBH hes still as controling and has to be the master of all games (yes he plays like a 10yr old, hes still quite 'young') and has to make sure he wins.

Now ive painted a horrid picture can i tell you the best bits? hes actually a lovely person to be with (most of the time!) hes got a good sense of humour thats developing well, he wants to please. and although hes very anxious with new stuff, hes more capable than he thinks he is and just needs a bit of reassurance that he can do it. He can hoover and do a quick tidy round for me, he even goes to p/t college and can get the bus home! something i never thought would happen!

After giving it much thought, i rather think the dominence thing is to make sure that nothing unexpected happens, cos thats just really scary! HTH XXX

Hi MrsM. Sorry to have missed this yesterday. Wanted to add my support to all the other regulars here.

Re: who to see - as others have said, it depends on how things are done locally. But you will find that an indication of whether you have got to the right person is how many people you see: You may see a community paed and be fobbed off with "wait and see". Or you may see a developmental paed, who will make a proper diagnosis, refer you to a SALT (speech and language therapist) put you down for Portage (home play therapy for pre-nursery) and contact the LEA Ed Psych (educational psychologist who assesses what additional support the child needs in nursery and school). Then you will know you are getting somewhere.

It sounds to me as if your son's behaviour is different enough that a diagnosis is a reasonable expectation, so I'd be going to the GP and asking for a referral to whoever locally could make that diagnosis. Make a note of all the behaviours you have mentioned, and how they differ in kind from similar things other kids do - it's easy to get into a GP appointment, start talking about the first one on the list, get overridden by the GP telling you that behaviour is normal (and on its own and once in a while it may be) and find yourself out of the door, but knowing that they haven't understood the problem because they didn't listen to most of it.

One of the huge huge advantages of getting a diagnosis (and you must stop thinking of it as a "label" - a diagnosis is the key to getting him therapy and support) is that you can then tap into support groups for that particular condition who will know how to fight for the support he needs locally. It will be a fight, I'm afraid, but your chances of winning are much improved when you hook up with people who have fought it before and know the rules.

And keep posting here, if only to let off steam. You are not alone. We have been there, and done that. We didn't like the t-shirt much either.

Thank you misscutandstick. On a previous thread about my son ADHD was mentioned a lot by other MN-ers. This (along with Dyspraxia) are always at the back of my mind. I am just so petrified of him being labelled a problem child and unsure as to what a diagnosis like this would mean for him?

Your boy sounds lovely, btw

MrsM - it tends to be the other way round = that kids without a DX are more likely to be seen as naughty/in need of stricter parenting, whereas with a DX, there is more of an explanation for any difficult behaviour and kids are less likely to be seen as naughty.

There were some years when i really didnt like him TBQH he was hard work and just horrid (irritating, loud, demanding, in-yer-faceness, impulsive to fatality at points!) But i like him now - thats not to say i didnt love him, i always did, but it was very hard to like him.

I agree that 'labelling' is a worry, but its not the actual label thats needed (so a name isnt that important IMO) its the acceptance that your DC needs a little help and understanding. And you only get that when 'proffesionals' start the road to 'labelling', unfortunately until that point us mums just get a label: hypochodriac! its hard work as others have said, but its worth it. It took us 6yrs to get a label, and by that time i had taken DS1 out of school to home-ed him - but that was many years ago and im sure things have improved since then.

WARNING: I WAS WONDERING WETHER OR NOT TO PUT IN THIS COMMENT, AS I DIDNT WANT TO OFFEND, BUT I BELIEVE ULTIMATELY THAT THIS IS WHAT MRSMATTIE IS WORRIED ABOUT SO IVE LEFT IT IN.

Of course the worry with the label ADHD, is that many lay-people just assume its an excuse for 'naughty boy whose parents dont try', but then children who are ASD have parents who are accused of not giving them love and attention. But that really is their problem, not yours - you have enough to worry about and enough work on your hands without trying to change a nation! Unfortunately it is a situation you cant win on both sides. You have to do whats right for your DC and fight for a label - which will get him the help he needs.

Others have probably already mentioned but, you need to see a paediatrician or developmental paediatriacian, which a GP or HV can refer you to, and dont take 'no' for an answer! good luck, take the bull by the horns and make the appt for the GP today.

This forum is brill and we will all be here for you every step of the way.XXX

Your boy sounds very much like my ds at that age. He was diagnosed with ASD age 4 and although I didnt want him labelled it was the best thing that could have happened because it meant he got the support he needed when he started school. Dont be afraid to ask the nursery for help because even if they dont know what to do they'll be able to access help for him. The best source i have always found is from other Mums who are in the same boat. They are the only people who understand what its like. There is an upside though, kids like yours and mine can be the most special little beings and its not all tears we have a lot of laughs too. Take care x

Thanks TotalChaos. I guess you're right. I just thought he would grow out of this, that it was a phase, and now that it seems it is just the way he is, I am having to readjust

r3dh3d - thansk for your post. It's so helpful to have others who know about all of this to talk to . My GP is lovely in some ways (very friendly and thinks DS is a 'little cracker') but is very much the sort of person to brush things off. DS has had a persistent cough for months and I was worried he may be asthmatic or have an allergy or somethin, so have seen her a few times recently. I think she thinks I am a hypochondriac! At the last appointment she cut me off mid spiel about his symptoms and told me he was absolutely fine and to stop worrying , then ushered me out with concerned smile on her face (concern for me and my PFB!>

How can I get them to take it seriously? I think I am definitely going to have to write down some key points so I don't get ushered out again

Thank you so much all of you

whether there is some form of SN or not (he may just be very quirky and energetic), kids mature, and things do improve - particularly if you have a particular SN to read around, there's lots of useful self-help type books around there to help you tackle problem behaviour. It's really not hopeless.

If you say that nursery are concerned then that should help the GP realise you're not being neruotic. Or can you see another GP?

Webstersmum - it is already such a relief to find other mums with children who sound like my boy. This SN section is a revelation for me!

misscutandstick - I already feel labelled as a 'bad mum' to be honest . I get such looks from people, honestly. It would be a huge relief to get some help with him - I have only really admitted this to myself this week.

I agree with you as well TC, its a very difficult subject.

If you do get a diagnosis of ADHD, you could just tell people that it is ASD, which is a more easily accepted term, and is in essence totally truthful.

sorry, im not sure that helps at all.

For me too! Have only just discovered it and wish i had known about it back then - DS is 9 now. I've been there with the bad Mum thing too and it's so heartbreaking, have lost count of the number of times I have left the supermarket, doctors, hairdressers (long list) in tears. One support worker I had gave me little business cards to hand out explaiing that my ds had ASD & his behaviour was not a result of poor parenting. Did he really think I was going to make it into a sideshow for everyone to stand round & watch??? Exit tearful Mummy again! Think you should try your GP though or can you see another Gp in practice as some are more clued up than others. And get help for yourself too as it's a bit like a grief reaction realising or actually admitting that something's not quite right.
sending you big hugs x

sorry just re-read post re GP, 2 options: ask HV for refferal instead, insist on GP referal as you 'want to be reasurred that hes fine by a childrens specialist, thankyou'.

Incidentally, you are neither a hypochondriac nor a useles mum, you live with this child and love him - you know something isnt quite right.

I think it is particularly hard at 3 or 4 (if sn or unusual development affect social behaviour)- everyone espects challenges with 2 year olds and most are sympathetic. If you have an older child (mine is 9) behaving unusually or like a 2 year old it is much more obvious that the child has sn. If a 3 year old behaves likea 2 year old (or a stroppy teenager) it can just look like a bad day- and people can be judgmental. I think it is easier for parents (and children) once the child has a diagnosis - I know I feel far less sensitive and prone to self doubt. (Hugs)

i'm so sorry your feeling this way best thing for you to do is speak to hv with concerns who in turn would get someone to speak to pre school about there concerns

my ds had no danger awareness no appropriate play etc and to be dx at 3 was a blessing as he now has 1;1 at pre school and has helped loads with his behavior

i fiond setting rules before leaving house such as if you dont hold my hand or listen to mummy we are going home and i do go home he can miss pre school if he wants i cant handle him running in roads throwing himself on floor etc

but i still take pushchair with me i give him the choice walk or pushchair and he holds my hand at all times as if i leave him not holding my hand he doesnt pay attention he steers towards the road as following lines or something else

shopping he is in buggy or stand son side of trolley as trying to get him in he freaks out badly

to be honest a label would explain and open doors for him in regards to getting the help he needs to progress as others do even if it means no real dx but behaviorally needing more attention he may get help 1;1

my ds has specialist pre school teacher every 3 weeks and 1;1 for 1 half hours a day and absolutely a different boy now to when he started and this wouldn't have happened if i hadn't seeked the help he would still be struggling sometimes bad behavior isn't them meaning to be bad they don't understand the world and need help to function in it even nt children need help at times with this

i went to my gp with my fears first who then put me forward for referral and was brilliant good luck
could you get buggy board until he can grasp danger then he is where you can see him and panic over

i tried wrist strap and found my ds would just freak out completely so holding my hand is only option but still have to have the chair as he'll decide he don't want to walk anymore and wont move and i never know when this may happen so have to be prepared

you sound like your doing great though so don't think its anything you've done your doing a good job remember that xx

good luck Mrs Mattie.

How are things Mrs Mattie?

Hope things are going better today.
I was thinking back to when ds was 3 -4 and would not hold my hand. Eventually he would hold my sleeve or the pushchair and with the benefit of hindsight I think he may have had trouble with touching me as well as being in control. He used to cry and wiggle free as if it hurt him. Wrist straps were even worse it was like it was made of acid!! If he let go of my sleeve I grabbed his hood ( he was and still is a runner). At vital moments I held his sleeve or shoulder. I think he may also have trouble with fatigue from holding too tight even now.

Hi all.

Things are OK, thanks. DH is back from being away on business and we had a good, long chat about DS last night. he is coming with me to the nursery meeting on Monday, which is good. We're going to make a lost tonight of all the behaviours we are a bit worried about and see what the nursery think. I have also made an appointment with my Gp for Tuesday.

I had a long chat with my mum about all this on the phone yesterday (she looks after DS a couple of afternoons a week and they are extremely close - he is her PFB grandchild ). She has been worried about him for a while, to be honest, and thinks that getting some help for him now - in tiem for him starting school in September - can only be beneficial. Probably right.

So...will keep you updated next week! thanks to everyone on this thread. Every single one of you have been extremely helpful.

xxx

p.s. magso - I laughed reading your description of your Ds at this age. I also have to grab on to DS's hood on occasion! I'm sure people think I am a cruel mother, dragging my son back by the scruff of his neck .

make a list, not 'lost'.

Hi MrsM,
I am glad you have made your way to this board, I have read some of your threads before but didn't want to dive in talking rubbish at you (different situation for us). They are a knowledgable lot, and I have learned a great deal about ALL SN from them, so I'm glad you are getting support from them. xx

Hi all. A quick update.

We had the meeting with DS's nursery teacher this morning. She was really lovely - talked us through a big folder of his drawings and photos of what he's been up to at nursery with captions he'd done himself. She was incredibly upbeat about him and said he is a lovely little boy, funny and bright and full of energy etc. It was so nice to have someone talk so positively about him, and she obviously knows him very well from the (extremely perceptive) things she said about him.

However, she agreed that it is worth getting the SENCo out to observe him. She says his 'emotions haven't caught up with his brain yet', and that although he is 'exceptionally able, academically' (she actually used the phrase 'scarily so' and then backed off and said 'Sorry, I don't mean 'scary'- but he is light years ahead of every child in this nursery - you do know that, don't you?')', he struggles in social situations and alienates his peers with his aggressive, domineering behaviour. She also questioned whether or not he is very sensitive to noise / other stimuli (?), as he throws himself on the floor, or closes his eyes / covers his ears when the nursery gets very busy / noisy.

We talked for 45 mins about what he is like at home and in different social situations, and she told us loads about what he is like at nursery. She agreed 100% that we don't want to rush to label him with a 'condition', but at the same time, we don't want him labelled 'naughty', as she said 'there is definitely something else going on there...he isn't 'just' a badly behaved child..,he is struggling to cope with the social side of nursery life'. She is speaking to the SENCo today and will update us tomorrow and where to go from there.

She also thought it was a good idea to talk to our GP /HV, and wants to be filled in what happens there.

I feel relieved, to be honest. She was so nice about it - understanding, not over dramatising the situation, but acknowledging that I am not going mad or a 'bad' parent and that DS does probably need a bit of extra help.

So, just got to wait and see what SENCo and doc say. At least we've got the ball rolling.